# various "succession" questions regarding the election **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 4, 2016, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642 "2016-10-04T17:42:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![GVI-Wizard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/eb8c5e/32.png) [@GVI-Wizard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GVI-Wizard)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/1 "2016-10-04T17:42:10Z")
I’m new to this message board and it was suggested I post these questions. Since I’m looking for a factual answer I chose this forum instead of Elections and I apologize if this question has already been addressed (please tell me the thread) – I attempted a search. With the crazy Presidential election process we are experiencing, I’m wondering about how certain outcomes would be dealt with – 1. what happens if one of the major candidates drops dead a week before the election? Is the remaining candidate a shoe-in (depriving a significant portion of the electorate of their chosen candidate and installing their reviled opponent)? Or is there some established protocol for replacing the candidate? 2. what happens if both major candidates drop dead a week before the election? 3. what happens if the elected candidate drops dead before being sworn in? I understand the succession of power to deal with the death of a sitting President, but what happens when the sitting President’s term runs out and the incoming president is not (incoming)? ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/2 "2016-10-04T17:53:26Z")
1. We don’t technically elect the President, but Electors who cast their ballots in December (the 19th I think). If the candidate dies or otherwise cannot or will not serve at any time before they vote, nothing is locked into place yet. If party A’s electors are selected by popular vote in a given state, they will presumably vote for whomever their party instructs them to vote for, again presumably, the running mate. 2. ditto 3. I don’t believe there is a firm answer about what happens if the President-elect becomes unavailable after the Electoral College votes but before Congress counts the ballots. A Republican (presumably) Congress might be able to say sorry but all those votes for Clinton are meaningless, Trump also doesn’t have a majority of cast electoral votes, so the House decides (among the top three Electoral vote recipients) and we choose Trump. Or it might decide that Clinton is elected but cannot serve so her VP becomes President. Either choice would likely be challenged by someone and head to the Supreme Court. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/3 "2016-10-04T17:57:13Z")
> [@GVI-Wizard](#): > > With the crazy Presidential election process we are experiencing, I’m wondering about how certain outcomes would be dealt with – > > 1. what happens if one of the major candidates drops dead a week before the election? Is the remaining candidate a shoe-in (depriving a significant portion of the electorate of their chosen candidate and installing their reviled opponent)? Or is there some established protocol for replacing the candidate? > > 2. what happens if both major candidates drop dead a week before the election? In presidential elections, you are not technically voting for a candidate but rather a slate of electors pledged to that candidate. So if you vote for a deceased candidate, you are just selecting his or her electors. When the electoral votes are cast, the electors would be able to vote for someone else selected by their political party. (There are state laws requiring electors to vote for the winner of the popular vote in that state. I am not sure how many might have provisions to allow for casting a different vote in the case of the death of a candidate, but in any case the validity of these laws is undetermined.) > [@](#): > > 1. what happens if the elected candidate drops dead before being sworn in? I understand the succession of power to deal with the death of a sitting President, but what happens when the sitting President’s term runs out and the incoming president is not (incoming)? If this happens after the election but before the vote of the Electoral College, see above. If it happens afterward, the Vice Presidential candidate would be sworn in as VP and then immediately succeed to the Presidency. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/4 "2016-10-04T18:03:56Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > If this happens after the election but before the vote of the Electoral College, see above. If it happens afterward, the Vice Presidential candidate would be sworn in as VP and then immediately succeed to the Presidency. It may be more complicated as OldGuy mentioned: > [@](#): > > **The “President-Elect” Problem** > > The 20th Amendment of the U.S. Constitution provides that if the “president-elect” dies, the rules of succession apply, and the vice-president-elect becomes the president-elect. Unfortunately, it’s not clear when in the process a winning candidate becomes “president-elect.” A winning presidential candidate has never died before being inaugurated, so Congress has never had to define it. > > According to historian John Buescher, in 1861 there was “widespread anxiety” that Abraham Lincoln would be assassinated before taking office. But Lincoln survived long enough to avoid any confusion about succession. > > The National Archives describes two possibilities: Either the Electoral College confers the designation, in which case the president-elect has died and the vice-president-elect moves up; or Congress confers the designation when it counts the electoral votes, in which case the “winning presidential candidate” has died, and Congress enters uncharted territory. > > **A Political Unknown** > > The question before Congress becomes whether the votes cast for the dead, winning candidate are valid. If so, Congress counts them, the deceased becomes president-elect, and the vice president-elect moves up. > > If not, Congress tosses the votes out, and the question becomes whether the second-highest vote count should be considered a valid majority. If so, the living candidate with the most votes becomes president-elect. > > If not, then no candidate has a majority of electoral votes, the 12th Amendment takes effect, and the House of Representatives picks the next U.S. president from the three living candidates with the most electoral votes. > > In a two-person race, then, the breathing candidate wins. > > In 2016, the people vote on Nov. 8, the Electoral College votes on Dec. 19, and Congress counts the votes on Jan. 6. Power changes hands in a peaceful, orderly fashion on Jan. 20, 2017. > **[What Happens if a Presidential Candidate Dies?](https://people.howstuffworks.com/what-happens-presidential-candidate-dies.htm)** > > It's happened before, and it'll likely happen again. The tricky part, though, is when it happens. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/5 "2016-10-04T18:06:10Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > 1. I don’t believe there is a firm answer about what happens if the President-elect becomes unavailable after the Electoral College votes but before Congress counts the ballots. A Republican (presumably) Congress might be able to say sorry but all those votes for Clinton are meaningless, Trump also doesn’t have a majority of cast electoral votes, so the House decides (among the top three Electoral vote recipients) and we choose Trump. Or it might decide that Clinton is elected but cannot serve so her VP becomes President. The person with the greatest number of Electoral Votes becomes President Elect. The Congress does not have the capacity to decide that; it may only count the votes. > [@](#): > > Twelfth Amendment > > The Electors shall meet in their respective states, and vote by ballot for President and Vice-President, one of whom, at least, shall not be an inhabitant of the same state with themselves; they shall name in their ballots the person voted for as President, and in distinct ballots the person voted for as Vice-President, and they shall make distinct lists of all persons voted for as President, and of all persons voted for as Vice-President, and of the number of votes for each, which lists they shall sign and certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the government of the United States, directed to the President of the Senate; The President of the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the certificates and the votes shall then be counted;–The person having the greatest number of votes for President, shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed; > [@](#): > > Twentieth Amendment > > Section 3. If, at the time fixed for the beginning of the term of the President, the President elect shall have died, the Vice President elect shall become President. If a President shall not have been chosen before the time fixed for the beginning of his term, or if the President elect shall have failed to qualify, then the Vice President elect shall act as President until a President shall have qualified; and the Congress may by law provide for the case wherein neither a President elect nor a Vice President elect shall have qualified, declaring who shall then act as President, or the manner in which one who is to act shall be selected, and such person shall act accordingly until a President or Vice President shall have qualified. > > Section 4. The Congress may by law provide for the case of the death of any of the persons from whom the House of Representatives may choose a President whenever the right of choice shall have devolved upon them, and for the case of the death of any of the persons from whom the Senate may choose a Vice President whenever the right of choice shall have devolved upon them. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/6 "2016-10-04T18:39:25Z")
Note that nowhere in the Constitution does it say that the candidate for president be alive when the Electoral College votes. It only becomes an issue on Inauguration Day, because the president-elect can’t take the oath of office. Since he or she can’t be sworn in – but the VP can – the presidency would be vacant and the VP would take over as president. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2016, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/various-succession-questions-regarding-the-election/767642/7 "2016-10-04T20:52:37Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Note that nowhere in the Constitution does it say that the candidate for president be alive when the Electoral College votes. > > It only becomes an issue on Inauguration Day, because the president-elect can’t take the oath of office. Since he or she can’t be sworn in – but the VP can – the presidency would be vacant and the VP would take over as president. [QUOTE=Constitution] No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident … [/QUOTE] Is a dead person a “citizen”? I agree with the others; it remains an open question. Congress could certainly refuse to count the votes for dead candidates on the grounds that they are ineligible to serve as President. Then, as no candidate has a majority, they choose from the top two on the list.