# Vice Presidential Debate Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 7, 2012, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999 "2012-10-07T16:46:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2012, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/21 "2012-10-09T04:44:02Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > He also claimed he had three degrees, when he only has one. He claimed that he graduated in the top half of his law school class, but in fact he graduated 76th out of 85. Could you like cite all of the above claims please? As for 3 degrees, a double major undergrad and JD count as 2 if not 3 degrees. Not to mention that he also passed the Bar. But I think that is quibbling over semantics. Assuming that wiki is correct: [Joe Biden - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_biden) Glad to see you’re politically correct and assuming a used car salesman is a “sales executive” :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2012, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/22 "2012-10-09T05:47:49Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I think Ryan will be very careful with his facts, knowing that the media has a narrative ready to go and is just waiting to pounce on anything they consider dishonest. :rolleyes: You do understand that “the media” includes Fox, etc.? ---
**Author:** ![Nazarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nazarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nazarene)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/23 "2012-10-10T04:48:08Z")
I guess simply showing the video of what somebody says and does is now a “media narrative.” ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/24 "2012-10-10T23:47:58Z")
I have to say that I was pleased to read this article and see a couple of things; [http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/10/10/cnn-exclusive-paul-ryan-hasnt-called-palin-for-advice/?hpt=hp\_t2](http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/10/10/cnn-exclusive-paul-ryan-hasnt-called-palin-for-advice/?hpt=hp_t2) 1\> As the title says, Paul Ryan hasn’t called Sarah Palin for advice. \ I’m not sure who would. “Go rogue!” isn’t solid or helpful advice. 1. Ryan says “Actually, we’ve gotten along quite well over the years. I like Joe personally quite a bit I just disagree with his policies.” I appreciate this on several levels. Much better for all of us than the “My opponent is a demon from hell who means to destroy America!” nonsense some of those idiots spew. ---
**Author:** ![Dob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Dob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dob)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/25 "2012-10-11T15:39:24Z")
Biden should do well, he’s run for President like 3 times already so he knows the game and he is no stranger to being on the stage like this. Concern should be the desire to overcompensate on his talking points because of how bad Obama did. You dont want to come off as the cranky old man yelling at the kid to get off his lawn. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/26 "2012-10-11T17:42:10Z")
Everyone I saw on the morning shows was trying to downplay their own candidates. The Republicans, including Ryan, were says “Biden has years of experience and should do well. This is Ryan’s first debate.” The Democrats were building up Ryan as a smart guy with lots of experience. Neither party seems to be very sure of their picks. I predict Ryan will stick his foot in his mouth but Biden, with his greater experience, will win it by getting both feet in his. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/27 "2012-10-11T18:05:59Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I know this board has concluded that Ryan is a serial liar because he didn’t state a 20-year-old marathon time correctly, but if Biden goes after him as a ‘liar’, Ryan will have the ammo to tear him apart. I’d be willing to bet the Obama campaign debate prep guys have warned Biden repeatedly to stay away from the word ‘lie’ or anything like it. Of course, that doesn’t mean he will. Gross oversimplification. Ryan is a liar because nearly every talking point of his has been proven to be a falsehood. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/28 "2012-10-11T18:07:49Z")
A lot depends on what subject dominates the debate. On the economy, it could go either way. On the gender gap, well, you have a debate between the author of the Violence Against Women act and somebody who just had to distance himself from [another GOP advocate of the “bitches be lyin’” school of rape studies](http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/ryan-withdraws-endorsement-of-rivard-after-some-girls-rape-easy-remarks-a076ln1-173718041.html). Predictions on other issues I leave an an exercise for the student. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/29 "2012-10-11T18:19:58Z")
Whereas I thought the media narrative was primed for a comeback story prior to the first presidential debate, I think the narratives waiting to be activated here are more advantageous to the Obama campaign. One possible narrative is about a steady or even strong performance from the gaffe-machine. But I don’t know that this is a terribly interesting story, or one that’s particularly good for Obama. If that’s the story on Friday, that’s a Romney victory. But another possible narrative is about the evasiveness of the Romney campaign on basic policy positions, like whether it will in fact seek to cut tax rates by 20% across the board as so many times previously promised. If Ryan seems evasive on this point (“I don’t have time to explain” style), then I think the narrative will seize on that somewhat to the benefit of Obama. The only thing I could see pushing the media off one of those first two is some kind of strong attack about Libya that Biden doesn’t handle well. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/30 "2012-10-11T18:48:26Z")
Ryan is going to win this one hands-down. The media won’t have any story otherwise. I predict that Ryan will be unflappable and opaque, while Biden will be obtuse and strident. Both will lie, and neither will call the other out on it in any terms other than “I disagree.” Ryan will have math. It won’t add up, but it will sound good. ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/31 "2012-10-11T19:00:29Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > 6-pack vs. Mr. Gaffe Machine. Which is which? Joe six-pack vs. lyin’ Ryan?😛 ---
**Author:** ![a35362](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3da27b/32.png) [@a35362](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/a35362)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/32 "2012-10-11T19:06:41Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Gross oversimplification. Ryan is a liar because nearly every talking point of his has been proven to be a falsehood. It’s not a lie if you believe what you’re saying. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Anduril](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c0e974/32.png) [@Anduril](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anduril)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/33 "2012-10-11T19:15:18Z")
This is a hard one to call. Biden is a veteran when it comes to these types of debates but his performance, while not bad, hasn’t been very strong. Ryan would probably stick to Gish Galloping but I don’t think it will be as effective on Biden as it was on Obama during the 1st presidential debate. And Ryan, while he cuts a nice figure, is not exactly exciting - he’s almost wooden. Meh. Unless Biden surprises us, I don’t think the polling will be influenced one way or the other. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/34 "2012-10-11T19:48:22Z")
I initially stated in the previous debate thread that I thought Ryan would win easily because Biden is not the sharpest knife in the drawer. However, I’ve been reading that Biden is going to try to play the aggressor, which could be very effective. I think if he’s forceful and perhaps a bit condescending, he might be able to intimidate Ryan. At that point, it won’t matter if he’s truthful as long as he can make Ryan look uncomfortable. That’s why Romney was the perceived winner and got a bump after the first debate; not because everyone bought what he said, but because Obama handled it awkwardly. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/35 "2012-10-11T20:29:05Z")
[Paul Ryan is so totally ready for this](https://www.google.com/search?q=paul+ryan+time+photo+spread&hl=en&safe=off&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&rlz=1I7RNRN_enUS413&prmd=imvnsuo&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=8St3UMq1C6Tw0gG5_YG4CQ&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1440&bih=719). ---
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/36 "2012-10-11T20:36:18Z")
Those pictures are\* incredible\*. ---
**Author:** ![babygoat666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2acd7d/32.png) [@babygoat666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/babygoat666)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/37 "2012-10-11T20:41:57Z")
Why does that man’s mouth never open when he smiles? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/38 "2012-10-11T21:20:28Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I initially stated in the previous debate thread that I thought Ryan would win easily because Biden is not the sharpest knife in the drawer. However, I’ve been reading that Biden is going to try to play the aggressor, which could be very effective. I think if he’s forceful and perhaps a bit condescending, he might be able to intimidate Ryan. At that point, it won’t matter if he’s truthful as long as he can make Ryan look uncomfortable. That’s why Romney was the perceived winner and got a bump after the first debate; not because everyone bought what he said, but because Obama handled it awkwardly. That’s a possibility, but it’s also a very risky strategy because if it doesn’t come across perfectly, it can easily look like Biden is being a bully. Ryan has a very soft-spoken, matter-of-fact way of speaking, and he looks like the all-American boy. If Biden tears into him, it could easily cause a backlash if he goes too far. It’s also risky in that if Biden slings out BS of his own, Ryan is very capable of calling him on it. Ryan knows Washington and he knows the numbers in the kinds of detail that Sarah Palin did not. If Biden tries to steamroller him with bullshit, Ryan could come back with a flurry of numbers and facts that make Biden look like he’s all bluster while Ryan is the serious one in the room. I agree that it’s possibly a winning strategy to come out angry and to go negative on Ryan. But it’s very risky, and could turn an even debate into a disaster for Biden if it’s not executed perfectly. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/39 "2012-10-11T21:55:21Z")
[https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A49IVd1CEAIRbEf.png:large](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A49IVd1CEAIRbEf.png:large) Ryan speaking for the 2008 stimulus and against the 2009 stimulus. Bonus Ryan GIF and Fark: [http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web05/2012/10/11/11/anigif\_enhanced-buzz-14630-1349970843-11.gif](http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web05/2012/10/11/11/anigif_enhanced-buzz-14630-1349970843-11.gif) [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A49IVd1CEAIRbEf.png:large](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A49IVd1CEAIRbEf.png:large) ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999/40 "2012-10-11T22:01:56Z")
I think you goofed your first link, **BigAppleBucky**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vice-presidential-debate-thread/636999.md?page=3)