But did those ~10% of black voters vote for him rather than the white guy because he’s black, or did they vote AT ALL because he’s black, and obviously their pick would always be Democrat whenever they chose to vote because they’re not masochists?
Also, have Republicans gotten increasingly fucking insane since Clinton? Some people lean toward being fiscally-conservative, for example, and may have prioritized that in past, but they can only overlook so much bigotry and that line has been crossed.
BFD. Black people are a reliably Democratic voting bloc, and the jump from 88% to 95% in four years doesn’t strike me as anything that means the sole reason is race.
I’ve got 84% of Clinton getting the black vote in 1992, 88% for Kerry in 2004, and 95% for Obama in 2008. I also have a mere 31% of Asians voting for Clinton in 1992, 56% for Kerry in 2004, and 62% for Obama in 2008. Were they voting for Obama because he was black too? Maybe their numbers were increasingly piling up in the blue column because they were sick of Bush’s shit? Obama got 54% of the Independent vote, Kerry got 50%, Clinton got 38%. So I’m not impressed by this “fairly large swath” of black people voting Democratic solely because the party’s candidate is black. You feel free to call it “denial,” and I’ll call it “considerable lack of white paranoia.”
It would be impossible for me (or anyone) to determine with any certainty the one (or multiple) reason(s) millions of voters chose a certain candidate.
But I think the statistics are strong enough to indicate that there are large numbers of black voters who voted for him because he was the black candidate. Please see how he did vs. Hillary in the 2008 primaries (I can’t find an overall count online, but I did see articles showing how Obama won 75-80% of primary vote in many states); I am pretty sure Republican insanity (which I agree with you is a very real thing) had little to do with the Democratic primary vote. So I stand by my original point.
I should note that just as I can’t say how many black voters voted for Obama “just because he’s black,” I also can’t say how many white voters voted against him for that reason. If someone suggested that a very large number of white voters behaved that way, I would not dismiss that offhand either; I think that would be just as naive.
Ah, okay. So you’re convinced the slight uptick in black voters for Democrats between 2004 and 2008 was about race, but such is not true of, say, Asians or Independent voters.
MOL, please address the Obama vs. Hillary portion of my comment rather than introducing a red herring argument about Asian voters. Obama won the black vote over Hillary by a landslide.
If you don’t think there is a significant number of black voters who voted for Obama just because he was black, it’s impossible for me to prove you wrong. Do you also believe there are not large numbers of white voters who want him out just because he’s black? I am pretty sure both positions would be equally naive, because I can introduce you to many people who have outright stated these positions. And if you only believe that white people can feel that way, well then that sounds a little bit like racism on your behalf.
No, he’s proved that as much as 7 percent of the black vote in 2008 might be “racist.” Checkmate! (Also worth noting: black people usually have lower turnout rates than other groups and in 2008 they didn’t.)
Overcoming an initial advantage for Clinton, of course.
How is that a red herring? You were the one who came in here dropping numbers that were supposed to prove I’m in denial, because a higher percentage of blacks voted for Obama than Clinton, and a slightly higher percentage voted for Obama than Kerry. So? Larger percentages of a lot of demographics voted for Obama over Kerry or Clinton. So if you’re going to say that somehow the numbers shifting to the left for black voters over the years (with an enormous left of center starting point to begin with) proves race was the sole reason for electing Obama in 2008, then I really don’t see how I can’t apply that same logic to Independents or whoever. But I guess in your mind race only matters to black people. If other demographic groups have been shifting leftward through the years and voted for Obama in higher numbers in 2008 than they did for previous Democrats as well, who knows why they did that? People’s reasons for voting are complicated! But not black people’s.
I don’t give a shit about Hillary Clinton, and I’m sure there are rednecks who don’t wanna vote for that thar colored boy, and I’m sure there’s some angry black man somewhere who just wants the black guy to win, but I certainly don’t think it makes any sense at all to dismissively say “Black people voted for him just because he’s black.” Do you even believe the shit coming out of your mouth when you say things like that? Black people always vote for the Democrat, and the Bush years charged up the shit out of the Democratic base, voter turnout increased, and we saw a lot center voters move to the left. And yet we only seem to see this large amount of White Concern about this marginal increase of black voters for the [del]Democrat[/del] black person.
Wow, someone sounds a little angry. Fine, no blacks voted for Obama because he’s black. Just a statistically coincidental move “to the left.” Whatever! Denial is bliss.
Yes, I’m angry because there’s been a very **not **coincidental move “to the left” for a lot of people following the Bush fuck up. I don’t know if you noticed that or not. But yeah, I know it makes you feel better about your racist friends on Facebook to say “Well I have it on good authority that black people only voted for Obama because he’s black, so really, Obama voters are just as bad at these guys!”
Sure, pal. Now I have to go vote. For real this time, and yes, for the black guy. Only because he’s black, mind you, and not because I’ve voted for the Democrat in, oh, every single presidential election I’ve ever voted in, and like a lot of liberals, have become increasingly fed the shit up with the Republican party since 2000.
Also, where did you get “race only matters to black people” in my mind? Try re-reading my statements that it is naive not to believe that there are many WHITE voters who vote AGAINST OBAMA just because he is BLACK! Most people realize the obvious facts–there are racists in this country and there always will be. And guess what, They’re not All WHITE. The belief that racism is a white owned thing is racist in itself.
Good choice of moniker by the way. You clearly don’t know me. I’m disgusted by the people I’ve heard say they want the “N-----” out of the White House. But I’m not in denial. I freely admit that this exists.
Shit, I couldn’t upload this photo on my slow ass computer fast enough to fit in the 5 minute editing window, but I have an even more immature version of “Anyone who tells me I’m full of shit is obviously angry.” Here you go.
Actually, the belief that racism is a white-owned thing is a disagreement about the definition of racism.
There’s a recently-popularized definition of “racism” within pop sociology (eg tumblr) that only allows the term to apply to society-level, institutionalized discrimination. In short, “racism” can only refer to things that impact racial minorities. Racial majorities could be impacted by “stereotyping” or “discrimination,” but never “racism.”
I disagree with this definition, but it’s been catching. That’s the meme you’re fighting here.
As for the actual point of this thread, I think reducing the electorate to single-issue voters is foolish.
Obama’s race is a large factor. This isn’t a bad thing; it is a meaningful aspect of who he is, where he comes from, what he represents, and how he is perceived.
There’s a difference between voting for Obama because he’s black and voting for him just because he’s black.
Name calling and four exclamations points. Somebody here is angry all right.
It was NOT just the black population, like I said. Latinos went for Obama in higher numbers for Obama than Clinton or Kerry, and Asians made a huge shift to the left, and went for Obama in a much larger shift than blacks did. Clinton got a handful of Independent voters in 1992, Kerry got more, and Obama got more than that. Why? Increasingly partisan political environment pushing people to their base? Anger with the Bush wars? Dissatisfaction with the Republican economy during the 2008 election? I can make many guesses, and when there are huge shifts leftward in other groups (political groups, tax brackets, other racial and ethnic groups), we speculate about why. When there’s a 6% bump between 2004 and 2008 among black voters, it’s RAAAACCE! Nothing but race!
Obama did better than Kerry with a lot of demographic groups. He got a larger share of the male vote (50 percent to 44 percent for Kerry), the female vote (57 percent to 52), and Obama got 90 percent of the nonwhite vote to Kerry’s 83. A bunch of other groups also moved toward Obama, some by large degrees and some by smaller amounts.
Yes, MOL, it is somewhat angering when someone ignorantly accuses me of being in some group (remember, me and all my “racist facebook friends?”) that I’m clearly not in–just because I make an observation that yes, guess what, a decent number of people out there (of all races) will actually vote based on the candidates race. This website is supposed to be about FIGHTING Ignorance, and you have chosen to embrace it.
