# Vladimir Klitschko is a horrible champion **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [July 12, 2008, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269 "2008-07-12T21:43:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/1 "2008-07-12T21:43:04Z")
I can’t think of anyone who was a heavyweight champion for as long as he has been who would not have destroyed him. It’s a commentary on the state of the division that he is the best out there. ---
**Author:** ![Busy\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d78d45/32.png) [@Busy\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Busy_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/2 "2008-07-12T22:26:20Z")
Heavyweights do indeed suck at the moment. Didn’t see the fight - What was so horrible about Wlad? I don’t follow the heavies too closely, but there’s a guy called David Haye who gets a lot of coverage over here who is moving up. He was the world champion cruiserweight, and has the technique and personality to put some quality into the HW division. He’s got good skills and speed, outstanding power and an awesome physique. Unfortunately, there’s a question mark over his beard - he’s been put down by cruiserweights once or twice. I guess you can’t have everything. Modern boxing being what it is, Haye will probably get a shot at Wlad in 2015 once they’ve both wended their way through an interminable series of safe journeymen, fighting once a year ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/3 "2008-07-12T22:37:57Z")
[QUOTE=Busy Scissors] Heavyweights do indeed suck at the moment. Didn’t see the fight - What was so horrible about Wlad? [/QUOTE] He was nothing but an awkward headhunter, and occasional wrestler. He had a cut and both his eyes were mousing. The beginning of the end for Thompson was when Klischtko stepped on his foot and tackled him, hurting his leg. Any quality opposition could have taken him. Honestly, I’ve only seen him twice, and I’m less than impressed. The other fight (which I also started a thread on, I think) was simply a “let’s see who wins on jabs from four feet” contest. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/4 "2008-07-12T22:40:13Z")
There’s another guy boxing in the North West of England, with the wonderfully apt name of Tyson Fury, who is being touted as a GWH for the future HW scene. From the brief sights of him I’ve had, he seems far too crude to ever be a great HW, but he’s young and massive, and who knows? David Haye looks a far more likely world champion. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/5 "2008-07-12T22:42:37Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] He had a cut and both his eyes were mousing. [/QUOTE] I should, in fairness, add that his corner did great work on these. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/6 "2008-07-12T22:46:27Z")
[QUOTE=ivan astikov] David Haye looks a far more likely world champion. [/QUOTE] Never heard of him. His stats look good. Can he carry 220-230 pounds coming up from cruiser? ---
**Author:** ![Brandon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f08c70/32.png) [@Brandon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brandon)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/7 "2008-07-12T22:49:19Z")
Thompson lost the fight in his own mind way before Wlad did anything substantial to him. It was yawn-inducing watching that training session being passed off as a fight. In my opinion, the main things that were horrible about Wlad during that fight were his inability to finish off an already beaten opponent and his normal propensity for trying to induce a hug-fest. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/8 "2008-07-12T22:52:18Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] Never heard of him. His stats look good. Can he carry 220-230 pounds coming up from cruiser? [/QUOTE] I really don’t know, but he has big heart and big ambitions, and Holyfield and Tyson proved you don’t have to be the biggest HW to be the best HW. ---
**Author:** ![Busy\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d78d45/32.png) [@Busy\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Busy_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/9 "2008-07-12T22:54:31Z")
He probably would be OK, he was really killing himself to make weight for cruiser which was affecting his conditioning - he tired dramatically in fights. One of those examples of a chiselled, beautiful physique that seemed to have no stamina. Hopefully he’ll be more comfortable at the higher weight. Wlad has his limitations, but the few times I’ve seen him he’s been an exceptionally conditioned athlete. Good stamina into the later rounds, which must be very tough at heavyweight. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/10 "2008-07-12T23:13:38Z")
[QUOTE=Busy Scissors] Good stamina into the later rounds, which must be very tough at heavyweight. [/QUOTE] Pshaw. It’s not difficult at all to have stamina if you never exert yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/11 "2008-07-12T23:31:10Z")
You could switch to following MMA. It’s young enough that it’s free from most of the corruption, politics, and money-grubbing that has plagued boxing, but the heavyweight division also kind of sucks. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/12 "2008-07-12T23:48:30Z")
[QUOTE=Cisco] You could switch to following MMA. It’s young enough that it’s free from most of the corruption, politics, and money-grubbing that has plagued boxing, but the heavyweight division also kind of sucks. [/QUOTE] I know some will argue that he has avoided the real big guns in MMA, but that Fedor looks awesome in some of the fights I’ve seen him in. Do you rate the guy, Cisco? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/13 "2008-07-12T23:58:27Z")
[QUOTE=Cisco] You could switch to following MMA. It’s young enough that it’s free from most of the corruption, politics, and money-grubbing that has plagued boxing, but the heavyweight division also kind of sucks. [/QUOTE] Y’know, this is probably the subject of a different thread, but the MMA is too much for me. I like the Queensberry rules. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2008, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/14 "2008-07-12T23:58:45Z")
[QUOTE=ivan astikov] I know some will argue that he has avoided the real big guns in MMA, but that Fedor looks awesome in some of the fights I’ve seen him in. Do you rate the guy, Cisco? [/QUOTE] Yes. Undoubtably #1 at heavyweight and real close to the top pound for pound. Probably only behind BJ Penn. The amazing thing about Fedor is that he brings people’s strengths to them and beats them at their own game. He outstrikes the best strikers and outgrapples the best grapplers. I can’t think of anyone who deserves him that hasn’t got him, except maybe Tim, who is fighting him next week, and Randy, who should get the greenlight to fight him in October. If he gets past those two (and let’s face it - he will), I don’t see how anyone could question his status as heavyweight king. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/15 "2008-07-13T00:04:05Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] Y’know, this is probably the subject of a different thread, but the MMA is too much for me. I like the Queensberry rules. [/QUOTE] Sorry. I won’t derail any further, but a final comment in case you’re interested in discussing it anymore: MMA is far safer than boxing. There has never been a serious injury and only 1 death\* in over 15 years of the sport. Boxing, IIRC, averages one death per year, and has serious injuries out the wazoo. \*the guy had a pre-existing bloodclot ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/16 "2008-07-13T00:26:40Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] Y’know, this is probably the subject of a different thread, but the MMA is too much for me. I like the Queensberry rules. [/QUOTE] Sorry for the hijack Frank. What is your fave division then? I know all the romance and the glory goes to the big boys, but you can’t beat the middleweights, and downward for all-round action. Have you seen anything of the Brit prospect Amir Khan, yet? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/17 "2008-07-13T00:37:46Z")
[QUOTE=Busy Scissors] Heavyweights do indeed suck at the moment. Didn’t see the fight - What was so horrible about Wlad? I don’t follow the heavies too closely, but there’s a guy called David Haye who gets a lot of coverage over here who is moving up. He was the world champion cruiserweight, and has the technique and personality to put some quality into the HW division. He’s got good skills and speed, outstanding power and an awesome physique. Unfortunately, there’s a question mark over his beard - he’s been put down by cruiserweights once or twice. I guess you can’t have everything. Modern boxing being what it is, Haye will probably get a shot at Wlad in 2015 once they’ve both wended their way through an interminable series of safe journeymen, fighting once a year ☹ [/QUOTE] Wlad is huge. He is 6-6 1/2 . A cruiserweight might have trouble handling his size. He leans on his opponent and lets his weight wear them down. He is a ugly,clumsy fighter. In last nights fight he wore his opponent down by hanging on him. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/18 "2008-07-13T00:42:22Z")
[QUOTE=ivan astikov] What is your fave division then? [/QUOTE] Well, heavys, obviously. 😛 I don’t mind watching the lower weights from time to time, but I prefer good heavyweights. There just aren’t any right now. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/19 "2008-07-13T00:58:28Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] Well, heavys, obviously. 😛 I don’t mind watching the lower weights from time to time, but I prefer good heavyweights. There just aren’t any right now. ☹ [/QUOTE] Are you willing to humour my Heavyweight Conspiracy Theory, Frank? 🙂 How about the idea that Mike Tyson was told by the Mafia to throw his Buster Douglas fight, so that he could not challenge Marciano’s 49 - 0 record? Watching that fight in slo-mo, it sure looked as if he might have held his guard low for Douglas’s right. Am I speaking out of my ass again, or what, Frank? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269/20 "2008-07-13T01:13:47Z")
[QUOTE=ivan astikov] Are you willing to humour my Heavyweight Conspiracy Theory, Frank? 🙂 How about the idea that Mike Tyson was told by the Mafia to throw his Buster Douglas fight, so that he could not challenge Marciano’s 49 - 0 record? Watching that fight in slo-mo, it sure looked as if he might have held his guard low for Douglas’s right. Am I speaking out of my ass again, or what, Frank? 😃 [/QUOTE] No, sorry, definitely talking out of your ass again. I’ll vaguely agree that the ref gave Tyson a slow count, or possibly I’ll vaguely agree that the ref gave Douglas a fast count the round or two earlier, or possibly I’ll vaguely agree to both, but I’ll definitely state that Douglas won. Tyson crawling around on the canvas looking for his mouthpiece tells the story. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vladimir-klitschko-is-a-horrible-champion/456269.md?page=2)