# W authorizes CIA action against Iran; GOP candidates blast . . . ABC for reporting it **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 23, 2007, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260 "2007-05-23T18:40:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/121 "2007-05-23T22:33:47Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Seriously, though, **Evil One**. What good do you think will come of this? Do you think a destabilized Iran is a good thing? [/QUOTE] Was the cold war a good idea? They are trying to become a nuclear power. They have been working against the United States in every way possible since the revolution began. The alternative would be to put our head in the sand and hope for the best. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/122 "2007-05-23T22:33:50Z")
[QUOTE=mswas] **Spavined Gelding** A war with Iran wouldn’t be about an Invasion. It would be about destroying their ability to fight a mechanized war, removing any and all infrastructure that they have. [/quote] What conceivable legal or moral right would we have to do that? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/123 "2007-05-23T22:37:11Z")
[QUOTE=Evil One] > [@Frank](#): > > Are we at war with Iran? Yes. We have been in a cold to lukewarm war with them since 1979. [/QUOTE] Ever… since… the last time… we destabilized… their… country. Okay, I see how it works now. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/124 "2007-05-23T22:40:08Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] So the answer is yes, it’s illegal? You agree that Bush is a criminal, then? you agree that the Press had no choice but to expose this? [/QUOTE] My point was to show that similar things are being done to us. Iran does not have an independent press that salivates at the idea of exposing whatever they can find for financial gain and, in many cases, ideological purity. I don’t know how to put it more simply… Iran will do whatever they can to hurt us. We cannot bend over and stick our heads in the sand while they walk around behind us and drop their pants. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/125 "2007-05-23T22:40:20Z")
[QUOTE=Evil One] They are trying to become a nuclear power. They have been working against the United States in every way possible since the revolution began. The alternative would be to put our head in the sand and hope for the best. [/QUOTE] What do you propose we do? What do you envision happening if we make nice with them instead? Or just ignore them? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/126 "2007-05-23T22:40:48Z")
[QUOTE=Evil One] Was the cold war a good idea? [/quote] The Cold War wasn’t an “idea,” it was just a situation and it has no application to Iran. > [@](#): > > They are trying to become a nuclear power. So what? What gives them any less right to be a nuclear power than anyone else? > [@](#): > > They have been working against the United States in every way possible since the revolution began. No, at worst, they’ve been assisting the Shia Iraqi government with it’s vendettas against Sunnis. They haven’t done shit to the US. This may come as a shock to you, but the US does not own Iraq. If US troops get killed in sectarian crossfires, that’s on Bush for sending them there. Iran is no threta to the US. > [@](#): > > The alternative would be to put our head in the sand and hope for the best. I’ve heard this song before. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/127 "2007-05-23T22:41:35Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] What conceivable legal or moral right would we have to do that? [/QUOTE] We could wait until they nuke Tel Aviv. Or until they close the straits of Hormuz. Would either of those actions be enough for you, Dio? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/128 "2007-05-23T22:43:16Z")
[QUOTE=Evil One] Was the cold war a good idea? [/quote] This isn’t a cold war. > [@](#): > > They are trying to become a nuclear power. They have been working against the United States in every way possible since the revolution began. The alternative would be to put our head in the sand and hope for the best. And trying to destabilize their regime will stop them from that, how? The mullah’s don’t have much support from the people, who largely \*want \*to like the US. Making their lives more miserable just undermines that. I’m not so worried about our support of Air America type programming (propaganda, if you will), but subverting their currency is a really stupid idea. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/129 "2007-05-23T22:44:02Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] So what? What gives them any less right to be a nuclear power than anyone else? [/QUOTE] Their signature on the [Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-proliferation_treaty#Iran) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/130 "2007-05-23T22:44:29Z")
[QUOTE=Evil One] My point was to show that similar things are being done to us. [/quote] So how does that justify the US doing it? > [@](#): > > Iran does not have an independent press that salivates at the idea of exposing whatever they can find for financial gain and, in many cases, ideological purity. Aren’t you glad we DO have that? > [@](#): > > Iran will do whatever they can to hurt us. We cannot bend over and stick our heads in the sand while they walk around behind us and drop their pants. We heard this same horseshit 5 years ago about Iraq. We heard it 40 years ago to justify Vietnam. Iran is not going to hurt you. Relax. You’re going to be fine. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/131 "2007-05-23T22:46:08Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Actually, I think the Iranians can be relied on to [take a stupid action all on their own.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=420706) [/QUOTE] And this story coming out now makes Esfandari’s chances even worse. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/132 "2007-05-23T22:48:12Z")
[QUOTE=marshmallow] What do you propose we do? [/QUOTE] Prevent them from from becoming a nuclear power and a threat to our economy by whatever means we have at our disposal. [QUOTE=marshmallow] What do you envision happening if we make nice with them instead? [/QUOTE] They would tell us what we wanted to hear and go on about their business of becoming the “flaming sword of Islam”. We are dealing with religious zealots who do not share our values or priorities. [QUOTE=marshmallow] Or just ignore them? [/QUOTE] That would make it easier for them to disrupt the world economy and to become a nuclear power. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/133 "2007-05-23T22:51:12Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Their signature on the [Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-proliferation_treaty#Iran) [/QUOTE] They’re just enriching uranium for energy, there’s no proof they’re building weapons. And the US has forfeited any right to appeal to international treaties. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/134 "2007-05-23T22:52:35Z")
[QUOTE=Evil One] We are dealing with religious zealots who do not share our values or priorities. [/QUOTE] That’s exactly how I feel about the Bush administration. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/135 "2007-05-23T22:54:55Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Iran is not going to hurt you. Relax. You’re going to be fine. [/QUOTE] You’re right. It’s all in my head. You have shown me that Iran has neither the ability or the will to adversely affect the interests of the United States. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/136 "2007-05-23T22:56:23Z")
Funny thing is, if you look at the Middle East, we are more naturally allied with Iran than we are with Saudi Arabia. Not that either are all that appealing, but I mean if you look at it completely objectively. The Iranians hate us mainly because we hate them. And we hate them mainly because they hate us. But the Saudis really do hate us (on a fundamental level, even if they’re willing to deal with us economically and, when it suits them, militarily). ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/137 "2007-05-23T22:57:29Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] I’m not so worried about our support of Air America type programming (propaganda, if you will), but subverting their currency is a really stupid idea. [/QUOTE] Perhaps the idea is to affect the economy and undermine the opinion of the government by enough people to make them want to get rid of the theocracy. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/138 "2007-05-23T22:59:29Z")
“They all hate us anyhow, so let’s drop the big one now.” ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/139 "2007-05-23T23:01:32Z")
“They’re all good people. Just leave them alone and they’ll leave us alone.” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260/140 "2007-05-23T23:02:38Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] And this story coming out now makes Esfandari’s chances even worse. [/QUOTE] It’s the CIA **program** that does that, not the story. As **Spavined Gelding** pointed out, the Iranians need no press leak, they know perfectly well we’re plotting to destabilize them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/w-authorizes-cia-action-against-iran-gop-candidates-blast-abc-for-reporting-it/405260.md?page=8)