# Voter id rules suffer string of court losses **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 3, 2016, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646 "2016-08-03T16:18:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/1 "2016-08-03T16:18:38Z")
I was surprised there wasn’t a thread about this. I usually see Bricker start threads about these kinds of decisions An [NPR story summarizes the rulings](http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/08/02/488392765/as-november-approaches-courts-deal-series-of-blows-to-voter-id-laws) in Kansas, Texas, North Dakota, Wisconsin and North Carolina. As the story mentions, it is not coincidence that so many of these cases were before the courts: > [@](#): > > In 2013, the Supreme Court struck down a key provision of the 1965 Voting Rights Act. The act said the federal government had to approve any changes to the voting process in certain states — ones with a history of discrimination. > > In _Shelby County v. Holder_, the Supreme Court said the formula used to determine which states qualify was outdated, and the requirement couldn’t be enforced until Congress comes up with a new standard. > > Since then, a “blizzard” of changes have been carried out by state and local authorities, as the New York Times reported over the weekend. The North Carolina decision was fairly damning with the court saying the new voting regulations were clearly designed to be discriminatory. > [@](#): > > "The appeals court noted that the North Carolina Legislature ‘requested data on the use, by race, of a number of voting practices’ — then, data in hand, ‘enacted legislation that restricted voting and registration in five different ways, all of which disproportionately affected African Americans.’ " So how will this affect the election? The Texas ruling apparently just punted the case back to the lower court until after November. I believe that only North Carolina and Wisconsin are the real “swing states” among the group. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/2 "2016-08-03T16:28:33Z")
In terms of the effect on the election, it’s obviously good for Democrats that more qualified voters can do so. It’s also good for Democrats to have the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals stating that the North Carolina legislature was trying to illegally suppress the black vote, because that kind of thing motivates black voters to get to the polls and punish them. Quite appropriately! To be fair to **Bricker** , a lot of these decisions were not about voter ID, or only partly about voter ID. The biggest issues were things like rolling back early voting in a way precisely designed to suppress black voters. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/3 "2016-08-03T16:30:57Z")
Not a new thread, but the North Carolina decision is being discussed extensively (with significant contributions from **Bricker** ) in the ongoing thread [I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=655025) starting at post #9694. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/4 "2016-08-03T16:35:19Z")
The North Carolina one is pretty shocking. How in the hell did they think they could get away with being so blatant? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/5 "2016-08-03T16:40:24Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > The North Carolina one is pretty shocking. How in the hell did they think they could get away with being so blatant? They got the Supreme Court to strike down key portions of the Voting Rights Act first. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/6 "2016-08-03T16:59:31Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > They got the Supreme Court to strike down key portions of the Voting Rights Act first. Well that’s what gave them the opening but it doesn’t explain the audacity of publicly researching racial voting patterns then enacting legislation targeted at African Americans. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/7 "2016-08-03T17:00:45Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Well that’s what gave them the opening but it doesn’t explain the audacity of publicly researching racial voting patterns then enacting legislation targeted at African Americans. Racists are not generally known for being clever or sneaky. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/8 "2016-08-03T17:20:01Z")
Racists come in all sorts. But since this is in Elections, I am more interested in how this will actually affect things rather than go on about how evil voter id laws are. As Richard Parker said above, some of the findings of the court could be galvanizing. Clinton is holding a decent lead already in NC, this could make it a lock. I’m unsure how many actual more votes these rulings will make possible i.e. will there be a perceptible rise in voting numbers. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/9 "2016-08-03T18:54:32Z")
I think the recent SCOTUS rulings when Scalia was alive emboldened the racists. These things were probably set in motion before Scalia died and they thought they could get away with them. Once Clinton gets someone on the SCOTUS, we’ll see much more insidious laws that are not so blatant. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/10 "2016-08-03T19:45:53Z")
I hope it means that the days are numbered for the similar laws here in TN and elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/11 "2016-08-03T19:52:19Z")
[Fivethirtyeight](http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/tighter-restrictions-are-losing-in-the-battle-over-voter-id-laws/) discusses the effects on the election. My takeaway is this: > [@](#): > > In 2012, my boss Nate Silver found that the academic literature on this question was in broad agreement: Voter ID laws “seem to decrease turnout by about 2 percent as a share of the registered voter population.” > > Indeed, a 2014 Government Accountability Office report, one of the most cited pieces of research on this topic, looked at two states (Kansas and Tennessee) that added voter ID requirements, compared with a handful of states that did not. It found, essentially, that the requirements depressed turnout somewhere between 2 and 3 percentage points. The research doesn’t look specifically at nonwhite vs. white, or Democratic vs. Republican, turnout. However, my understanding from other research, including that performed by NC Republicans, is that the depression in turnout will disproportionately affect nonwhite Democratic voters. In close elections, the success of such laws may result in a Republican victory; having such laws blocked may allow enough people to vote that the existing Democratic majority can actually win the election. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/12 "2016-08-03T20:11:20Z")
Thanks, it’s good to have a number but the article you linked does indeed get into black v white and Dem v Rep changes: > [@](#): > > . A paper forthcoming in the Journal of Politics, titled “Voter Identification Laws and the Suppression of Minority Votes” and written by a trio of political scientists, finds that, in the presence of strict ID laws, the predicted gap in participation between black and white voters in general elections increases from 2.9 points to 5.1 points, and in primaries increases from 2.5 points to 11.6 points. A similar result holds for the gap between Latino and white voters. More starkly, they find “that voter ID laws skew democracy toward those on the political right.” Plus the graph they used: [http://i1.wp.com/espnfivethirtyeight.files.wordpress.com/2016/08/screen-shot-2016-08-03-at-11-37-47-am.png?quality=90&strip=all&w=575&ssl=1](http://i1.wp.com/espnfivethirtyeight.files.wordpress.com/2016/08/screen-shot-2016-08-03-at-11-37-47-am.png?quality=90&strip=all&w=575&ssl=1) And I assume, these numbers mean a lot more for downballot races. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/13 "2016-08-03T20:34:09Z")
Trump said these rulings were designed to hand the election to Hillary. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/14 "2016-08-03T20:38:40Z")
North Carolina got hit hard because they so obviously meant to hit African American voters. And then somewhere (was it John Oliver?) some guy tried to defend it saying they weren’t targeting African Americans, just Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2016, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/15 "2016-08-03T21:17:02Z")
Ha ha. But you can see the distinction. “Hey, I am a partisan asshole not a racist asshole! If black people voted for Republicans I’d have no problem with them!” ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2016, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/16 "2016-08-04T13:12:35Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > So how will this affect the election? The Texas ruling apparently just punted the case back to the lower court until after November. Just wanted to correct myself here: The Houston Chronicle is reporting today that an agreement has been reached to greatly expand what ID is valid in Texas along with a bunch of other concession. If it’s approved by the federal judge it will be in place for the November election. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2016, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/17 "2016-08-04T14:06:23Z")
They got greedy. Simple as that. The original plan, as hammered out by the Gnomes of ALEC, was more modest in its goals: simply trim away about one or two percentage points from the overall Dem turnout. That, coupled with exquisitely precise gerrymandering, would give an overall Republican advantage, they would win more of the close elections than they would lose. This was the plan of sane and careful cynicism. But somewhere along the line, the batshit baboon brigade took control and wanted to run the table. Why win when you can crush? The Republican’s America is the _real_ America, America is a conservative country, America is a center right country, and everybody knows it. You don’t have to prove it because everybody knows it. Therefore it follows that the only way Dems could have been winning _anything_ was voter fraud. A plausible scenario for a mind that simply refuses fact. We have it on the very best authority that “some” Republicans had malign motives in all of this. But it seems likely to me that others simply believed that they were undoing a great wrong that had been inflicted upon them, they were setting things right. Because the Dem voting fraud was so massive and pervasive, this simple expedient would crush their nefarious scheme. A small but consistent advantage? Ha! They would crush! But the best laid plans of moose and men aft gang unglued! ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2016, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/18 "2016-09-01T03:46:48Z")
> [@](#): > > The Supreme Court will not allow North Carolina in the November election to use its strict voting law that a lower court found was enacted “with almost surgical precision” to blunt the influence of African American voters. > > An evenly divided court said Wednesday that it would not restore the law that a unanimous panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 4th Circuit found unconstitutional. The court’s short order did not give the justices’ reasoning. It was not a ruling on the merits of the law but instead on an emergency stay request filed by Gov. Pat McCrory (R) to use the law this fall, as the state had in previous elections. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts\_law/supreme-court-wont-let-north-carolina-use-strict-voting-law/2016/08/31/b5187080-6ed6-11e6-8533-6b0b0ded0253\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/supreme-court-wont-let-north-carolina-use-strict-voting-law/2016/08/31/b5187080-6ed6-11e6-8533-6b0b0ded0253_story.html) ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2016, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/19 "2016-09-01T10:16:03Z")
If Trump wins and if the GOP keeps congress, the first item of business (besides the deportation of illegals) will be loading the courts with right wing ideological warriors, not Ivy League grads but alumni from some online for-profit college (Trump U, maybe?). The damage to the judiciary would not be reversed in our lifetime, and maybe not even in our children’s lifetime. Seriously, folks, any left-leaning voter who is so blindly angry at Hillary that they can’t see the danger here is just voting against their own interests. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2016, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646/20 "2016-09-01T13:26:53Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > I was surprised there wasn’t a thread about this. I usually see Bricker start threads about these kinds of decisions Most of them get discussed in this [short thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=655025) in the BBQ Pit. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voter-id-rules-suffer-string-of-court-losses/761646.md?page=2)