# Wade Book "A Troublesome Inheritance" - science, or racism? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 5, 2014, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616 "2014-09-05T21:55:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/1 "2014-09-05T21:55:33Z")
_[A Troublesome Inheritance - Genes, Race and Human History](A Troublesome Inheritance: Genes, Race and Human History)_ has attracted a lot of hate. If you’re not familiar with it (and I haven’t read it), it was written by the former New York Times science writer Nicholas Wade. He also wrote _ **Before the Dawn** _, about what humans did before writing was invented and how we know it. Fascinating book. Lots of well-deserved accolades. _ **A Troublesome Inheritance** _ suggests that some differences we see among races is genetic (but recent), exacerbated by culture. Again, I haven’t read the book, but I know one hypothesis Wade has espoused is that Ashkenazi Jews were subject to unique survival stresses, not being able to own land in most of Europe for most of the last 1000 years. Therefore, he says, they worked as bankers or lawyers, or failed to get married and reproduce. So fully half the Nobel prizes for physics ever awarded have gone to Ashkenazi Jews, or people with at least one Ashkenazi parent. Is that hateful, or is it, as Thomas Jefferson would say, not being “afraid to follow truth wherever it may lead?” I got my _Southern Poverty Law Center_ magazine a couple of days ago and it [reviewed](http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2014/05/28/troublesome-sources-nicholas-wades-embrace-of-scientific-racism/) _ **A Troublesome Inheritance** _, dismissing it roundly. Googling about the book gives many similar results. Is Wade being made a pariah because he asks uncomfortable questions, and posits uncomfortable answers, or has he gone round the bend and is just espousing fascist eugenics? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/2 "2014-09-05T22:06:29Z")
Just humdrum bad science. Maybe racist, maybe not, but he definitely makes a ton of evidence-free assertions. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/3 "2014-09-05T22:41:31Z")
Here is a thread, where **orcenio** has posted all the rebuttals you could ever want to Wade’s book. > **[At what level is racialism accepted in the scientific community?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=730753)** > > This post pertains to the NYtimes science Journalist Nicolas Wade, but it has some relevance to how the community of biological scientists view “race science” In April 28th of this year, Nicholas Wade authored a book called “A Troublesome... I mean, really, how many times do we have to play whack-a-mole on this? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/4 "2014-09-05T23:03:38Z")
> **[Nicholas Wade and race: building a scientific façade](https://violentmetaphors.com/2014/05/21/nicholas-wade-and-race-building-a-scientific-facade/)** > > “…for he has no right to give names to objects which he cannot define.” –Charles Darwin Do “races” exist as meaningful biological categories? Physical anthropologists and human biologists have been… > [@](#): > > Wade wants us to cut up human diversity into five races not because that’s what the statistical analyses show, but because thinking about it as a gradient is hard. > Wade isn’t even using the tools of genetics competently. The authors of the paper he relied on, as well as subsequent studies, showed that different runs of the program with the same data can even produce different results (Bolnick, 2008). Structure’s results are extremely sensitive to many different factors, including models, the type and number of genetic variants studied, and the number of populations included in the analysis (Rosenberg et al. 2005). When Rosenberg et al. (2005) expanded the 2002 dataset to include more genetic markers for the same population samples, they identified a somewhat different set of genetic clusters when K=6 (Native Americans were divided into two clusters and the Kalash of Central/South Asia did not form a separate cluster). In fact, Rosenberg et al. (2005) explicitly said: > > > [@](#): > > > > ``` > > “Our evidence for clustering should not be taken as evidence of our support of any particular concept of ‘biological race.’” > > > > ``` > > Finally, the creators of structure themselves caution that it will produce rather arbitrary clusters when sampled populations have been influenced by gene flow that is restricted by geographic distance (i.e. where more mating occurs between members of nearby populations than between populations that are located farther apart, a pattern we geneticists refer to as isolation by distance). As this pattern applies to the majority of human populations, it makes the results of structure problematic and difficult to interpret in many cases. These limitations are acknowledged by anthropological geneticists and population biologists, who interpret the results of structure cautiously. It’s very telling that Wade, a science reporter, chose to ignore the interpretations of the experts in favor of his own. Just the usual Pseudo-science, I have seen the same coming from creationists, 911 truthers, moon hoaxers, climate change deniers and many others. The denial of not only science but that they wilfully ignore the conclusions of the experts that made the scientific work that the pseudo scientist abuses. And that is why they get no respect where it counts. No wonder he had to make a book, he could not face peer review to check if he was onto something as it is clear he knew what the result of that would had been. How Velikovskian. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/5 "2014-09-05T23:21:11Z")
There are no “black people,” “white people,” “brown people,” your eyes are lying to you. Follow the science. We are all the same genetically, physically, and biologically, and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/6 "2014-09-05T23:27:05Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > There are no “black people,” “white people,” “brown people,” your eyes are lying to you. > > Follow the science. We are all the same genetically, physically, and biologically, and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. Man, that is some grade-A gibberish right there. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/7 "2014-09-05T23:34:31Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > There are no “black people,” “white people,” “brown people,” your eyes are lying to you. > > Follow the science. We are all the same genetically, physically, and biologically, and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. Bigoted bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/8 "2014-09-05T23:35:20Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > I mean, really, how many times do we have to play whack-a-mole on this? I was unaware of the thread. Thanks. > [@stringbean](#): > > Follow the science. We are all the same genetically, physically, and biologically, and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. Is this a woosh? ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/9 "2014-09-05T23:44:30Z")
Having read a lot of the thread with **orcenio** ’s reference guide as the anchor, I don’t think my thread is adding much. If a mod wants to close it, that’s fine with me. I really liked _ **Before the Dawn.** _ Is that a bunch of junk, too? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/10 "2014-09-05T23:53:58Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > There are no “black people,” “white people,” “brown people,” your eyes are lying to you. > > Follow the science. We are all the same genetically, physically, and biologically, and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. A false dichotomy. There is no binary choice between accepting a “race” system created by European colonialists and total denial of human genetic variation. There’s plenty of genetic variation between groups; it just doesn’t conveniently follow the unscientific race system. Two “black people” will often be more genetically different from each other than either of them are from a “white” person, for example. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/11 "2014-09-06T00:03:44Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > . . . and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. Sarcasm is marred by name-calling. It is also prohibited in Great Debates. Do not do this again. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/12 "2014-09-06T01:41:51Z")
I’m generally sympathetic to ideas that there might be significant genetic variation between ethnic groups, and I’m fairly strongly hereditarian (leaving race and ethnicity entirely aside). That said, anyone who really believes there are five biological races is a fool. The really interesting differences between populations are usually at a much smaller scale than ‘continental groupings’. For example, the way Quechuas and Aymaras, Tibetans, and Amhara have all independently evolved adaptations to high altitude (and as you’d expect, the South American groups are the least well adapted, since they haven’t lived at altitude for that long). If I was recruiting someone to explore a newly discovered planet with lower oxygen, it might make sense to take those differences into account. I wouldn’t be especially surprised if some behavioral and cognitive traits showed genetic differences among populations, but simply, there are a lot more than five reasonable human groupings out there. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/13 "2014-09-06T05:15:00Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I was unaware of the thread. Thanks. Ah, ok. Sorry that I was snarky to you. I was expressing general frustration with the topic, which shouldn’t have been directed at you. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/14 "2014-09-06T07:55:09Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > There are no “black people,” “white people,” “brown people,” your eyes are lying to you. > > Follow the science. We are all the same genetically, physically, and biologically, and you’re a racist to suggest otherwise. Nobody is claiming that, clearly humanity has many different skin colors. The claim is that “white people” and “black people” are social constructs with no scientific basis, in fact those two grouping are fluid and have and continue to become more inclusive or exclusive. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/15 "2014-09-06T13:47:38Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > There are no “black people,” “white people,” “brown people,” your eyes are lying to you. If you think those categories have anything to do with underlying genetics groups, yes, they are very much lying to you. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/16 "2014-09-06T19:05:21Z")
The tack I’ve started taking lately is pointing out that we don’t think that all tall people are separate from all short people, so why separate ourselves by an equally superficial trait? Sure, tall parents will tend to have tall kids, just like black parents will tend to have black kids, but that doesn’t mean that all tall people are somehow different, genetically, from all short people. Grouping by skin color is just as arbitrary. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2014, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/17 "2014-09-06T20:23:29Z")
Lol. In looking at **orcenio** ’s thread, **Stringbean** did a drive-by gibberish post there too! Looks like **Stringbean** is really, really interested in this topic, but not interested enough to actually learn about it, or post more than once in a thread. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2014, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/18 "2014-09-07T00:31:28Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > The tack I’ve started taking lately is pointing out that we don’t think that all tall people are separate from all short people, so why separate ourselves by an equally superficial trait? Sure, tall parents will tend to have tall kids, just like black parents will tend to have black kids, but that doesn’t mean that all tall people are somehow different, genetically, from all short people. Grouping by skin color is just as arbitrary. Do you even know what genes are? They are the blueprint for your body. Of course tall people and short people are different genetically; one group has a strong genetic potential for height and another has a strong genetic potential to be short. The point is we are grouping people by a particular trait, which is valid whether it’s comfortable or not. This isn’t a debate; it’s an infiltration of PC sterility. Racism is wrong, but seeing people deny that genetic variation exists, particularly in a trait so distinct as skin color, is intellectually bankrupt. That was the point of my initial post, which if read accurately is actually an insult to myself since I am the one espousing a view of nuance. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2014, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/19 "2014-09-07T01:15:13Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > Do you even know what genes are? They are the blueprint for your body. > > Of course tall people and short people are different genetically; one group has a strong genetic potential for height and another has a strong genetic potential to be short. The point is we are grouping people by a particular trait, which is valid whether it’s comfortable or not. > > This isn’t a debate; it’s an infiltration of PC sterility. Racism is wrong, but seeing people deny that genetic variation exists, particularly in a trait so distinct as skin color, is intellectually bankrupt. > > That was the point of my initial post, which if read accurately is actually an insult to myself since I am the one espousing a view of nuance. Your first post seemed to be an argument with no one. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2014, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616/20 "2014-09-07T02:11:46Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > Do you even know what genes are? They are the blueprint for your body. No, I’m only on year 6 of my biology PhD. We haven’t covered those yet. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wade-book-a-troublesome-inheritance-science-or-racism/697616.md?page=2)