# Vanity sizing for men. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 22, 2012, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497 "2012-09-22T14:49:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/1 "2012-09-22T14:49:01Z")
I wear a size 29 waist pants (30 leg). Yesterday I ordered a custom made suit on-line from a web site recommended here ([makeyourownjeans.com](http://makeyourownjeans.com), thrilled to know about it as it is hard to find clothes cut right for someone as short legged yet wide shouldered and normal trunk length as me) and measuring for the suit my waist was 33 1/2 inches. I’ve long known that women’s clothes sizes were fictitious vanity numbers but how long have I been living in a delusion as well? In short the GQ question is what is the straight dope on men’s clothing sizes? ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/2 "2012-09-22T16:35:19Z")
I don’t know if they’re as fictional as women’s clothing, but there’s definitely a disconnect between the numbers and reality. I spent the summer after my senior year of high school working in a place that did some clothing certifications, and the ranges we were given for waists of a certain measurement did not include that measurement. The inseams tended to be a little closer, but not by much. ---
**Author:** ![EllyaX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/85f322/32.png) [@EllyaX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllyaX)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/3 "2012-09-22T16:45:55Z")
Yes vanity sizing for men is just as ridiculous as it is for women. Here’s a chart of some common men’s brands showing how much the sizing varies: [http://i.imgur.com/yL8Mn.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/yL8Mn.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Emtar\_KronJonDerSohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/58956e/32.png) [@Emtar\_KronJonDerSohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emtar_KronJonDerSohn)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/4 "2012-09-22T17:28:38Z")
I have a hard time finding jeans that fit. I’m somewhere between a 38-42 waist and 34-38 inseam depending on the brand and cut. Rather than going to a dozen stores and trying on pants only to find they only have my length in skinny waisted beapole nuthuggers or they only have my waist in squatty little bowling-ball-man lengths I typically just order 25-30 pairs online and keep the 4 or 5 that fit best and return the others. Vanity (or at least inconsistent) sizing is alive and well. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/5 "2012-09-22T18:50:47Z")
I’ll let you know how [makeyourownjeans](http://www.makeyourownjeans.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1) does on my suit. If I was able to measure accurately enough for them to get that a better than store tailored fit then using them for jeans seems like a safe bet. Pretty reasonable pricing - most jeans in the 50s and my suit, pure wool, for about 300. I was actually excited shopping visiting my son in Japan - the Japanese are built like me! Clothes off the rack (at UniQlo) that fit! (A little snug across the chest and shoulders but otherwise … it was amazing. And I am not a clothes person or a shopper.) Ellya, thank you for that graphic. So it is also very brand variable? Although the same fictitious size fits me across the waist pretty similarly in most brands, if they carry it. It’s just that the legs are way long and the cut at the waist/crotch is for someone several inches taller than me. Have they always sized like this or has it changed over the years? ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/6 "2012-09-22T22:39:02Z")
> [@EllyaX](#): > > Yes vanity sizing for men is just as ridiculous as it is for women. Here’s a chart of some common men’s brands showing how much the sizing varies: [Imgur: The magic of the Internet](http://i.imgur.com/yL8Mn.jpg) I can see that being true for the more, er… healthy, husky sizes, but at the other end of the scale they are fairly accurate. That is my experience with waist sizes at least. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/7 "2012-09-22T23:15:32Z")
Have you tape measured your waist (just below belly button)? Again, I wear a size 29. Most places don’t even carry that small and size 30 is definitely a bit too loose. But my real waist circumference is 4 inches bigger. ---
**Author:** ![sniffo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e56c9b/32.png) [@sniffo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sniffo)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2012, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/8 "2012-09-22T23:30:07Z")
GAP clothes flatter me with small seeming trouser sizes that contradict the increasingly rotund picture I see in the mirror. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/9 "2012-09-23T03:07:14Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Have you tape measured your waist (just below belly button)? Again, I wear a size 29. Most places don’t even carry that small and size 30 is definitely a bit too loose. But my real waist circumference is 4 inches bigger. I am just shy of 30 in the waist and mostly wear a size 30 with an occasional 29 and a rare 28. FWIW, most of my pants are from Levi’s, Ralph Lauren, Dockers, or Land’s End. Are you sure that you are measuring right? I cannot believe that your clothing is that far off. ---
**Author:** ![GameHat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ed655f/32.png) [@GameHat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GameHat)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/10 "2012-09-23T07:33:03Z")
A big part of of the disconnect on men’s sizes is jeans. No, seriously, hear me out. Jean styles have moved, over the last 25 years, to where jeans are worn below the waist, with the button fastening well below. I’m OK with this. But at the same time - for the classier pants (slacks, suit pants, hell, even khakis) the measurement hasn’t moved. The “waist” measurement is still on the older measurement scale. Meaning “waist” means the circumference around your torso, over the navel. For me, when I’m buying dress pants it’s an automatic +2 inches on the waist. Now that I understand this, I’m much better at buying clothes. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/11 "2012-09-23T12:35:59Z")
> [@GameHat](#): > > But at the same time - for the classier pants (slacks, suit pants, hell, even khakis) the measurement hasn’t moved. The “waist” measurement is still on the older measurement scale. Meaning “waist” means the circumference around your torso, over the navel. So, you are saying that not only are men’s clothes not vanity sized, they are in fact smaller than they should be? What would that be… modesty sizing? ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/12 "2012-09-23T12:45:40Z")
The OP as it stands is not specific to clothing, so: sizes in condoms (large, colossal, superhumongous) are quite silly. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/13 "2012-09-23T14:11:14Z")
> [@JKilez](#): > > Are you sure that you are measuring right? I cannot believe that your clothing is that far off. Yup. Did it again. Just below the belly button. Not pulled tight. 33. Maybe you are measuring right over the hip bone, the narrowest spot? > [@GameHat](#): > > A big part of of the disconnect on men’s sizes is jeans. No, seriously, hear me out. > > Jean styles have moved, over the last 25 years, to where jeans are worn below the waist, with the button fastening well below. I’m OK with this. > > But at the same time - for the classier pants (slacks, suit pants, hell, even khakis) the measurement hasn’t moved. The “waist” measurement is still on the older measurement scale. Meaning “waist” means the circumference around your torso, over the navel. A reasonable point although truth be told all my pants are worn lower than true waist circumference, i.e. not along or just below the navel. Taking out the measuring tape that lower point gets me to about 31.5. Still 2.5 inches more what I need to buy on the label to fit right. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/14 "2012-09-23T14:28:59Z")
Can you put the buttonhole on your jeans over the button while wearing them without pulling them together? If you have to pull them together you’re probably squashing yourself into them, to some extent. I wonder if it’s different here (the UK) anyway. I don’t know where you’re all from, but a couple of times I’ve ordered a top from the US and found that the American size “medium” was huge compared to what I was expecting. I had a similar experience ordering food in Canada. 😃 The one time I’ve actually been measured for a suit, my waist measurement was exactly the same as my jeans size. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/15 "2012-09-23T16:32:06Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Yup. Did it again. Just below the belly button. Not pulled tight. 33. Maybe you are measuring right over the hip bone, the narrowest spot? Yes, that is where you traditionally measure your waist. > [@DSeid](#): > > A reasonable point although truth be told all my pants are worn lower than true waist circumference, i.e. not along or just below the navel. Taking out the measuring tape that lower point gets me to about 31.5. Still 2.5 inches more what I need to buy on the label to fit right. I think you are on to it here. The “waist” measurement on pants is the measurement of _your_ waist, not the actual measurement of the pants. Since they are normally worn lower on the hips, the pants waist needs to be a little larger. ---
**Author:** ![Kiyoshi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e19adc/32.png) [@Kiyoshi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiyoshi)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/16 "2012-09-23T16:36:43Z")
Hang on – your waist is supposed to be around your **belly button**?! So Simon Cowell had it right all along? My waistband is a good 4 inches below my belly button, and I don’t exactly walk around all gangsta-stylee. In fact, I can’t take my pants much higher without wedgie-ing myself and showing my socks like Michael Jackson. I wear a 34" waist. After checking with a tape measure, I’m 34" around my belly button, and 38" where my waistband rests. So I guess pants sizes refer to a waist that they don’t even reach nowadays… :s ---
**Author:** ![Kiyoshi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e19adc/32.png) [@Kiyoshi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiyoshi)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/17 "2012-09-23T16:38:21Z")
Oh, looks like I was overtaken by **JKilez** in the time it took me to measure myself! ---
**Author:** ![Max\_the\_Immortal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Max\_the\_Immortal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_the_Immortal)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2012, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/18 "2012-09-24T02:50:42Z")
Is it just me, or is there vanity sizing for shoes? My shoes have “gone up” by a size or two since I reached the age when I assume they’d stopped growing. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2012, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanity-sizing-for-men/635497/19 "2012-09-24T10:33:36Z")
> [@Max\_the\_Immortal](#): > > Is it just me, or is there vanity sizing for shoes? My shoes have “gone up” by a size or two since I reached the age when I assume they’d stopped growing. Have you put on weight? I lost over a shoe size when I lost a lot of weight. As far as waists go, maybe it’s different with men, but I know that the belly button is a damn poor reference point on women.