# Veronica Mars 4/18/06 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 19, 2006, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327 "2006-04-19T17:21:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e36b37/32.png) [@Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_A_Tame_Lion)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/1 "2006-04-19T17:21:05Z")
A very good episode: tight storyline(s), well-written, very focused on the matters at hand, some good humor in there, too. I was surprised when Roni laid out a very cogent case for Weevil being guilty on the bus crash–I never even considered that the real target was the limo–but I’m guessing that rules him out, even if his explanation of himself was weak. I doubt they’d spell out the solution that bluntly before reaching the climax of the season. Weevil got in some nice puns at the expense of the late, not-so-lamented Thumper. “I’m sure he’s crushed.” If he didn’t know exactly what would happen to Thumper, he sure as hell knows what _did_ happen to him. Apparently, that Kendall’s been a naughty, naughty girl. Didn’t see her as Fitzpatrick-style meat, but her rendezvous with Liam leaves no doubt she’s capable of major badness. Definitely in the running for being guilty of murder. Didn’t Veronica say, on the phone to Keith, that she thought someone would get shot? Strange, since she had already taken the bullets out of Liam’s gun. That was a little disingenuous, by the writers if not the character. Is it just me, or is Wallace getting stupider by the week? Is there any point to this dance he’s doing with Jackie? Are they going somewhere with this? That felt like the only distraction in last night’s episode. Mac, as usual, was hilarious. Overall, a first-rate episode. ---
**Author:** ![Amok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f17d59/32.png) [@Amok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amok)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/2 "2006-04-19T18:16:03Z")
Veronica’s confrontation of Weevil in the teaser was interesting, but I don’t think she ever actually thought that Weevil was behind the crash. It was more like she was feeling a bit put out by Weevil since she suspects him of either killing Thumper or getting Thumper killed, and she was curious about why Weevil was on the PCH the day of the crash. So she tried grilling him to see if he knew anything else. That didn’t work, but when Weevil asks for her help in getting the paddle (or whatever it was) with the liscense numbers, she brings it up again and learns what she wants to know. I’ve been wondering if Kendall was involved in the season mystery somehow, but I didn’t see the Fiztpatrick connection coming. In that scene outside her secret house you hear her voice before you see her, and I knew right then it was her. And I like how, even though we got resolution on who killed Lilly in season one, the characters haven’t exactly. I mean, I’m sure Veronica doesn’t buy Aaron’s story for a second, but that doesn’t mean he’ll necessarily be convicted. Though even if he managed to walk on Lilly’s death, I’m thinking attemped murder of Veronica would still be a pretty tough charge for him to beat. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/3 "2006-04-19T18:23:41Z")
The whole Veronica follows 'cuda and calls dad business confused me. It was very unclear what was going on, completely (deliberately) unclear that Keith was inside the house and as you say, the whole “someone’s gonna get shot” canard became irritating after the fact. Kendall is supposed to be some clever con artist, but for her alias she assumes the identity of the girl who died in a car Kendall was driving? Kendall was a cheerleader for a pro sports team; did she think that no one who ever knew the real Kendall watched professional basketball, or that as a public figure no one would ever see the name and connect it to the real Kendall? The whole “Oscar as murder weapon” thing is ridiculous. Assuming it’s not actually the murder weapon, any M.E. is going to be able to match up the wounds on Lilly to the statue and to the ashtray and figure out that the Oscar doesn’t fit. And if it is the actual murder weapon, what, Aaron just _happened_ to be carting his Oscar around with him the day he killed Lilly? And there’s just no way to explain Lilly’s blood on the Oscar that makes any sense whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/47e85d/32.png) [@Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Lance_Murdoch)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/4 "2006-04-19T18:29:26Z")
Unsolicited opinions that can’t be called spoilers because how would I know, but what I think is; The Steve Guttenberg character is the culprit on the bus crash. Aaron didn’t kill Lilly. Mrs. Echolls isn’t dead. She is probably Lilly’s killer. I miss Meg. ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/5 "2006-04-19T18:41:38Z")
It’s a California jury for a famous actor. They’re not going to let little things like facts and evidence get in the way of _Clash of the Titans 2_. Plus, Aaron Echolls got an Oscar? Did they used to have a category for poofiest hair? It’s true that Veronica had removed the bullets from that gun, but she couldn’t know whether the gun had been reloaded in the meantime, or if Liam had another gun, or could locate one once in the house. Either way, Liam was going to do some damage to somebody. I don’t think Wallace is stupid. He likes Jackie, has liked her _all year_, and would rather spend five weeks with her than no time at all. I don’t think he’s wanting a lifetime commitment or anything. I guess the big question now is this: do we figure Kendall blew up the bus because she had the means, motive and opportunity, or assume she didn’t do it because we learned this information with three episodes left in the season, and none of it has to do with Woody Goodman (that we know of yet)? ---
**Author:** ![Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e36b37/32.png) [@Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_A_Tame_Lion)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/6 "2006-04-19T19:11:12Z")
Since folks brought it up: I don’t know so much, because I hopped on the wagon this season, and don’t know much about last season’s doings, so…are we ironclad on Aaron’s guilt in the Lily matter? Was that definitively resolved last year? I don’t know how it plays in this year’s drama except as backstory, but I’m wondering why new evidence is being introduced now. Any thoughts? I’m just down on Wallace because he dumped that little hottie Jane for Jackie. No way you make that trade in my mind. And he doesn’t seem to be serving much purpose in recent shows. He’s just sort of there. Ironic, considering how long he just sort of wasn’t earlier in the season. Yeah, Roni definitely caught a whiff of Weevil’s guilt vis-à-vis Thumper’s death. But I don’t think she’d bust him for that. Liam specifically asked Kendall to hand him the gun from the glove compartment. There was no reason to believe he had another gun, and the character had no reason to believe it wasn’t loaded. And later Our Girl said, “I could have told you it wasn’t loaded if you hadn’t hung up on me.” It _was_ an irritating canard, as **Otto** so eloquently put it. On Kendall: I wasn’t aware that being an ex-cheerleader was part of the character. Isn’t that true in real life of Charisma Carpenter? I thought she was a pro cheerleader at one point, in San Diego if I remember correctly. Anyway, yes, it is less than clever for the character to be that prominent but using an alias (though it seemed to me that the real Kendall was not exactly a local; the yearbook Keith had did not say Neptune High, unless I didn’t see the cover right.) Much to stew over, and double check on the re-viewing. ---
**Author:** ![Amok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f17d59/32.png) [@Amok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amok)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/7 "2006-04-19T19:20:05Z")
> [@cbawlmer](#): > > Plus, Aaron Echolls got an Oscar? Did they used to have a category for poofiest hair? Maybe, because he won at least two. 🙂 In a season one episode… I think it was _M.A.D._… there’s a scene where Veronica and Logan make out on the couch in the Echolls’ house, and Aaron walks in on them. You can see two Oscars on the mantle or whatever behind them. (Unless they were Lynn’s. I think she was an actress.) ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/8 "2006-04-19T19:54:42Z")
> [@Not A Tame Lion](#): > > Since folks brought it up: I don’t know so much, because I hopped on the wagon this season, and don’t know much about last season’s doings, so…are we ironclad on Aaron’s guilt in the Lily matter? Was that definitively resolved last year? I don’t know how it plays in this year’s drama except as backstory, but I’m wondering why new evidence is being introduced now. Any thoughts? IIRC he confessed to Veronica while he was busy trapping her in a container of some sort (wooden crate? Been a while since I’ve seen the season finale) and setting her on fire. I have this vague memory of her handing a recording of it to Keith but I may be mixing things up. > [@natl](#): > > On Kendall: I wasn’t aware that being an ex-cheerleader was part of the character. Isn’t that true in real life of Charisma Carpenter? I thought she was a pro cheerleader at one point, in San Diego if I remember correctly. I believe that Kendall’s character has been established as being a former Laker girl, which is how she met Big Dick. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e36b37/32.png) [@Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_A_Tame_Lion)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/9 "2006-04-19T20:04:12Z")
> [@Otto](#): > > I believe that Kendall’s character has been established as being a former Laker girl, which is how she met Big Dick. Isn’t that how they all meet big dick? (Spoiler box to protect the innocent from raunchy pun. Your painful groans greatly appreciated.) ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/10 "2006-04-19T20:37:28Z")
> [@Otto](#): > > IIRC he confessed to Veronica while he was busy trapping her in a container of some sort (wooden crate? Been a while since I’ve seen the season finale) and setting her on fire. I really wish I had the DVDs at moments like this. I’m pretty sure he confessed, but I can’t remember exactly who said what. **Not A Tame Lion** , you’re right about her saying she knew it wasn’t loaded. She’s wrong though; she wasn’t staring at that car every minute from the time she removed the bullets in the garage until it pulled up in front of Kendall’s house. She went to the office and then worked a partial shift at the coffee shop before following the car. Those bullets could have been replaced at any time. Veronica of all people should know to assume all guns are loaded at all times, but her “you hung up on me before I could tell you” statement does negate my brilliant theory. ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/11 "2006-04-19T20:38:49Z")
> [@Not A Tame Lion](#): > > (Spoiler box to protect the innocent from raunchy pun. Your painful groans greatly appreciated.) Dude, the innocent shouldn’t even be watching this show. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e36b37/32.png) [@Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_A_Tame_Lion)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/12 "2006-04-19T20:44:34Z")
> [@cbawlmer](#): > > Dude, the innocent shouldn’t even be watching this show. 😉 Agreed. And I think the gun thing was just bad/manipulative writing. I come down on the show when it does stuff like that because it doesn’t need to–it’s entertaining enough as it is. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/13 "2006-04-19T21:36:44Z")
> [@cbawlmer](#): > > I really wish I had the DVDs at moments like this. I’m pretty sure he confessed, but I can’t remember exactly who said what. I got a Target gift card for my birthday yesterday. I may have to buy S1, just for instances such as these. ---
**Author:** ![Amok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f17d59/32.png) [@Amok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amok)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/14 "2006-04-19T21:47:16Z")
> [@cbawlmer](#): > > I really wish I had the DVDs at moments like this. I’m pretty sure he confessed, but I can’t remember exactly who said what. He doesn’t confess exactly, as in actually saying “I killed Lilly”, but between what he does say and his actions, it’s very strongly implied. Aaron has locked Veronica in a fridge in the backyard of some house and is talking to her over the walkie-talkies she had in car. As the action goes on he starts pouring gasoline over the fridge. > [@](#): > > Aaron: Veronica, dear, where are my tapes? I’ll let you out as soon as I have my tapes back. > > Veronica: No, thanks. Honestly, I feel safer in here. > > Aaron: Well, you know, you shouldn’t. You wanna know something about Joan of Arc, Veronica? Huh? God didn’t really talk to her. Uh-uh. It’s true. I saw it on TV. You know, it was one of those historical forensic programs. And they decided she had a brain tumour. Burned alive. What a waste. She thought her death meant something. But all it meant was she was crazy. Think about that, Veronica. Where are the tapes? Where are the tapes? Veronica, where are the tapes? Veronica, where are the tapes? Where are the tapes? _You know, Lilly never told me where the tapes were hidden either_. I-I kinda think there’s a cautionary tale in that, Veronica. Something like I’m not going to let a seventeen year-old piece of ass ruin my life! Emphasis mine. There might be other ways to interpret what he says, but I think that he killed Lilly is the most clear one. Especially given what’s happening at the time. ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/15 "2006-04-19T22:28:30Z")
But you \*could \* interpret his statements as, “I’m absolutely guilty of statutory rape, and then the girl got murdered, and if people find out I slept with her they’ll think I killed her too and I really don’t want to go to jail for either of those crimes.” I think that’s the story he’s stuck to when discussing it this season. Since Logan destroyed the sex video, the case is mostly circumstantial and a good lawyer could poke a lot of holes in it. This is pure speculation on my part, but I think Aaron’s going to go free. I’m not sure they’d make such a big deal out of the trial if he was going to be convicted. There’s no drama in a conviction because we already had the catharsis of the solved (or should it be “solved”?) crime last year. It’s way more dramatic if he goes free and is wandering around bedeviling Logan and Veronica next year. Thanks for that, **Amok**. I could’ve sworn she was trapped in a refrigerator but I wasn’t sure I was remembering right. ---
**Author:** ![furnishesq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/977dab/32.png) [@furnishesq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furnishesq)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/16 "2006-04-19T22:37:15Z")
My guess is that Jackie herself is responsible for the bus crash (not her father) This explains why she is even in this series – they spend too much time on her otherwise – this will be the season finale “twist” we are expecting. ---
**Author:** ![Achren](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/898d66/32.png) [@Achren](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achren)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2006, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/17 "2006-04-20T02:20:45Z")
You’d think Liam would notice the weight difference with an unloaded gun. And what about the Woodman? V’s never really considered him, but there are several clues floating around that suggest he could’ve been involved in the crash. And now we know he called Gia to see where they were…(though could he have know where the bus was from that? if it was the bus that was the target and not the limo?) ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2006, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/18 "2006-04-20T04:05:53Z")
> [@cbawlmer](#): > > But you \*could \* interpret his statements as, “I’m absolutely guilty of statutory rape, and then the girl got murdered, and if people find out I slept with her they’ll think I killed her too and I really don’t want to go to jail for either of those crimes.” I think that’s the story he’s stuck to when discussing it this season. Since Logan destroyed the sex video, the case is mostly circumstantial and a good lawyer could poke a lot of holes in it. I have this vague memory that statutory rape requires a complaining witness, but I could be wrong. Cali-Doper lawyers? Even if he wriggles out of the murder conviction (and I’ve thought for a while that he will) he’s still nailed pretty stone cold for the attempted murder of Veronica. But it’s a celebrity defendant in front of a California jury… ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/veronica-mars-4-18-06/353327/19 "2006-04-21T17:53:48Z")
> [@cbawlmer](#): > > **Not A Tame Lion** , you’re right about her saying she knew it wasn’t loaded. She’s wrong though; she wasn’t staring at that car every minute from the time she removed the bullets in the garage until it pulled up in front of Kendall’s house. She went to the office and then worked a partial shift at the coffee shop before following the car. Those bullets could have been replaced at any time. Veronica of all people should know to assume all guns are loaded at all times, but her “you hung up on me before I could tell you” statement does negate my brilliant theory. I don’t know. After the fact, she could say “I knew it wasn’t loaded and I could have told you that.” But that’s once she knew for absolute certain that it wasn’t loaded. Before she knew it for certain, she probably would have said, “It might not be loaded. I took the bullets.” But her father’s words confirmed what she thought might be true, moving it from a supposition to a certainty. Would she have risked her father’s life on it? I don’t think so. Would that character take the opportunity to rib her father about it? I think so.