# Wagon Train to the Stars **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 16, 2018, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906 "2018-02-16T02:15:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/21 "2018-02-17T01:13:51Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > Did they have redshirts on ‘Wagon Train’? Circled up during an Indian attack, they dropped like flies. I’m not aware of any red shirts to identify them, save that you had never seen the guy before. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/22 "2018-02-17T01:55:43Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Maybe it was too obscure for studio execs, but the real model for Kirk is Hornblower. The 1951 movie with Gregory Peck is probably the finest Star Trek movie ever made. And Roddenberry said exactly that in one of the interviews on the box set. I think the Writers’ Guide says it too - need to look it up. > [@](#): > > The second is of course Forbidden Planet, but that’s already set in space. Maybe Roddenberry should have called it Forbidden Planet: the series. Nah - they’d run out of Shakespeare plays before the season was out. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/23 "2018-02-17T02:06:09Z")
_Forbidden Planet_ is the one Shakespearean adaptation to ever improve on the original. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/24 "2018-02-17T03:17:09Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > _Forbidden Planet_ is the one Shakespearean adaptation to ever improve on the original. I am impressed, Sir. My opinion of you increases. 🙂 “What’s a bathing suit?” “Then I’ll put more guards around the guards!” ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/25 "2018-02-17T04:10:37Z")
Bit o’ trivia: Leonard Nimoy played a character named Bernabe Zamora in four episodes of Wagon Train. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/26 "2018-02-17T14:51:45Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > _Forbidden Planet_ is the one Shakespearean adaptation to ever improve on the original. What? No love for Strange Brew? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/27 "2018-02-17T15:04:53Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > What? No love for Strange Brew? > > 🙂 Hamlet, eh? ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/28 "2018-02-17T21:31:58Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > _Forbidden Planet_ is the one Shakespearean adaptation to ever improve on the original. Sure you’re not thinking of _Forbidden Zone_? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/29 "2018-02-17T21:49:25Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > Sure you’re not thinking of _Forbidden Zone_? 😛 Forbidden Planet has a star cruiser sent to bring back a failed colony, but the remaining members, a philologist and his daughter do not wish to go. The Captain, Doctor and First Officer are the protagonists. It has also been compared to _The Tempest_. I was about five the first time I saw it, and when the Id monster showed up, I was in my Father’s lap. ---
**Author:** ![Dropo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce7236/32.png) [@Dropo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dropo)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/30 "2018-02-17T22:08:45Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > _Forbidden Planet_ is the one Shakespearean adaptation to ever improve on the original. Apologies for going off-topic here, but _Throne of Blood_ (1957) is a definite improvement over the original as well. Probably better than any _Wagon Train_ episode, too. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2018, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/31 "2018-02-18T00:07:03Z")
And sort-of back on topic, I’d heard that Star Trek was pitched this way, but I hadn’t realized until this thread that _Wagon Train_ was a specific TV show. I thought it was just meant to be descriptive. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2018, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/32 "2018-02-18T00:23:04Z")
And to go full circle, when Nicholas Meyer was brought in to salvage the movie franchise, he was not really a fan. He didn’t know the history. So when he pitched his idea for what would become TWoK, he offered up that he envisioned Kirk as a Hornblower type. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2018, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/33 "2018-02-18T00:47:43Z")
The two _Star Trek_ films Meyer directed (2 & 6) were particualrly Hornblower-esque, complete with tactical ship battles, and Kirk at his most mortal and introspective. The problem with trying to classify the original series in any particular category is that thematically is was all over the place; some episodes were very space operatic, some were drenched in allegory and irony, and some were just jokey comedy that was discordant with with the more serious themes. “_Wagon Train_ in space” may have been the elevator pitch, and to a certain extent the original intent, but it was as much _Route 66_ and _Twilight Zone_ as _Wagon Train_. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2018, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/34 "2018-02-18T01:49:26Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > The two _Star Trek_ films Meyer directed (2 & 6) were particualrly Hornblower-esque, complete with tactical ship battles, and Kirk at his most mortal and introspective. The problem with trying to classify the original series in any particular category is that thematically is was all over the place; some episodes were very space operatic, some were drenched in allegory and irony, and some were just jokey comedy that was discordant with with the more serious themes. “_Wagon Train_ in space” may have been the elevator pitch, and to a certain extent the original intent, but it was as much _Route 66_ and _Twilight Zone_ as _Wagon Train_. > > Stranger On the commentary track for TWOK Meyer talks about redesigning the uniforms to get an 18th century naval look and ‘running out the guns” with the crew lifting grates to fire a photon torpedoes. Don’t think photon torpedoes were ever show before. “Star Trek TOS” may be close to “77 Sunset Strip” although I don’t think Roddenberry ever wrote for them. He wrote a number of shows but the two with the most credits were “Have Gun, Will Travel” and his own “The Lieutenant”. But 77 Sunset could vary all over the place with serious drama mixed with comic ones with Kookie lending his comb to Louis the Horse Player. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2018, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906/35 "2018-02-18T02:54:27Z")
> [@Jim\_s\_Son](#): > > On the commentary track for TWOK Meyer talks about redesigning the uniforms to get an 18th century naval look and ‘running out the guns” with the crew lifting grates to fire a photon torpedoes. Don’t think photon torpedoes were ever show before. Only as blobs of light outside the ship. I thought the whole thing made even less sense than having technicians in a Weapons Room waiting for commands to come down from the bridge (“Balance of Terror”). WWII submarine technology or 18th century man-o-war technology. Just the thing for a 23rd century starship. :smack: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wagon-train-to-the-stars/808906.md?page=1)