# Vulgarity? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [October 13, 2017, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740 "2017-10-13T17:25:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/1 "2017-10-13T17:25:14Z")
[http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=837877&page=13](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=837877&page=13) OK I was invited to ask this and I’m going to. My post #621 here is the center point to it. Can we say that people are pulling stuff out of their ass? Can we do it over and over? (It happened) Can we use the word “hot and bothered” in response to this language? (I did and found out I couldn’t) I mean on this site every opinion that is expressed can be said to be “PULLED OUT OF YOUR ASS!” if you want to go there. Is the sadism and rage an inherent part of the topic of the thread? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/2 "2017-10-13T17:41:22Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Can we say that people are pulling stuff out of their ass? Can we do it over and over? (It happened) If you feel insulted about such remarks, report them. And I note that you retaliated yourself by accusing the other poster of pulling stuff “out of his ass.” If you found this offensive, you shouldn’t have done it yourself. > [@](#): > > Can we use the word “hot and bothered” in response to this language? (I did and found out I couldn’t) **Bone** cited a specific GD rule in mod-noting (not warning) you for that: > [@](#): > > Sexualizing posters and their arguments - Do not say or imply that your fellow posters achieve sexual gratification or soil themselves in glee/distress due to recent news reports, political iconography, contemplation of ideological positions, etc. In short, you responding to what you call vulgarity by using the same expression yourself, and then upped the ante by violating a specific rule. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/3 "2017-10-13T17:42:00Z")
Are you asking whether or not it should be OK to refer to the folks you are debating as “hot and bothered”, or are you asking whether or not doing so is worse than telling the folks that one is debating that they are “pulling stuff out of their ass” ? (ETA: And are you soliciting general opinions and feedback, or only from the moderators? I am not a moderator) People get passionate about issues they care about when they are debating. It is never a good thing to start making _ad hominem_ attacks on people in a debate. (Their alleged badness doesn’t make them wrong). Tone policing (to use a trendy phrase for it), i.e., bringing attention to the other party’s mood or emotional investment in their side of the issue, is indeed a form of _ad hominem_. In my opinion, you should avoid doing it, unless their behavior within the debate is significantly shaped by it and you feel the need to draw attention to their behavior (abusive or whatever) within the debate. Examining and dismissing someone’s cited evidence or documentation of their claims, on the other hand, is legitimately relevant to the debate. I don’t think it should be done in an unnecessarily insulting way unless the person doing so thinks the other participant is not providing cites in good faith but instead is putting things out there that they fully know to be garbage cites (“pulled it out of your ass”). Overall, I’m reminded of 3rd and 4th grade, where “Well, _he started it_” and “But _what about them_, they were doing it _too_” was generally dismissed by the teachers as completely irrelevant to whether or not the kid in question had done something they shouldn’t ought to have done. Your mileage may vary. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/4 "2017-10-13T17:44:17Z")
> [@Gun control wouldn't have stopped what happened in Vegas...should we do it anyway?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/565): > > You are an anonymous internet poster. Do you think that your opinions are not pulled out of your own ass? Get off your horse. Just to note one of the specific posts in question. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/5 "2017-10-13T17:50:40Z")
Uh, I’m too lazy to check for context but “hot and bothered” doesn’t necessarily have sexual connotations. In fact, Google dictionary doesn’t even mention the sex component of the phrase. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/6 "2017-10-13T18:03:32Z")
Doesn’t matter (to me at any rate) whether it’s sexual or not; it implies “you aren’t thinking with your rational brain”. Another of that ilk is “Methinks someone forgot to take his afternoon meds”. Yet another is “Ooh is it that time of the month for you or something?”. They’re all a form of _ad hominem_, an attack on the poster and not the logic of what they’ve posted. I don’t know as how I’d make them “against the rules” but they’re bad form. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/7 "2017-10-13T18:51:31Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > Doesn’t matter (to me at any rate) whether it’s sexual or not; it implies “you aren’t thinking with your rational brain”. Another of that ilk is “Methinks someone forgot to take his afternoon meds”. Yet another is “Ooh is it that time of the month for you or something?”. They’re all a form of _ad hominem_, an attack on the poster and not the logic of what they’ve posted. I don’t know as how I’d make them “against the rules” but they’re bad form. If you are talking to me: I was accusing him of overreacting with vulgarity, in saying “hot and bothered,” as in “why do you have to be vulgar obscene and insulting, to me.” ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/8 "2017-10-13T18:53:54Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > If you feel insulted about such remarks, report them. And I note that you retaliated yourself by accusing the other poster of pulling stuff “out of his ass.” If you found this offensive, you shouldn’t have done it yourself. > > **Bone** cited a specific GD rule in mod-noting (not warning) you for that: > > In short, you responding to what you call vulgarity by using the same expression yourself, and then upped the ante by violating a specific rule. I most certainly did not accuse him of pulling something out of his ass, unless you mean my calling him out on it, quoted by someone below, and using the phrase back. It makes a difference. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/9 "2017-10-13T18:56:13Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Just to note one of the specific posts in question. You’re a moderator. You quoted me in responding to someone, in one post, using a phrase back to the poster, who was abusing me over and over with obscene vulgar shit. What do you think this says about me? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/10 "2017-10-13T19:00:42Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I most certainly did not accuse him of pulling something out of his ass, unless you mean my calling him out on it, quoted by someone below, and using the phrase back. It makes a difference. This certainly seems to indicate that he is “pulling opinions out of his ass.” If it doesn’t, you expressed yourself very poorly. > [@drad dog](#): > > Do you think that your opinions are not pulled out of your own ass? ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/11 "2017-10-13T19:02:21Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > Doesn’t matter (to me at any rate) whether it’s sexual or not; it implies “you aren’t thinking with your rational brain”. Another of that ilk is “Methinks someone forgot to take his afternoon meds”. Yet another is “Ooh is it that time of the month for you or something?”. They’re all a form of _ad hominem_, an attack on the poster and not the logic of what they’ve posted. I don’t know as how I’d make them “against the rules” but they’re bad form. I has to matter whether it’s sexual. Because that’s what we are discussing: the rule about sexual imputation. We are also discussing the rule about insults and obscenity. When you taunt someone with sadistic obscene shit and then you need them to be careful about responding to you because they might do something that you were doing yourself, in the midst of trying to defend themselves… where is that argument going intellectually? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/12 "2017-10-13T19:03:00Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > You’re a moderator. You quoted me in responding to someone, in one post, using a phrase back to the poster, who was abusing me over and over with obscene vulgar shit. What do you think this says about me? 1. That if you were offended, you should have reported the posts rather than retaliating. 2. That if you believed the posts to be “obscene vulgar shit,” then you shouldn’t have used the phrase back at him. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/13 "2017-10-13T19:03:54Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Uh, I’m too lazy to check for context but “hot and bothered” doesn’t necessarily have sexual connotations. > > In fact, Google dictionary doesn’t even mention the sex component of the phrase. Yeah, I don’t identify the phrase exclusively with a sexual connotation. I wouldn’t at all out of context. [Wiktionary mentions the sexual aspect](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/hot_and_bothered), [Cambridge English Dictionary does not](http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/all-hot-and-bothered). It doesn’t seem clear enough to use as a rule violation. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/14 "2017-10-13T19:05:15Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > When you taunt someone with sadistic obscene shit Few people, I think, would agree that “pulling something out of your ass” was sadistic obscene shit. Being hyperbolic about what was said does not help your case. (And if you object to vulgarity, why do you persist in using it?) ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/15 "2017-10-13T19:10:20Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > This certainly seems to indicate that he is “pulling opinions out of his ass.” If it doesn’t, you expressed yourself very poorly. I was asking him if he recognized himself in his comments at me. You really think this is the same thing as what he did? I’m sure you know the difference. I did it after being taunted. You’re a moderator. Is it appropriate to repeatedly call someones opinions “Coming out of your ass” when we are all anonymous posters here with opinions to offer? If you do should you not be reminded that you are doing that? It’s a simple question. Here’s another question: “Hot and bothered” is sexual? What if someone was abusing you with vulgarity and you said he was “hot and bothered”? Do you think he is sexually excited or enraged? Which usage and meaning of hot and bothered do you use to discipline me, when I don’t do what you want? Does context come into it? ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/16 "2017-10-13T19:20:20Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Few people, I think, would agree that “pulling something out of your ass” was sadistic obscene shit. Being hyperbolic about what was said does not help your case. (And if you object to vulgarity, why do you persist in using it?) You may not think so, from here. If it happens tell me how you feel. I don’t like it at all. If you choose to use that as a constant theme in a conversation I think that after doing it 2 or 3 times to the same person that person might remind you that you have opinions too. Worth just as much. The vulgarity is not my making here. You know it. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/17 "2017-10-13T19:31:36Z")
Look, **Bone** was wrong. He accused the OP of making sexual innuendo, when he in fact didn’t. > [@Bone](#): > > Do not say or imply that your fellow posters achieve sexual gratification or soil themselves. **Bone** owes **drad dog** an apology. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/18 "2017-10-13T19:32:05Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > If you do should you not be reminded that you are doing that? > > It’s a simple question. And I have given the simple answer. If you are offended by somebody’s post, report it and let the mods deal with it. > [@](#): > > Here’s another question: “Hot and bothered” is sexual? It certainly can be, as verified by some of the cites above. > [@](#): > > What if someone was abusing you with vulgarity and you said he was “hot and bothered”? If you believed that you were being abused, you should have reported the post. > [@](#): > > do you use to discipline me, You haven’t been “disciplined.” You received a mod note. > [@](#): > > when I don’t do what you want? What we want you to do is to obey the rules. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/19 "2017-10-13T19:33:08Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Can we say that people are pulling stuff out of their ass? Can we do it over and over? (It happened) While I personally don’t think it’s the friendliest construction, it’s similar in nature to challenging the basis for a claim. Similarly, calling an argument “bullshit” carries the same implication. Calls for a cite, calls to support a claim, assertions that claims have poor or no evidence to support them, these are all fertile ground in Great Debates. I think the best way to rebut or address these are to support whatever claim or argument is being made. If you think something crosses the line, then please report it. Tit for tat isn’t consistent with the idea that the idiom is personally offensive. In this instance, the usage did not seem to be any particular rule violation. > [@](#): > > Can we use the word “hot and bothered” in response to this language? (I did and found out I couldn’t) I interpret this phrase to be sexual in nature. I acknowledge that there are multiple meanings and that it is not necessarily sexual. Because there is ambiguity, my comment in this instance was a note. If it was clear the comment was sexual in nature then my comment would have been a warning because there is a clear and specific rule against sexualization in this fashion. * * * Overall we strive for civil debate. Often things get heated and that’s to be expected and why we have the reporting system and moderators. Even if something when done a single time like saying something is bullshit is typically no problem, if a poster’s response contained nothing but repeating “bullshit” over and over then that would be where I’d step in to get the thread back on track. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740/20 "2017-10-13T19:34:20Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > The vulgarity is not my making here. You know it. What I know is that you’ve responded to vulgarity with vulgarity, which rather weakens your case about how offensive it is. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vulgarity/798740.md?page=2)