# Villains with a point **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** comic-books-manga\ **Created:** [September 5, 2020, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885 "2020-09-05T16:17:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Galactus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galactus/32/3581_2.png) [@Galactus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Galactus)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/21 "2020-09-05T21:34:28Z")
Elmer J. Fudd was just trying to put food on the table. Rabbits and ducks were in season. ---
**Author:** ![SwissMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e79b87/32.png) [@SwissMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwissMan)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/22 "2020-09-05T21:35:36Z")
Given what terrible meat rabbits make, I would have advised Elmer to stick with the duck. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/23 "2020-09-05T21:37:39Z")
> [@Galactus](#): > > Elmer J. Fudd was just trying to put food on the table. Rabbits and ducks were in season. Actually, there is some debate on that last point. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/24 "2020-09-05T22:02:52Z")
As for the OP, I actually don’t think Erik is the villian at all. Which is a bad thing for a movie. Here he is, raised in povery and crime, denied his heritage, and even worse, Wakanda has the ability to make the world a better place, and they hog and hide their tech. If I were him, I’d want to bring down the System, too. Other than the excess violence and fratricide, I’d support him, were I in the movie. At least in the move, unlike the status-quo comics, T’challa decided to share the resources of Wakanda. Considering the real-world problems of many African countries, Wakanda staying neutral makes them closer to a villain. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/25 "2020-09-05T22:16:02Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > As for the OP, I actually don’t think Erik is the villian at all. Which is a bad thing for a movie. > > Here he is, raised in povery and crime, denied his heritage, and even worse, Wakanda has the ability to make the world a better place, and they hog and hide their tech. If I were him, I’d want to bring down the System, too. Other than the excess violence and fratricide, I’d support him, were I in the movie. > > At least in the move, unlike the status-quo comics, T’challa decided to share the resources of Wakanda. Considering the real-world problems of many African countries, Wakanda staying neutral makes them closer to a villain Was about to post exactly this. Killmonger had a valid point - that Wakanda had a responsibility to use its power for the betterment of the world in general and the African diaspora in specific - and in the end, T’Challa admitted he was right, by his actions if not his words. Killmonger may have lost the battle with T’Challa, but he won the argument. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/26 "2020-09-05T22:18:32Z")
Isn’t that the “Indiana Jones solution” to the witch problem? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/27 "2020-09-05T22:23:33Z")
Thing is, though, Killmonger didn’t “win the argument”. T’Challa was already planning on opening up to the world and taking responsibility on the global stage. Killmonger’s position was that that wasn’t enough, and that Wakanda needed to take revenge on the white world. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/28 "2020-09-05T22:44:52Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Magneto seems to be a classic example. If I have this right, he survived the Holocaust (tattooed number on arm) and saw that non-Mutants would be afraid of mutants and was trying to stave off another genocide. His methods often were terrible, but he had a point. I’m going the other way. Mutants have always been held up as an allegory for civil rights early on and gay rights in the early 2000 movies, but the whole comparison falls apart due to the fact that mutants ARE seriously dangerous. In the first X-Men movie one concerned parent even throws out the classic homophobic standard “would would want one of them teaching your children?” which is ridiculous when applied to gay people, but on mutants? fucking no, keep them away from my kids. Even the so called good guys like Rogue are a complete menace. Girl knows damn well she can kill people with a touch and she still can’t help but smooch any one who makes a kissy face at her. Registering mutants and categorizing their powers is a perfectly humane and reasonable position for people to have. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/29 "2020-09-05T22:46:37Z")
The villains in _Stargirl_ were out to stop global warming, end discrimination, provide health care, and switch to clean energy. The downside was that 25 million people would die. Good plans, but terrible execution. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/30 "2020-09-05T22:59:20Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Thing is, though, Killmonger didn’t “win the argument”. T’Challa was already planning on opening up to the world and taking responsibility on the global stage. Killmonger’s position was that that wasn’t enough, and that Wakanda needed to take revenge on the white world Been a while since I saw the movie, so I might be misremembering. I knew Killmonger’s tactics were evil - sending Wakandan weapons out to terrorist organizations, IIRC - but I don’t remember T’Challa deciding to bring Wakanda out of the shadows until the end of the movie. And I do remember KM calling out his kinsman for ignoring the plight of the African diaspora. ---
**Author:** ![CardboardBoxx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardboardboxx/32/7079_2.png) [@CardboardBoxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CardboardBoxx)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/31 "2020-09-05T23:55:03Z")
It’s been a long time since I watched it, so the details are vague, but Scorpius from _Farscape_ seemed to me to be on the right side. His methods seem overly harsh to those caught in the sharp end, but all he was trying to do was stop the Scarrans, who were by far the biggest threat to everybody else. He’s basically Jack Bauer. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/32 "2020-09-06T00:32:52Z")
I always hated that line. If his ancestors had jumped from the ship, they wouldn’t be his ancestors because he wouldn’t exist. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/33 "2020-09-06T00:50:40Z")
Just because they jumped from a ship, doesn’t mean they didn’t have children. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/34 "2020-09-06T01:08:00Z")
Then why was he asking to be buried with them in the ocean? The implication is that they drowned rather than live as slaves. Although how they could have (jumped off the ship into the ocean) is up for question. I didn’t think they were ever taken onto the decks once they were on the transport ship and chained belowdecks, but I’m willing to learn different. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/35 "2020-09-06T01:13:49Z")
Just because you jump in the ocean doesn’t mean you don’t have any kids. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/36 "2020-09-06T01:17:48Z")
As in, had the children before they jumped in and it was the children who were enslaved? I hadn’t thought about that. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/37 "2020-09-06T01:28:51Z")
> [@Galactus](#): > > Elmer J. Fudd was just trying to put food on the table. Rabbits and ducks were in season. No, Elmer once said that he didn’t eat any of the animals he killed. He just hunted them for sport. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/38 "2020-09-06T01:35:58Z")
> [@solost](#): > > The principal in “Ferris Bueller’s Day Off” is usually brought up in discussions like these. Bueller was a troublemaking truant and the principal was just doing his job. Although, going about it somewhat obsessively. On a similar note, Walter Peck in _Ghostbusters_. He was a government official doing his job and he had every reason to be suspicious of what the Ghostbusters were doing. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/DQ2ucU0KTkI/maxresdefault.jpg "MovieClips - Ghostbusters (1984) - Walter Peck") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQ2ucU0KTkI) ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/39 "2020-09-06T02:01:33Z")
But did you tell him about the twinkie? ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885/40 "2020-09-06T02:04:26Z")
What about Dean Wormer? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/villains-with-a-point/919885.md?page=3)