# Voters born in the '90s need to get a clue **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 20, 2016, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423 "2016-09-20T07:59:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/101 "2016-09-21T01:47:07Z")
The youngsters were feelin’ the Bern, then he dropped out, so now they’re feelin’ the Johnson. Is that a surprise? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/102 "2016-09-21T01:53:57Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Kinda repeated yourself there. Yup. Saw it too late to edit. Should have said: > [@hypothetical me](#): > > You’ll notice his lack of telling young African Americans that they need to get a clue. You’ll note the lack of calling them special snowflakes, the lack of talking about how frustrated he is and how severely they’re trying his patience. Better? > [@](#): > > But sure: if you want to stand on technicalities, he did not use that exact verbiage. He just said “this isn’t a reality show” and that he’ll be personally insulted if they don’t wake up and smell the coffee and vote the way he’s asking them to. The differences are vast. :rolleyes: They actually are. I described the differences. If you’d like to believe your personal capital is at Obama’s level, or that your rhetoric is, I’m not going to bang my head against that wall. > [@](#): > > But what really amuses me is that I didn’t use the word “snowflake” either! LOL Sheesh, you might want to check that first next time. 😛 I’ll check again: > [@SlackerInc](#): > > Yes. I usually push back against the “special snowflake” characterization, but stuff like this makes it hard. Huh. You might want to check that first next time before denying it. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/103 "2016-09-21T02:00:39Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Huh. You might want to check that first next time before denying it. Touché. The weird thing is that I did a Ctrl-F on each of the three pages of the thread, and other than our rapid-fire exchange here, the only hit I got for “snowflake” was octopus’s mention. And now I try the same thing again, and still don’t get any other hits! WTF? 😕 That’s really weird. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/104 "2016-09-21T02:05:18Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Touché. The weird thing is that I did a Ctrl-F on each of the three pages of the thread, and other than our rapid-fire exchange here, the only hit I got for “snowflake” was octopus’s mention. And now I try the same thing again, and still don’t get any other hits! WTF? 😕 That’s really weird. Maybe you put an apostrophe in it. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/105 "2016-09-21T02:10:01Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Maybe you put an apostrophe in it. Shouldn’t matter, though, should it? Anyway, I was wrong, even though I tried to exert due diligence before making that assertion. Oh well. I still think Obama’s saying more or less the same thing. You are dismissing that as, essentially, “well, \*he \*can say it because he’s the **man** …but other Hillary supporters can’t”. Okay…I mean, I \*guess \*that’s an argument. No, it \*is \*an argument. I don’t think it’s a super duper \*awesome \*argument, but it is undeniably true that he’s the man and I am not. I would have thought your standard would still demand consistency regardless, but I guess not. ::shrug:: ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/106 "2016-09-21T02:18:11Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > If they are left of center, and do anything other than vote for Hillary, they are either a fool or a traitor, probably both. Sheesh, this guy just doesn’t know when to quit, does he. This is like our own little left-wing Doper version of the “basket of deplorables” fiasco. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/107 "2016-09-21T02:34:01Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Sheesh, this guy just doesn’t know when to quit, does he. This is like our own little left-wing Doper version of the “basket of deplorables” fiasco. Funny you should mention that, because I don’t think that was a fiasco at all. And neither, BTW, do the analysts at 538. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/108 "2016-09-21T02:59:09Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Funny you should mention that, because I don’t think that was a fiasco at all. And neither, BTW, do the analysts at 538. Funny. Plenty of folks in the media are blaming HRC’s collapse (in the polls, not the actual collapse she had on 9/11) on her “basket of deplorables” fiasco, but which analysts in particular are you referring to? The only mention of it I’ve seen over there was that she should try to avoid repeating something like that in the debate. Seems like a weird tact to take if they didn’t think it was a mistake. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/109 "2016-09-21T03:20:29Z")
They said that in their podcast. They weren’t all in agreement but at least a couple of them thought that it was a mistake for Trump to try to take advantage by using it in his ads, that in fact it might be a clever trap that Hillary had laid for him. If you think that remark hurt her in the polls, where she has only lost a very slight amount of ground since making that comment, you must think that her 9/11 collapse and concealing her illness did not hurt her at all. And I find that rather unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/110 "2016-09-21T03:41:34Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The youngsters were feelin’ the Bern, then he dropped out, so now they’re feelin’ the Johnson. Is that a surprise? Way too much feelin’ their Johnsons. They need to get some girlfriends. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/111 "2016-09-21T04:29:30Z")
> **[Blame Millennials for President Trump](https://www.thedailybeast.com/blame-millennials-for-president-trump)** > > An awful lot of young voters so far seem unwilling to bite the bullet and vote for Clinton. They may learn the hard way how much worse things can get. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/112 "2016-09-21T08:38:58Z")
Precious Little Voter Needs To Feel Inspired By Candidate > **[Precious Little Voter Needs To Feel Inspired By Candidate](https://www.theonion.com/precious-little-voter-needs-to-feel-inspired-by-candida-1819578715?utm_campaign=SF&utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing)** > > CLEVELAND—Noting how important it is for him to find a campaign that stirs genuine optimism and enthusiasm in its supporters, sources confirmed Tuesday that precious little voter Adam Higgins needs to feel inspired by a candidate. “To be perfectly... ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/113 "2016-09-21T09:30:02Z")
Perhaps we should give them a participation trophy if they show up and vote. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/114 "2016-09-21T10:07:08Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > And who would enact much of the agenda they support. > And who is not the single most dangerous mainstream political candidate in… I want to say the last century. > And who is a legitimate liberal, and not a hardline conservative blowhard. > And who would prevent the achievements of the last 8 years from slipping away. > And who is not dangerously incompetent > And who actually stands a goddamn chance of winning against the former. > > People need to stop framing this as though, “You can’t tell _us_ how to vote, _Dad_!” was somehow a rational or reasonable response. It’s not. We’re not asking these people to vote for some impossible candidate. We’re asking for some basic self-interest combined with a wee bit of fucking sense. If there were no third parties, Clinton would unarguably and without any possible counterargument be a better candidate for these people than Trump. Third parties have absolutely no chance in hell of winning, so we might as well not have them. At best, these people are terminally deluded about the chances of their pet candidate (who in one case isn’t even on the ballot in every fucking state!) of winning; at worst, they are willing to cast a “protest vote” that could potentially lead to Donald “why don’t we give US treasury bonds a haircut” Trump becoming president - _and they understand how bad that would be_. > > At worst, idiots. > At best, complete fucking assholes. The way I see it, younger voters tend to be idealistic, which has its benefits and its hazards. Young voters will vote for someone whom they perceive to be a ‘change’ candidate, with a fresh perspective. Hence their support for Obama and hence their support for Bernie Sanders. Clinton is not that kind of candidate and is probably the furthest thing from it. That in and of itself is not an indictment of Clinton but that is the risk we take in nominating someone like her with eyes wide open. The hope - dare I say the expectation - in nominating her was that millennials would see the upside of Clinton and the potential disaster of electing her opponent. Needless to say, there is some doubt about that. I blame atrocious news coverage for a lot of this problem though some of it goes back to the decision to nominate the ultimate establishment candidate. ---
**Author:** ![DonLogan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/51bf81/32.png) [@DonLogan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DonLogan)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/115 "2016-09-21T10:41:52Z")
It’s half youth and half snowflake. Youth: They don’t grasp the concept of choosing the lesser of two evils when you are going to get stuck with one or the other no matter what. There’s nothing new about that. Snowflake: They are used to bending over parents and school administrators to get whatever they want and are shocked and butthurt when it doesn’t happen. Start a Twitter campaign and the target doesn’t cave? You’re being “disrespected” and “not listened to.” Why bother voting, you might not win. In their social lives, they use not showing up and lack of commitment until the last second as a form of power. In politics, all that gets you is no power. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/116 "2016-09-21T11:15:46Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Such rage. And you wonder why people are turned off to your message. Hi, 22-year-old here. I’m angry, and I don’t expect to reach too many millenials here. > [@ultimate11](#): > > Back to the topic- I’d like to get a clue when it comes to voting, but I don’t care- and neither do the politicians. What’s the point? This may be the single most meaningful election since World War II. The republican candidate is not just a little bad, but so fundamentally incapable and heinous that it’s hard to predict just how harmful he could be to this country. There’s a lot on the line. Yeah, neither politician is great. Neither caters specifically to you. Big deal. There’s a better and a worse choice, the gulf between the two is massive, and if you’re necessarily stuck with one of two evils, you’d have to be a fool not to recognize the importance of doing what you can to end up with the lesser one. I’d sooner have to take a 3-inch dildo than a 12-inch one, if that makes the comparison more obvious. > [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > I wouldn’t necessarily agree with that, RT. > > What I’m seeing in this thread is a variant of the ‘What’s the Matter With Kansas’ line of reasoning. What that book boiled down to is: > > 1. I know what I think is best > 2. People in Kansas don’t agree with me > 3. What the hell is wrong with them? > > It presupposes an outcome and therefore sets an adversarial relationship between the analyst and those being…well…analyzed. There’s a fallacy in there from a political point of view. > > It also assumes that those being analyzed - in this thread attacked - don’t have a grip on their own best interests. In every situation of which I’m aware the proper answer to that attitude is to tell the one doing the accusing to take a hike. > > It is possible - you gotta admit it’s possible - for another person or cohort to disagree with your postulates and reach different decisions. That may be disastrous from your point of view but it doesn’t make them stupid, selfish or whatever. > > […] But that’s just it, though. These people have made it pretty clear what they want and don’t want, and one candidate is clearly better. It doesn’t take a whole lot of basic sense to understand that: A) Jill and Gary stand no chance of winning B) Between the two candidates who do stand a chance, one is clearly better At this point, not coming out to support Clinton is somewhere between cutting off your nose to spite your face, cutting off your nose because you think your face would look better without a nose, and cutting off your nose because you’re sure your nose can grow back. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > There are, instead, coalitions of people who are pursuing similar aims. Generally they treat one another with respect if they want the coalitions to hold. But they are under no obligation, legal or moral, to maintain a coalition that they’ve decided doesn’t serve their ends. They have aims. Clinton would further those aims. What’s wrong with this picture? > [@John\_Mace](#): > > The youngsters were feelin’ the Bern, then he dropped out, so now they’re feelin’ the Johnson. Is that a surprise? That was bad and you should feel bad. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/117 "2016-09-21T11:36:21Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I’m getting pretty frustrated with the way younger Millennial voters (those born in the '90s, basically) [are turning up their dainty little noses](http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/young-millennials-love-obama-but-clinton-is-struggling-to-win-them-over/) at the prospect of voting for Hillary Clinton. I’m usually the last one to go on a “kids today” rant, but if they fuck this up, I am going to be **pissed**. If Hillary Clinton loses the election, which she still probably won’t, one perceived “screw-up” will be having nominated her. You said she was electable and Bernie wasn’t. I think that probably either was electable or neither was. But Bernie was probably more electable than she, in part because _he hasn’t been tarred as having murdered an ambassador._ Hillary Clinton has been defamed, mocked, and demonized for decades, and she thought she was going to win? Never mind that, once she wins she thinks she can work with Republicans in Congress? She’s delusional. Even if everything people say about her is lies, even if Trump is ten times worse, the fact remains that in a brute popularity contest, her bad reputation hurts her. She wants to say, with Joan Jett, that she doesn’t give a damn about her bad reputation. Great. That’d be great, if you were a hereditary monarch. Oh, wait, even then, _no,_ because you’d probably be deposed, or reduced to a figurehead. Delusional woman. I still think she’ll win. I think she’ll be better than Pence (assuming Trump is removed in some way quickly). And I still think, and this is no contradiction, that she’ll be hit as hard by the GOP as Obama has been, and start to feel like a millstone around the Democratic Party’s neck. See, if Trump is a disaster, that means that better than Trump doesn’t have to mean good. Cutting off your own arm is better than feeding your children to cannibalistic Canadians, but it’s still regrettable in its own way. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/118 "2016-09-21T12:14:49Z")
As a voter born in the 80s, I started this election cycle with one real desire: No more Clintons, no more Bushes. (Which also reminds me, as much as you want to make fun of the younger part of the generation, the older part vividly remembers the last 16 years.) I still don’t see how Sanders was never going to get anything through a hostile Congress but somehow Clinton was going to. Hooray four more years of grinding stagnation! That’s something the country and the planet can really afford. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/119 "2016-09-21T12:29:20Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > They have aims. Clinton would further those aims. What’s wrong with this picture? I agree that most Stein supporters will in a very real way find that voting for Clinton instead of Stein is the best way to further their aims. The arguments I’ve heard about opening the way for third-party candidates are unpersuasive, in my opinion, and Stein supporters should, strategically speaking, spend the next four years organizing like hell to get Green candidates elected on a local and state level, but keep voting for Democrats whenever a Green candidate doesn’t have a chance of actually winning. I disagree that team sport, or traitor, or any metaphor like that, is productive or wise. I disagree that having someone who continuously sneers at leftists continue to sneer at leftists is going to do any good. What moderates and pragmatic leftists should do is this: 1. Ally with the far left wherever possible. 2. Respect their concerns. 3. Build rapport. 4. Make persuasive arguments. 5. Refrain from belittling insults. ---
**Author:** ![DonLogan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/51bf81/32.png) [@DonLogan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DonLogan)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423/120 "2016-09-21T12:49:30Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > As a voter born in the 80s, I started this election cycle with one real desire: No more Clintons, no more Bushes. (Which also reminds me, as much as you want to make fun of the younger part of the generation, the older part vividly remembers the last 16 years.) I still don’t see how Sanders was never going to get anything through a hostile Congress but somehow Clinton was going to. Hooray four more years of grinding stagnation! That’s something the country and the planet can really afford. OK, so you didn’t get your wish. Now what? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/voters-born-in-the-90s-need-to-get-a-clue/766423.md?page=7)