# Vegetarians/Vegans: Speak up already. In advance. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 2, 2007, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356 "2007-04-02T00:25:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/41 "2007-04-02T12:47:03Z")
I would think that in this day and age, a catering company would have a box to check for vegan, so the customer doesn’t accidentally forget. I used to have to order pizzas for the group at work, and I always ordered a vegetarian pie just in case. When Kid Kalhoun brings a new girl around for dinner (and there have been many), I always ask him what dietary concerns I need to be made aware of. Nothing more embarrassing than having a guest who can’t eat what you’re serving. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/42 "2007-04-02T12:58:00Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] I would think that in this day and age, a catering company would have a box to check for vegan, so the customer doesn’t accidentally forget. [/QUOTE] Why do you think an event with over 800 people uses “checkbox” hospital-style ordering forms? Hey look, it’s right there in the very first sentence of the OP that they don’t do that, but rather have one meal for everybody and somebody whose job it is to ask people if they want veg\*n! ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/43 "2007-04-02T13:07:53Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] Why do you think an event with over 800 people uses “checkbox” hospital-style ordering forms? Hey look, it’s right there in the very first sentence of the OP that they don’t do that, but rather have one meal for everybody and somebody whose job it is to ask people if they want veg\*n! [/QUOTE] From the OP: > [@](#): > > The kitchen staff can prepare vegetarian/vegan dishes easily. \*\*In fact, there is a whole list of options for vegetarian/vegan dishes. The thing is, if you didn’t let us know ahead of time that X number of vegetarian entrees would be needed, the kitchen staff didn’t prepare any! \*\* If the vegetarians in the group did not inform the organizer of the convention that they need vegetarian dishes, the cooks don’t know to prepare them. Even worse, the chef probably didn’t order appropriate ingredients. If you wait until the meal is being served to announce that you need a vegetarian plate, the cooks will do their best. But they’re probably going to have to scramble to find suitable ingredients and then come up with a tasty dish using whatever ingredients they have on hand. And they have to try to do it very quickly so that you can eat it at roughly the same time as everybody else. It contradicts the statement that it’s one thing for everyone. If the caterer asks the organizer how many vegan dishes they need, they’ll accommodate them.\* A check box would be a reminder to the organizer that not everyone eats meat. \* That’s all. I know some people don’t give a shit, but if the caterer knows this issue comes up fairly frequently (and I know it does), reminding the organizer that there are people who don’t eat meat would save them a lot of trouble. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/44 "2007-04-02T13:32:00Z")
By “list” I’m sure he meant “of things we could prepare if need be”. Because it’s very clearly not a checkbox situation: > [@](#): > > I work at my city convention center, where we serve meals to groups as large as 800+ people. For obvious reasons (I’ll just say “logistics”), these meals tend to be of the everybody-gets-the-same-thing variety. The people in charge of the group consult, in advance, with the convention center sales staff to hammer out what each meal’s menu will consist of. Then, just days prior to the event, the chef orders the appropriate ingredients, in the proper amounts, required to prepare those meals. If you have a special need, it is your responsibility to inform your host of it, Kalhoun. Demanding anything else is rude, or anyway Miss Manners certainly thinks so. I guess if you don’t care about etiquette, you can be as an entitled an asshole as you please. But it is absolutely fucking rude to treat a catered event like a restaurant outing, and it is rude to demand your special needs, unless in a protected category, be accommodated to everyone else’s enormous expense (800+ cards that do not currently exist, not to mention keeping track of and transcribing them) when you could do the same thing simply by placing one phone call or sending one email. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/45 "2007-04-02T13:34:34Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] But as I pointed out- they **can’t** “quickly, easily and inexpensively solve the problem” without having a dozen varieties of meals and several of each. [/QUOTE] Actually I cry nonsense to that - a totally vegan meal will do for anybody but the gluten intolerant and the most low carb/induction types. No meat, no dairy takes care of the kosher and halal slaughter and combination issues, the seafood allergy issues, and the rennet/nonrennet cheese types. I make a fabulous vegan minestrone that the only gluten in it is the noodles, and with enough warning I can sub in nongluten noodles. It is fairly low fat, low sodium [i prefer to let people salt to their own taste.] and it goes quite well with a tossed salad with a homemade vinaigrette dressing that is nothing more than oil, vinegar and herbs. Freshly grated parmesan and mozzarella, and vegan shredded cheese can be served on the side. Assorted raw veggies can be added to the salad [radishes, onions, broccoli, peppers, olives. I regularly threw a welcome to pennsic party for my area as I cant schlep heavy goods, but I could prepare a good hearty meal for people setting up their camps, and we had a lot of different dietary needs. When you cook on a fairly regular basis for 25+ people in your camp with needs ranging from vegan through kosher through celiac and allergies, you get really good at menu planning for neutral foods. [and yes,I actually have a cooking box of kosher only gear including everything from teh knives, peelers, utensils through cutting boards, measuring tools and cooking implements - though I tend to admit that I tended to stick to a selection of vegan foods and augmented with grilled meats as our grill only grilled meats. I just needed a heads up if I needed to cater for someone keeping kosher. Lots of medieval cuisine that is relatively vegan if you use the lenten version option=)] ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/46 "2007-04-02T13:59:18Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] By “list” I’m sure he meant “of things we could prepare if need be”. Because it’s very clearly not a checkbox situation: If you have a special need, it is your responsibility to inform your host of it, Kalhoun. Demanding anything else is rude, or anyway Miss Manners certainly thinks so. I guess if you don’t care about etiquette, you can be as an entitled an asshole as you please. But it is absolutely fucking rude to treat a catered event like a restaurant outing, and it is rude to demand your special needs, unless in a protected category, be accommodated to everyone else’s enormous expense (800+ cards that do not currently exist, not to mention keeping track of and transcribing them) when you could do the same thing simply by placing one phone call or sending one email. [/QUOTE] Not a check box for everyone…a check box for the organizer. It is the organizer’s duty to find out if there are dietary restrictions. I’ve done it. It’s not hard. Oh. And go fuck yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/47 "2007-04-02T14:15:57Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Not a check box for everyone…a check box for the organizer. It is the organizer’s duty to find out if there are dietary restrictions. I’ve done it. It’s not hard. [/quote] Yeah, it is. **I guess that must be why some veg’ns managed to get their food at these events, huh?** Because somebody’s trying to do their job, and some other fucking entitled assholes are making it fucking impossible by inventing likely fictional veg’nism on the spot to try to get something they like the look of to eat? > [@](#): > > Oh. And go fuck yourself. Jam it up your twat with a rusty ladle, fuckface. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/48 "2007-04-02T14:28:37Z")
[QUOTE=aruvqan] Actually I cry nonsense to that - a totally vegan meal will do for anybody but the gluten intolerant and the most low carb/induction types. No meat, no dairy takes care of the kosher and halal slaughter and combination issues, the seafood allergy issues, and the rennet/nonrennet cheese types. I make a fabulous vegan minestrone that the only gluten in it is the noodles, and with enough warning I can sub in nongluten noodles. It is fairly low fat, low sodium [i prefer to let people salt to their own taste.] and it goes quite well with a tossed salad with a homemade vinaigrette dressing that is nothing more than oil, vinegar and herbs. Freshly grated parmesan and mozzarella, and vegan shredded cheese can be served on the side. Assorted raw veggies can be added to the salad [radishes, onions, broccoli, peppers, olives. I regularly threw a welcome to pennsic party for my area as I cant schlep heavy goods, but I could prepare a good hearty meal for people setting up their camps, and we had a lot of different dietary needs. When you cook on a fairly regular basis for 25+ people in your camp with needs ranging from vegan through kosher through celiac and allergies, you get really good at menu planning for neutral foods. [and yes,I actually have a cooking box of kosher only gear including everything from teh knives, peelers, utensils through cutting boards, measuring tools and cooking implements - though I tend to admit that I tended to stick to a selection of vegan foods and augmented with grilled meats as our grill only grilled meats. I just needed a heads up if I needed to cater for someone keeping kosher. Lots of medieval cuisine that is relatively vegan if you use the lenten version option=)] [/QUOTE] Food allergies go well beyond merely gluten. Nuts, strawberries, tomatos can all cause distress of one form or another. Why should a vegetarian have to put up with rice noodles and corn torillas because of my gluten issues? Why should I have to put up with no meat simply because I have gluten issues? Why should someone who is keeping kosher not be permitted bread (unless its passover, of course) or fish. If we go that far, lets just serve allergen free, meat free, kosher meals to everyone at every catered event. I’d rather have a grilled chicken breast on rice than the average vegetarian meal (which is usually what is served at these things and if I don’t touch the roll, I’m fine). Per plate charges at catered events are expensive enough that I should be able to get a meal that has at least minimal customization to my dietary needs. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/49 "2007-04-02T14:32:28Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] Yeah, it is. **I guess that must be why some veg’ns managed to get their food at these events, huh?** Because somebody’s trying to do their job, and some other fucking entitled assholes are making it fucking impossible by inventing likely fictional veg’nism on the spot to try to get something they like the look of to eat? Jam it up your twat with a rusty ladle, fuckface. [/QUOTE] The OP was complaining that they didn’t know ahead of time. Read the fucking post, pin dick. And while you’re at it, tell me how many grown adults are running around pretending to be vegetarians. All they have to do is tell someone up front. All that takes is a reminder to the planner. It’s done all the time, you miserable piece of shit. That’s what etiquette is about. Anticipating your guests’ needs. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/50 "2007-04-02T14:43:03Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] The OP was complaining that they didn’t know ahead of time. Read the fucking post, pin dick. And while you’re at it, tell me how many grown adults are running around pretending to be vegetarians. All they have to do is tell someone up front. All that takes is a reminder to the planner. It’s done all the time, you miserable piece of shit. That’s what etiquette is about. Anticipating your guests’ needs. [/QUOTE] Hmm, let’s see: > [@Phase42](#): > > I’ll concede that sometimes the convention organizer is the weak link in the chain, failing to find out like they’re supposed to. **But there have been a number of times when we have received a count of how many vegetarian dishes to prepare, only to have ten more people suddenly announce at the last minute that they’re vegetarians.** I think there may be some instances where some non-vegetarians see what the vegetarians are getting and decide that looks better than the “regular” entree, and so claim to be vegetarians so they can get the alternate dish. So you and me and he agree that sometimes, the organizer can be at fault. But sometimes, gasp shock swoon, people are assholes and fail to decide to be veg’n until they’re sitting at the table. Are you denying that this happens? Are you saying that every single time someone doesn’t get what they want, it’s never because they’re an irresponsible or entitled jackass? Maybe you just think such folks are rare in this world, in which case I envy you. If you think proper etiquette says it’s the host’s responsibility to track down their guests’ special dietary needs with no prompting, you obviously need to brush up on your mavens. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/51 "2007-04-02T14:55:27Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] Hmm, let’s see: So you and me and he agree that sometimes, the organizer can be at fault. But sometimes, gasp shock swoon, people are assholes and fail to decide to be veg’n until they’re sitting at the table. Are you denying that this happens? Are you saying that every single time someone doesn’t get what they want, it’s never because they’re an irresponsible or entitled jackass? Maybe you just think such folks are rare in this world, in which case I envy you. If you think proper etiquette says it’s the host’s responsibility to track down their guests’ special dietary needs with no prompting, you obviously need to brush up on your mavens. [/QUOTE] Look. The percentage of people who would “pretend” to be a vegetarian is small that it is inconsequential. :rolleyes: No system is perfect. If everyone receives an email prompting them to advise of dietary restrictions, you will get the information you need from most of the attendees. Banquet halls know that shit happens and can deal with it. This isn’t rocket science. It is the host’s responsibility to prompt them. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/52 "2007-04-02T15:38:33Z")
I have worked in service many years, including for a swish caterer who regularly did events for 800 - 1200 persons. So I feel your pain, I do agree people should let the company know in advance. Also I agree that companies can lose those communications, delivered in the weeks leading up to the event (there are always late comers!). All of that said, it is the caterers job to, y’know ‘cater’ to the clientelle. That means knowing that out of 800 persons, a certain percentage will want veggie, vegan, halal, kosher, food allergies etc, without any warning. We never did an event that we did not have a couple of trays of beautiful vegetarian/vegan food in the oven ready to plate if needed, (and it always was). It is the servers job to ask the person requesting a special meal, “Did you order a special meal?”, if the answer is ‘no’ then it’s the servers job to convey that they will try their very best to accommodate the request, but those who special ordered will be served first. Gently, politely and kindly - no attitude. The server should also ask that person if (veggie prepped meal description here) is acceptable? The chefs I worked with never had a problem, as this had been anticipated. It was a simple thing to return to the kitchen and ask for a veggie meal to be plated hot from the oven. Does it slow down the service to the veggie eater? A little, but they are understanding if they then get an edible hot meal. Were there times we were caught without enough veggie meals? Very rarely but yes, but when that happened the people left out were not those who had pre ordered, and apologies were made while trying to accommodate, best we could, with whatever ingredients we had with us. Our customers were unfailingly appreciative of our efforts. As for tight food costs I just have to say it’s the nature of catering that you have to be prepared. Think of a buffet, you can’t know exactly how much food each person will take, yet you have to have enough for everyone. It’s all about percentages and experience, if they can work it out for a buffet they can work it out for veggie meals. The truth is, especially in convention centers/cafeterias/hospitals etc, they just don’t want to be bothered. You can see why it’s so much easier if everyone just has the same meal and they count on that when they price the event for you. Catering is about giving the customers what they need and trying to anticipate their needs. If this situation plays out again and again, as you’ve described someone is not doing their job. In a perfect world persons with special food needs would let the caterers know well in advance of the events. It’s not a perfect world and people are people, to expect otherwise is to ignore the obvious. Mind you this was not a convention center it was a top end catering company, there is less room for disappointment when people are paying top dollar to be sure. People do need to keep their expectations in line with the venue. And I just have to say, the day I went to a table and asked them to raise their hands to indicate what they ordered would have been my last day working for the caterer. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/53 "2007-04-02T16:18:20Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Look. The percentage of people who would “pretend” to be a vegetarian is small that it is inconsequential. :rolleyes: [/quote] Ooh, rollyeyes. I guess “fuck off” really was you pulling out all the stops. Maybe you should stay out of the Pit if you can’t manage the right level of being a condescending cunt without emoticons to help. You have now called the OP a liar for no reason other than the inside of your head says it must be so.Actually, I think only a few say they are veg’n because they think the veg’n meal \*\* which other people capable of taking a shred of personal responsibility managed to order ahead of time\*\* looks tasty. I think most are just enormously entitled assholes such as yourself who think the world should wait on them hand and foot because they have specific dietary preferences. > [@](#): > > No system is perfect. If everyone receives an email prompting them to advise of dietary restrictions, you will get the information you need from most of the attendees. **Banquet halls know that shit happens and can deal with it.** This isn’t rocket science. It is the host’s responsibility to prompt them. You mean like the place we’re fucking talking about right now which can’t fucking deal with it because it’s completely fucking unreasonable to expect them to be prepared for special orders on the spot? You keep showing signs of having very briefly skimmed the OP and spouted off, and here’s another one. Anyway, you’re making up your own new etiquette. Miss Manners et al have been very clear on the subject: it is the diners’ responsibility to notify their host of their specific needs. You’re free to make up your own rude rules, of course, but you’re going to be disappointed by polite people a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/54 "2007-04-02T16:40:13Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] Ooh, rollyeyes. I guess “fuck off” really was you pulling out all the stops. Maybe you should stay out of the Pit if you can’t manage the right level of being a condescending cunt without emoticons to help. You have now called the OP a liar for no reason other than the inside of your head says it must be so.Actually, I think only a few say they are veg’n because they think the veg’n meal \*\* which other people capable of taking a shred of personal responsibility managed to order ahead of time\*\* looks tasty. I think most are just enormously entitled assholes such as yourself who think the world should wait on them hand and foot because they have specific dietary preferences. You mean like the place we’re fucking talking about right now which can’t fucking deal with it because it’s completely fucking unreasonable to expect them to be prepared for special orders on the spot? You keep showing signs of having very briefly skimmed the OP and spouted off, and here’s another one. Anyway, you’re making up your own new etiquette. Miss Manners et al have been very clear on the subject: it is the diners’ responsibility to notify their host of their specific needs. You’re free to make up your own rude rules, of course, but you’re going to be disappointed by polite people a lot. [/QUOTE] Look, you ignorant wad of phlegm. It’s a good host’s job to ask. Period. Particularly when they’re dealing with large groups. People who know the industry know that changes and surprises are expected for any number of reasons. I’ve done the organizing and it’s no big deal for a caterer, with the exception of a mildly annoyed OP. You’re a fucking idiot, and a rude one at that. You have no idea what you’re talking about. But keep digging. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/55 "2007-04-02T16:45:35Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] Why don’t people read posts before they reply? [/quote] I don’t know, why don’t you? Before you get all shitty and start insulting people? > [@](#): > > He’s not bent out of shape about “what to serve”. This isn’t a dinner party in someone’s house, it’s a professionally catered event. Why are people so incredibly self-centered and rude that they would fail to notify anyone in advance (remember, his complaint is not that orders are being lost, but that they are never being placed by the people who want veg\*n food) and then demand that their special need be accommodated anyway? Why do you fail to realize that sometimes, the message doesn’t get communicated even when you DO tell in advance what your diet is? Or that even if it is, sometimes it is ignored/lost, mistakes are made, etc.? You and the OP are assuming that the problem is with the diner. I don’t think that’s necessarily so, though I’m sure sometimes it is. It’s not always someone’s fault, or someone being selfish or inconsiderate. Why assume that? So you can feel justified to yell and call names? In a situation like that, where maybe someone was sent to the convention at the last minute, or their dietary info was never solicited and it was assumed that everyone would just eat meat (happens ALL THE TIME), or info was lost… why not have some easy to cook food handy? I mean, if this is enough of a problem for the OP to Pit, then it could be fixed with a little compensatory planning by the kitchen. Is it really going to ruin the proft margin to make a pot of pasta and some sauce? ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/56 "2007-04-02T16:51:19Z")
[QUOTE=Nava] For her son’s wedding, a few years later, they sent the menu with the invitations and asked people to say which option they wanted. Makes everybody’s life a lot easier. [/QUOTE] Every wedding I’ve been to has had this question on the RSVP card. I’m just curious now, is vegetarianism common in Spain? Because this is a very simple and effective way to get this right. I’m a vegetarian and I ALMOST always try to get this right ahead of time. The one time it completely slipped my mind was when I forgot to request a vegetarian meal before a flight. Fortunately, they had an extra one on hand - one specifically for Hindus. Curry! Probably the best food I’ve ever had on a plane. ---
**Author:** ![GilaB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8e7dd6/32.png) [@GilaB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GilaB)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/57 "2007-04-02T17:08:26Z")
A vegan meal doesn’t necessarily solve all of your problems. I realize that people’s level of strictness varies, but most Orthodox people will not eat non-certified vegan food, and certainly not if it’s been heated up unwrapped in the same oven as the rest of the meals. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/58 "2007-04-02T17:41:59Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Look, you ignorant wad of phlegm. It’s a good host’s job to ask. Period. Particularly when they’re dealing with large groups. People who know the industry know that changes and surprises are expected for any number of reasons. I’ve done the organizing and it’s no big deal for a caterer, with the exception of a mildly annoyed OP. You’re a fucking idiot, and a rude one at that. You have no idea what you’re talking about. But keep digging. [/QUOTE] Yes, people in the industry know that many people are rude, inconsiderate shitheads who want to foist their personal responsibility off on everyone else in the universe with no regard to who it inconveniences. Since I worked in a catering restaurant for many years, I am aware that it’s a well-known fact that sometimes you have to scramble to deal with one such sack of vomit. Doesn’t make it fucking right to do. Oh, you think I’m being wuuuuude to poor widdle youuuu? I guess “fuck off” passes as polite in your area? You’re just fucking mad you can’t even begin to keep up with my vitriol. Don’t start what you can’t finish, sugarbuns. Show me a cite from a reputable etiquette source that it’s rude for a host not to ask every guest what their personal dietary restrictions are and cater to them. Show me, and I’ll agree that I had no idea what I’m talking about. I bet you’re one of those people who is always 15 minutes late and insists it’s just normal and human and everyone else should fucking cater to you. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/59 "2007-04-02T18:13:23Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] Yes, people in the industry know that many people are rude, inconsiderate shitheads who want to foist their personal responsibility off on everyone else in the universe with no regard to who it inconveniences. Since I worked in a catering restaurant for many years, I am aware that it’s a well-known fact that sometimes you have to scramble to deal with one such sack of vomit. Doesn’t make it fucking right to do. Oh, you think I’m being wuuuuude to poor widdle youuuu? I guess “fuck off” passes as polite in your area? You’re just fucking mad you can’t even begin to keep up with my vitriol. Don’t start what you can’t finish, sugarbuns. Show me a cite from a reputable etiquette source that it’s rude for a host not to ask every guest what their personal dietary restrictions are and cater to them. Show me, and I’ll agree that I had no idea what I’m talking about. I bet you’re one of those people who is always 15 minutes late and insists it’s just normal and human and everyone else should fucking cater to you. [/QUOTE] I’m sure you’re one of those wonderful customer service types who thinks a customer should be thankful you didn’t shit in his soup. If you think your attitude toward catering is even remotely acceptable, then I don’t believe for one second that you had any say-so on how things were done in the restaurant you worked in. You think and act like a busboy, you pathetic, ill-mannered, lazy punk. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2007, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356/60 "2007-04-02T18:18:49Z")
Um…pardon me for failing to deliver the required level of vitriol…I hope it’s still ok to post this opinion without it. I don’t think I’ve seen these sorts of words used in an ettiquette discussion before…probably been living a sheltered life, I’ll admit. Shouldn’t there be a rule like Godwin’s Law that the first person to use “fuck off” or “shove it up your twat” in discussing what’s proper ettiquette has already lost the argument? 🙂 In my experience, the people who organize outings and meetings are very often the ones at fault. At places I’ve worked, I’ve been crystal-clear whenever the topic comes up that I’m vegan. In my current job I’ve told them every time they’ve asked opinions, every time they’re sent out a prospective menu, every time I’ve actually been in attendance and seen what their sorry idea of accomodation is. One time there was a plastic salad box of sliced bell pepper rings, raw, unseasoned… versus three bins of chicken and beef in fancy French sauces, steming over heat. It’s a government office, so laziness can’t be ruled out – why should the organizer have to care or follow up just for the convenience of others? “Eat what _I_ like or starve, I can’t be bothered to learn anything hard,” seems to be the attitude. But there’s also some passive-aggressive politics involved. Some people are angry that the good old days of pizza and hamburgers without a thought are now called into question. Some of them seem to be emotionally threatened…perhaps they feel judged? I’m not at the meeting to advocate or to politic, but I strongly suspect, from what I’ve overheard, that some folks think it serves my kind (not me specifically) right that we can’t eat with the regular folks. Consciously or not, I think this influences their decision making when planning parties and dinners. Regardless, I’m sure that if they can’t order pizza for the monthly meeting, month after month, without taking me into account, after I’ve told them, month after month, they’ll do no better planning a major offsite event. In short: I’m sure some vegan/veggie/special diet people don’t plan well. But I’m inclined to believe the problem is usually with the organizers of the event. Sailboat [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vegetarians-vegans-speak-up-already-in-advance/398356.md?page=4)