# Vegetarians Are Intolerant Jerks \[Moved from BBQ Pit\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 27, 2009, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967 "2009-08-27T22:44:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/41 "2009-08-28T06:36:37Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I didn’t insult you, dude. What is your problem? Not just an asshole, but a disingenuous one too. Like i said, go fuck yourself. > [@wierdaaron](#): > > I’m not real interested in your victim politics. I have no victim politics. I simply made an observation that meat-eaters are just as likely as vegetarians to be intolerant of other people’s dietary choices. > [@wierdaaron](#): > > I didn’t say it was a good argument, I said it would be fun to watch. Yeah, sure, that’s all you meant. If it is, you’re either retarded or a troll. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/42 "2009-08-28T06:38:39Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > Someday when I get time and money (as if I’m ever going to have both simultaneously) I’m going to start a board for people who practice veg\*nism for scientific reasons as opposed to ethical ones, as there isn’t a single forum anywhere devoted to that subject. Can you explain what you mean here? I’ve heard plenty of ethical arguments regarding vegetarianism that have a scientific basis, and scientific arguments that still have an ethical component. Can you really separate them so neatly? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/43 "2009-08-28T06:39:59Z")
Jesus, dude. Lack of proper nutrition is making you loopy. Have a fucking cheeseburger, son. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/44 "2009-08-28T06:40:09Z")
> [@](#): > > …I said it would be fun to watch. Like it would be fun to watch someone try to explain to a cow why we wear shoes made of his skin. What a whimsical sense of fun you have. ---
**Author:** ![wierdaaron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/eada6e/32.png) [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/45 "2009-08-28T06:46:38Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > If it is, you’re either retarded or a troll. Heh. Calling people retarded, assholes, fucking assholes, and disingenuous assholes is not a great way to launch a campaign calling someone a troll. Lets look at how your brain works.. To this post: > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I tried it for a while. I tried vegetariaism, veganism, macrobiotocs. None of took. The problem is that the food sucks. Plus, I think it’s kind of a fraudulent lifestyle at the end of the day. It’s not a natural diet for humans (people should eat LESS meat than most Americans do, but it’s not natural to eat NO meat), and from an ethical standpoint, it’s futile. Farming crops still kills animals by the dumpster full, so you might as well eat some cow or pig and actually enjoy your life instead of nibbling on spinach leaves and always being hungry. > > I also think a lot of them do it as some kind of fashion statement, like other people are going to be impressed by their ethical standards. No one is ever impressed. Just so you know. You posted: > [@mhendo](#): > > You’re such a fucking asshole sometimes. Go fuck yourself. To be honest, the first time I read that, I thought you were joking. Why? Because there’s nothing in the quoted post that warrants either a classification as asshole or a request to fuck ones self. The most possibly “offensive” content of that post is, “I also think a lot of them do it as some kind of fashion statement, like other people are going to be impressed by their ethical standards. No one is ever impressed,” which isn’t directed at you, and is pretty benign. It seems your problem is more with the fact that he dared speak words against vegetarianism, which you took as a personal attack. Perhaps this is because vegetarianism or veganism (or whatever your ism is) is the only thing that defines you. Get a grip, a life, and a clue. In any order. ---
**Author:** ![emcee2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emcee2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emcee2k)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/46 "2009-08-28T06:49:08Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > This is the sort of retarded logic that people dredge up when they’re desperate to do anything they possibly can do discredit vegetarianism. > > Most vegetarians i know, including me, are well aware that, to a considerable extent, the dietary choices we make are a luxury that comes from leading relatively comfortable lives in a modern industrialized society. Whether one is a vegetarian for ethical or health reasons, or some combination of those, the fact is that the ability to make a choice generally presupposes a certain minimum level of economic wherewithal. > > But the fact that a starving African kid might have trouble comprehending the rationale behind American vegetarianism does not make vegetarianism (or veganism, or whatever) an irrational or stupid choice. That same African kid would probably wonder why some people spend $400 on a cellphone, or $150 on a tie. What the fuck does any of that prove, except that some of us are more fortunate than others in the choices we are able to make? > > The interesting thing is that, despite the title of this thread, i find it’s far more common to find meat-eaters who deride vegetarians for their dietary choices than the other way around. > > You want to eat meat? Fine, go ahead. I really, truly don’t give a fuck. My wife’s not a vegetarian, and i’ve never tried to convince her to become one. I’ve cooked meat for her before, and will do it again. I also don’t consider myself ethically superior to people who eat meat. Despite **Diogenes** ’s retarded blatherings, i don’t do it for anyone except myself. Actually, spending $150 on a tie _is_ an irrational and stupid choice. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/47 "2009-08-28T06:56:17Z")
> [@wierdaaron](#): > > To be honest, the first time I read that, I thought you were joking. Why? Because there’s nothing in the quoted post that warrants either a classification as asshole or a request to fuck ones self. The most possibly “offensive” content of that post is, “I also think a lot of them do it as some kind of fashion statement, like other people are going to be impressed by their ethical standards. No one is ever impressed,” which isn’t directed at you, and is pretty benign. Really? That’s the only possibly offensive content? Not the description of vegetarianism as a “fraudulent lifestyle” (which must, perforce, mean that its adherents are frauds also)? Then there was the whole suggestion that vegetarians don’t enjoy their lives, and that this would change if they would just eat meat, again implying that the choice is one that people take for no reason other than self-aggrandizing posturing. > [@wierdaaron](#): > > It seems your problem is more with the fact that he dared speak words against vegetarianism, which you took as a personal attack. Perhaps this is because vegetarianism or veganism (or whatever your ism is) is the only thing that defines you. If someone wants to offer a rational critique of vegetarianism, i’m happy to engage with it. There are plenty of good reasons to eat meat, not least of which is that it’s damn tasty. But when people offer nothing but ignorant put-downs, i’ll respond accordingly. As for my vegetarianism defining me: it doesn’t. I don’t even think about it until it’s time to shop for food or prepare a meal. As i said, i don’t care what other people eat, and i attach no special status or moral standing to being a vegetarian. It’s just something that is one small part of who i am, like playing softball, reading history, supporting the right to abortion, and believing in universal healthcare. > [@wierdaaron](#): > > Get a grip, a life, and a clue. In any order. Eat my shit. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/48 "2009-08-28T06:59:51Z")
Would allergic reaction or other digestion problems be considered scientific reasons? I’ve heard that some people’s bodies cannot process meat. ETA: **mehendo** ’s vegetarian? I guess that doesn’t define him as I don’t recall reading any posts from him (her?) to that effect. ---
**Author:** ![wierdaaron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/eada6e/32.png) [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/49 "2009-08-28T07:00:42Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Eat my shit. But then how would I get protein? ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/50 "2009-08-28T07:05:44Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I tried it for a while. I tried vegetariaism, veganism, macrobiotocs. None of took. The problem is that the food sucks. I think this is the problem with Westerners who want to become vegetarians. From what I see from my Indian co-workers, the food is quite good: large variety and great taste. Of course, they’ve had centuries to develop and perfect their vegetarian diet. Maybe in a couple of centuries the Western vegetarian diet will be great and will not just try to imitate the meat versions of dishes (like tofu/veggie burgers, etc) ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/51 "2009-08-28T07:06:52Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Would allergic reaction or other digestion problems be considered scientific reasons? I’ve heard that some people’s bodies cannot process meat. I never thought of that. It would certainly qualify as a scientific (or, perhaps more correctly, physiological) reason for avoiding meat. My mother can’t eat gluten because of a disease that she has, which is a similar situation. ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/52 "2009-08-28T07:10:37Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I’ve heard plenty of ethical arguments regarding vegetarianism that have a scientific basis, and scientific arguments that still have an ethical component. Can you really separate them so neatly? In my experience and opinion, yes. For example, [The China Study](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study), which I cannot recommend highly enough, is written entirely from the point of view of promoting veganism for purposes of ameliorating human pathologies and improving public health status in the developed nations. On the other end of the spectrum are the people who abhor the thought of exploiting animals for their own pleasure. They generally have little or no knowledge of nutritional biochemistry, and practice veg\*anisn because consuming animals products causes an ego-dystonic reaction which they find uncomfortable. Both are perfectly valid reasons for eschewing animal products, and I have nothing but the utmost respect for both groups. However, what I’ve been seeing more and more lately are people who enter into the lifestyle from one viewpoint or the other and then rapidly start developing an interest in aspects of vegetarianism which they hadn’t known about. Personally, I feel that this is when the subject of plant-based consumerism becomes most interesting. ---
**Author:** ![wierdaaron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/eada6e/32.png) [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/53 "2009-08-28T07:13:53Z")
Wait, I’ve got a better one. > [@mhendo](#): > > Eat my shit. “Sorry, I don’t eat animal products.” ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/54 "2009-08-28T07:19:15Z")
An ethical vegan would consider shit to be vegan. The criteria is whether or not the product was taken with the animal’s consent. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/55 "2009-08-28T07:38:29Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > An ethical vegan would consider shit to be vegan. The criteria is whether or not the product was taken with the animal’s consent. Well, **mhendo** did specifically invite him to eat it, so I’d say that he has given his consent. ---
**Author:** ![wierdaaron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/eada6e/32.png) [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/56 "2009-08-28T07:56:51Z")
What about the digestive flora of bacteria in said shit? They didn’t give their consent. ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/57 "2009-08-28T08:46:08Z")
Bacteria aren’t animals. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/58 "2009-08-28T11:21:30Z")
Dude, let me tell you about a classmate of mine named Patrick. Patrick and I had the fortune to take a political science course together during the 2004 election. The professor offered generous extra-credit points for attending the various events on and around campus. Patrick decided to attend a forum sponsored by the College Democrats chapter. The forum wasn’t intended to be a Democrat vs. Republican debate; it was intended to give Democrats an opportunity to learn about the issues from a Democratic perspective, and to learn about the Democratic presidential candidates, since it was primary season. With me so far? The next class, Patrick had the balls to whine about how this Democratic forum, sponsored by the College Democrats and intended for Democrats was biased and not fair to Republicans. He felt it would have been better if there had been more balance. Not only did Patrick not get his five extra-credit points for attending, the professor likened it to going to someone’s house for a party and taking a shit in the middle of the host’s floor. He also said that he would do the same for any professed liberal or Democrat who exhibited the same behavior at a Republican function. So, Curtis, the point of the story is that, well, going to the forum of a group you don’t agree with for the purpose of “debating” them (note the quotation marks) is pretty much the equivalent of going to someone’s house and taking a shit in the middle of the floor. It’s just not done in polite society. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/59 "2009-08-28T12:48:00Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > The interesting thing is that, despite the title of this thread, i find it’s far more common to find meat-eaters who deride vegetarians for their dietary choices than the other way around. Without getting into who’s a retard, a troll, and should fuck themselves, I wanted to say that what mhendo is saying here is true. People on this board talk a lot about how judgey vegetarians and vegans are, but in reality, most of the deriding, insulting, and judging is directed from meat eaters to vegetarians, not the other way around. This thread is just one example. Why do other people care so much what I eat? You think I lead a fraudulent lifestyle with shitty food? Perhaps worry less about what I do, because you certainly wouldn’t want my opinion on what you eat. It’s ironic as hell that, in the guise of decrying how judgmental vegetarians are, meat eaters always offer their own (almost invariably negative, dismissive, and rude) judgments of vegetarians. It’s gotten pretty old. ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967/60 "2009-08-28T12:58:08Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > Bacteria aren’t animals. You multi-cellularist fascist bastard! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-are-intolerant-jerks-moved-from-bbq-pit/507967.md?page=4)