# Voters born in the '90s need to get a clue **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 20, 2016, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423 "2016-09-20T07:59:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/21 "2016-09-20T13:23:29Z")
Why, when I was their age we had to fight just to be able to vote in the first place! I’d ask them to get off my lawn, but with the drought and everything, there isn’t much of one left!! ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/22 "2016-09-20T13:26:09Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > No. Most millennials will not vote for Clinton. Most will not vote, period. That makes them my kind of people, not yours. > > Millenials are an interesting bunch. They say they are ok with socialism. They also happen to be the generation most spoiled by capitalism in the history of the world. Even the millenials who grew up poor had it pretty damn good. They get what they want when they want it. They throw a fit at even the most mundane of consumer inconveniences. > > They do not fit into the martial-civic character of the post-war period. They do not want to sacrifice their material well-being for the greatness of the state. Previous generations have warbled hosannas at the feet of the state and its institutions, particularly its institutions of death and chaos. > > This is why democracy just doesn’t jive with them. They see the multitude of options and solutions to problems that the market brings to the table. They have seen this their whole life. Then every few years they look at the grotesque figures politics brings to the table. They don’t understand their confusion and unhappiness, but they know it is not right. My hope is that they are the generation to begin to unravel the state and begin what previous generations were too cowardly to do. I doubt it, but who knows. Ideas can change things rather quickly in a society. So the lazy and entitled generation, too self centered and disillusioned to vote, are going to be revolutionaries? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/23 "2016-09-20T13:27:16Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Yes. I usually push back against the “special snowflake” characterization, but stuff like this makes it hard. Tell me, are other generations embracing Hillary Clinton with great enthusiasm? If so, she should be murdering Trumpo in the polls. But… um, no, they are not. Sorting by age cohort, Clinton is doing much better with “Millennials” than with older voters. So honestly, your criticism is senseless. You have single out for criticism of insufficient support for Clinton the cohort **that is the most likely to vote for Clinton and not Trump.** Why aren’t you complaining about the age groups that are actually leaning Trump? ---
**Author:** ![inscrutable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a88e4f/32.png) [@inscrutable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inscrutable)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/24 "2016-09-20T13:28:25Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > People who are, as I posted on the 2015 thread I linked to, “the most sensitive, least violent, least bullying, least racist, least homophobic, most globally-minded, most compassionate, most environmentally-conscious, least dogmatic, and overall kindest group of young people this country has ever known” should know better than a bunch of old white people who grew up in an era notorious for conservative conformity, as part of the whitest and most native-born generation this country has ever known. How about that? Yeah, yeah, yeah, we were all idealistic when we were young and naive… ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/25 "2016-09-20T13:29:49Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Hey guys, remember this completely patronizing attitude towards anyone who wasn’t in the bag for Clinton? It’s ok if you don’t remember, it was almost 6 months ago. > > Here’s the thing, Hillary Clinton, her supporters, and the DNC that allowed her to basically run unopposed are the ones here who have been divorced from reality. It was clear from the outset that she wasn’t a strong candidate, but millennials were lectured down to, told what a great statesman she was, how bloody _electable_ she was. Guess what? She’s not electable. She’s a terrible candidate, and the reason there was so much excitement about Bernie wasn’t necessarily that Bernie was a great candidate (although I think Nate Silver has argued otherwise on this point) is because at least he was a viable alternative. Millennials saw it a year ago, how terrible her candidacy was going to go. But nope, they were told to let the adults handle this one. > > Well guess what? You messed up, you nominated her and now it’s looking like (holy shit!) she might actually lose, just like some millennials were saying months ago. So now you come, not hat-in-hand asking them pretty please to vote for her, but _still talking down to them._ The fucking balls on this guy, seriously. Condescension towards the Bernie Bros and keeping minorities on the political plantation won’t hurt the Dems. Those are captive audiences. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/26 "2016-09-20T13:34:40Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Condescension towards the Bernie Bros and keeping minorities on the political plantation won’t hurt the Dems. Those are captive audiences. Tell that to **SlackerInc** , he’s under the impression that Bernie Bros are threatening to vote 3rd party _en masse_. So which is it? Are they a sure thing or are they the only thing standing between us and president Trump? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/27 "2016-09-20T13:34:47Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Millenials are an interesting bunch. They say they are ok with socialism. … My hope is that they are the generation to begin to unravel the state and begin what previous generations were too cowardly to do. Yeah, socialism, libertarianism…basically the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/28 "2016-09-20T13:50:47Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Well guess what? You messed up, you nominated her and now it’s looking like (holy shit!) she might actually lose, just like some millennials were saying months ago. So now you come, not hat-in-hand asking them pretty please to vote for her, but _still talking down to them._ The fucking balls on this guy, seriously. You completely miss the point. A bad option is better than a worse option. Just because Clinton is looking shaky doesn’t mean that Bernie (or whoever) would have been less shaky. It’s piss poor logic to suggest otherwise. Further, anyone who won’t vote for a less worse candidate because they didn’t get their preferred candidate is a childish idiot, and deserves talking down to. Your position might make sense if older dems put up someone who was unlikely to win the election, while millennials suggested someone more likely to win; but that isn’t the position. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/29 "2016-09-20T13:55:31Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Tell that to **SlackerInc** , he’s under the impression that Bernie Bros are threatening to vote 3rd party _en masse_. So which is it? Are they a sure thing or are they the only thing standing between us and president Trump? The group that gets terminally triggered by a sombrero? What do you think a Trump presidency would do to their minds? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/30 "2016-09-20T13:55:44Z")
Mr and Mrs Clinton complement each other. He won an unwinnable election. She is looking ready to lose an unlosable one. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/31 "2016-09-20T14:01:12Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Tell me, are other generations embracing Hillary Clinton with great enthusiasm? If so, she should be murdering Trumpo in the polls. But… um, no, they are not. Sorting by age cohort, Clinton is doing much better with “Millennials” than with older voters. > > So honestly, your criticism is senseless. You have single out for criticism of insufficient support for Clinton the cohort **that is the most likely to vote for Clinton and not Trump.** > > Why aren’t you complaining about the age groups that are actually leaning Trump? I already mostly explained this upthread, repeatedly. But let me put it another way: Show me another demographic group who strongly supported Obama in 2012, not only by percentages but with strong turnout, and who show indications of not coming out for Hillary this time (either not voting or going third party) despite continuing to express support for Obama, and I’ll criticize them equally strongly. Fair? ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/32 "2016-09-20T14:08:13Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > You completely miss the point. A bad option is better than a worse option. Just because Clinton is looking shaky doesn’t mean that Bernie (or whoever) would have been less shaky. It’s piss poor logic to suggest otherwise. Well you’re right of course, none of us can say for certain what _would_ have happened in an alternate universe where Clinton hadn’t locked up the primary before it even started. > [@Princhester](#): > > Further, anyone who won’t vote for a less worse candidate because they didn’t get their preferred candidate is a childish idiot, and deserves talking down to. \ I dunno, maybe. Probably. I just want Clinton supporters to show some remorse; talking down to people isn’t a great way to do that. This is like Walking Dead levels of stupidity here, where Rick puts everyone in a terrible position and then convinces everyone that he’s the only one who knows how to get them out of it. He might be right, but show some humility. > [@Princhester](#): > > Your position might make sense if older dems put up someone who was unlikely to win the election, while millennials suggested someone more likely to win; but that isn’t the position. What do you mean that isn’t the position? I thought you just said we can’t know if Bernie would have been less shaky. What is it, can we not know, or do you know? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/33 "2016-09-20T14:13:05Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I already mostly explained this upthread, repeatedly. But let me put it another way: > > Show me another demographic group who strongly supported Obama in 2012… This isn’t the 2012 election, and unless I missed some fairly major events, Barack Obama is not running again. If Trump is close to being elected, direct your vitriol at the people who are likely to vote for him. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/34 "2016-09-20T14:17:06Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Well you’re right of course, none of us can say for certain what _would_ have happened in an alternate universe where Clinton hadn’t locked up the primary before it even started. She did what now? My impression was that Bernie did damn well for a guy as far out on the left as he is, but he lost because he’s as far out on the left as he is. > [@](#): > > I just want Clinton supporters to show some remorse For what? Being right? > [@](#): > > What do you mean that isn’t the position? I thought you just said we can’t know if Bernie would have been less shaky. What is it, can we not know, or do you know? No what I said was merely because Clinton is shaky doesn’t mean Bernie would have been less shaky. My opinion is he would have been more shaky. I’ve never heard anyone who bases their views on objective evidence suggest otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/35 "2016-09-20T14:22:26Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > TIf Trump is close to being elected, direct your vitriol at the people who are likely to vote for him. There is a rational basis for directing more vitriol at people who are sufficiently self centred to cut off their nose to spite their face (and so won’t vote for Clinton), than at those who hold political views such that they won’t vote for Clinton. I’m not saying it’s _necessarily_ appropriate to direct more vitriol as stated, but it is not by any means an illogical position. Further, there is a rational argument for directing one’s vitriol in a direction where it may do some good. There is some chance that left wing snowflakes can be persuaded to hold their nose and vote Clinton. There is little chance that Trump supporters will change their minds. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/36 "2016-09-20T14:23:33Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > So the lazy and entitled generation, too self centered and disillusioned to vote, are going to be revolutionaries? No, capitalism is the revolution. They are disillusioned by government but not the market. Hardcore statist propaganda is the only thing preventing them from seeing the failures of central planning. > [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Yeah, socialism, libertarianism…basically the same thing. Libertarianism has nothing to do with it. You don’t need an ideology to notice the market works. You need an ideology to believe government works. This may be the downfall of markets, though, with the death of religion, democracy has attracted many fanatics. These are people who would in another age be whipping themselves with leather straps. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/37 "2016-09-20T14:26:37Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > You don’t need an ideology to notice the market works. You need an ideology to believe government works. These propositions are far, _far_ less self evident than I suspect you believe. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/38 "2016-09-20T14:29:51Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Libertarianism has nothing to do with it. You don’t need an ideology to notice the market works. You need an ideology to believe government works. Or, you could just pay attention to the world around you. Quality-of-life-wise, how are countries without a functioning government doing? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/39 "2016-09-20T14:31:44Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > This isn’t the 2012 election, and unless I missed some fairly major events, Barack Obama is not running again. > > If Trump is close to being elected, direct your vitriol at the people who are likely to vote for him. You’ve never played team sports, have you? If I’m a quarterback and my left tackle decides to take a play off, I’m going to be mad at _him_, not at the defensive lineman from the opposing team who knocked the stuffing out of me. > [@Princhester](#): > > There is a rational basis for directing more vitriol at people who are sufficiently self centred to cut off their nose to spite their face (and so won’t vote for Clinton), than at those who hold political views such that they won’t vote for Clinton. Right. And you make me think of another reason for my irritation (putting it mildly). The right wingers who hate Hillary aren’t going to be the ones forwarding me complaints about the terrible, xenophobic, racist, sexist policies of the Trump Administration, and appealing for me to help them rise up in protest against said policies. I will say, however, that at least the people I’m talking about aren’t spouting a lot of anarcho-capitalist claptrap. So it could be worse. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/40 "2016-09-20T14:40:39Z")
How DARE these ungrateful whippersnappers vote for the candidate they prefer instead of the candidate we told them told to vote for! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423.md?page=3)