# War Czar? What The Hell Is That? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 12, 2007, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737 "2007-04-12T01:23:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/61 "2007-04-13T05:09:46Z")
[QUOTE=Orbifold] I don’t know, “war czar” doesn’t sound impressive enough. The position needs a grander title. “Homeland Marshall”, or maybe “Grand Moff”. [/QUOTE] Aw, come on, what’s wrong with naming the position after a monarchy that ended it’s days in a dirty basement being murdered by commies and then had it’s remains buried unceremoniously in the woods? 😕 _Actually, this position **could** successfully pull our asses out of this mess, if the right person was found._ No shit. Lest you think I’m crazy, let me explain. What we need is someone in the job who has sense enough to know that we’re in one fucked up mess, that the Chimp-in-Chief is an idiot, and everyone under the czar is _more_ loyal to him than they are to Shrub. He could then meet with the critical people privately, come up with a solution, and then _make damn sure Shrub’s kept out of the loop!_ Who that person would be, I’ve no idea, but then again, I’ve no idea why people are so loyal to the current CiC. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/62 "2007-04-13T05:20:36Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] What we need is someone in the job who has sense enough to know that we’re in one fucked up mess, that the Chimp-in-Chief is an idiot, and everyone under the czar is _more_ loyal to him than they are to Shrub. He could then meet with the critical people privately, come up with a solution, and then _make damn sure Shrub’s kept out of the loop!_ [/QUOTE] They still make [bombs that fit in briefcases](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/July_20_Plot), right? ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/63 "2007-04-13T05:31:00Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] They still make [bombs that fit in briefcases](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/July_20_Plot), right? [/QUOTE] Apparently, they’re available in [Iraq](http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_102141535.html), if you know the right people. The real question is, “Do they make bomb proof table legs, still?” ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/64 "2007-04-13T15:51:51Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Apparently, they’re available in [Iraq](http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_102141535.html), if you know the right people. The real question is, “Do they make bomb proof table legs, still?” [/QUOTE] Watch it guys. You’re getting close to a hazardous line. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/65 "2007-04-13T16:42:48Z")
[QUOTE=David Simmons] Watch it guys. You’re getting close to a hazardous line. [/QUOTE] Umm…that’s what she said? Otherwise, yeah, what **David** is saying. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/66 "2007-04-13T17:38:19Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] No, no, that’s _Lords_ ! Czars = good, Lords = bad. War Czars, Drug Czars are good; War Lords and Drug Lords are bad. [/QUOTE] Hallelujah… **JESUS IS CZAR!** ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2007, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/67 "2007-04-13T18:32:24Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] I should probably know better than to try and explain this when it’s clear that everyone in this thread just wants to take pot-shots at Bush, but here goes anyway… This is a very common management technique. When a CEO has a crisis to manage that involves rallying multiple departments, it’s very common to appoint a “czar” to manage that crisis. Someone whose full time job it is to focus on the crisis. Someone who isn’t going to be pulled away to do anything not related specifically to the crisis. As a former businessman, I suspect that this is where Bush is coming from. Even the SecDef can’t focus full time on the war(s). The idea that this is just a search for a fall guy is pretty facile. [/QUOTE] We trained hard, but it seemed that every time we were begining to form up into teams we would be reorganized. I was to learn later in life we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing, and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization. Petronius ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/68 "2007-04-14T03:15:44Z")
Should Petronius be making public remarks like that while he’s still in charge of the troops in Iraq? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/69 "2007-04-14T06:01:57Z")
If we’re going to look back to classical history, how about we hire somebody for a useful job? I’m thinking we’d benefit from a guy standing behind George Bush and whispering “remember, thou art mortal” in his ear. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/70 "2007-04-14T06:35:54Z")
[QUOTE=Little Nemo] If we’re going to look back to classical history, how about we hire somebody for a useful job? I’m thinking we’d benefit from a guy standing behind George Bush and whispering “remember, thou art mortal” in his ear. [/QUOTE] Nah; Bush would immediately say “Great idea !”, fire him, and replace him with someone who whispered “Remember, God chose YOU to be President !” instead. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/71 "2007-04-14T07:10:50Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] Nah; Bush would immediately say “Great idea !”, fire him, and replace him with someone who whispered “Remember, God chose YOU to be President !” instead. [/QUOTE] Isn’t that what Cheney does when he’s not busy running the administration? ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/72 "2007-04-14T18:21:57Z")
[QUOTE=Billdo] Actually, Roosevelt did have what was in effect a War Czar. In May 1942, Roosevelt recalled into service the then-retired [Admiral William D. Leahy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_D._Leahy), a former Chief of Naval Operations, to be the Chief of Staff to the Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy. Roosevelt used him to coordinate the activities of the then separate War and Navy Departments and to mediate between the services. Although Admiral Leahy was not in the formal chain of command, as the the Commander in Chief’s personal representative on military affairs he had a tremendous amount of clout even when he may not have been acting directly as a conduit for the President’s orders. In 1947, the War and Navy Departments were reorganized into the Defense Department, putting all of the military services (including the newly-formed Air Force) under the unified command of the Secretary of Defense. Admiral Leahy’s position was transformed into the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and he was succeeded by General Omar Bradley. [/QUOTE] Yeah but WWII was a war that involved 15 million troops of ours scattered worldwide and with separate command structures for the services. In addition there was the task of managing the total mobilization of industry, agriculture and transportation to worry about. In Iraq-Afghanistan we have a restricted area of operations under a unified command (the head of CenCom is a navy admiral, isn’t he?) and no total national mobilization effort. I don’t believe GW’s management burden can quite be compared to FDR’s. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/73 "2007-04-15T02:35:06Z")
[Key Democrat Backs Creation of ‘Czar’ for Iraq Reconstruction](http://govexec.com/story_page.cfm?articleid=36621&dcn=todaysnews) > [@](#): > > Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Chairman Joseph Lieberman, I-Conn., says he supports the idea of appointing a senior-level official in the Bush administration to manage operations in Iraq and Afghanistan, adding that his committee might be able to play “a constructive role” in creating the new post. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/74 "2007-04-15T04:33:32Z")
Can anyone explain what’s going on in Joe Lieberman’s brain? Why has he decided in the last couple of years that this is a great time to jump aboard the Bush bandwagon? Heck, half the Republicans in the country are trying to distance themselves from the President. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/75 "2007-04-15T06:06:49Z")
AFAIK, Lieberman’s _always_ been a nutter, he’s just become a high profile nutter since 9/11. As proof of this, I offer you [this rant](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=36293) about Lieberman posted by our own **Eve** , some _seven_ years ago. > [@Eve](#): > > Just what we need, another religious fanatic in politics! I read in the Times this morning a speech Lieberman just gave in Michigan: “As a people we need to reaffirm our faith and renew the dedication of our nation and ourselves to God and God’s purpose . . . John Adams wrote that our constitution was made ONLY [my emphasis] for a moral and religious people . . . George Washington warned us never to indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion.” He also added that the Constitution “guarantees freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.” ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/76 "2007-04-15T06:30:39Z")
And in the interests of clarity: The linked article mentions precisely one Senator who backs the creation of a War Czar, and said Senator (Lieberman) is not a Democrat at all, but an independent. Too, it specifically mentions that Lieberman and Democrats are not entirely. . .in sync. . .with each other when it comes to the cock up that is Iraq. And my favorite part is: > [@linked article](#): > > . . .he envisions such a czar being primarily responsible for the non-military aspects of “post-conflict management,” particularly in supporting provisional reconstruction teams. “This is a line that I think is unique and interesting to me and to our committee and so you can count on us to follow it,” he said. Because the conflict not only isn’t “post”, it’s not going to be anytime soon. And I, being the naif that I am, thought that someone had already tried provisional reconstruction. And I seem to recall said provisional reconstruction being even more pissed up than the horrifying clusterfuck that is Iraq. In short, I’m not entirely certain that Uncle Joe himself knows what’s going on in his brain. Does anyone know if he’s vacationed in Lyme county of late? ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/77 "2007-04-15T06:49:02Z")
No cite for this (and believe me, I’ve looked), but _prior_ to the 2006 election, Lieberman kept saying that Congress needed to subpena the Federal records dealing with FEMA’s clusterfuck in the wake of Katrina. _After_ the election, when he became chairman of the committee which has oversight on such matters, he stated that he _wasn’t_ going to subpena anything related to Katrina, because he felt that it would be more beneficial to be forward looking and _not_ dwell on the past. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/78 "2007-04-15T11:08:05Z")
[QUOTE=GLWasteful] it specifically mentions that Lieberman and Democrats are not entirely. . .in sync. . .with each other when it comes to the cock up that is Iraq. [/QUOTE] Or you could just put the period after “with each other.” Newsday: > [@](#): > > PORTLAND, Maine (AP) \_ Connecticut Sen. Joseph Lieberman said he is endorsing Sen. Susan Collins in her 2008 re-election bid and will campaign on her behalf. > > \ > > Lieberman told the National Journal’s “CongressDaily” on Thursday that he is ready to support Collins **even though he doesn’t know who the Democratic nominee will be**. He said his political action committee has contributed $5,000 toward Collins’ campaign. Bolding mine. Collins, of course, is a Republican. The media have, AFAICT, completely stopped identifying Lieberman as a Dem, which makes sense, since he’s given up almost all pretense of trying to be one. Newsday calls him “a former Democrat turned independent.” That’s about right. I consider this a downstream benefit of Lamont’s primary win last August. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/79 "2007-04-15T11:21:11Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] No cite for this (and believe me, I’ve looked), but _prior_ to the 2006 election, Lieberman kept saying that Congress needed to subpena the Federal records dealing with FEMA’s clusterfuck in the wake of Katrina. _After_ the election, when he became chairman of the committee which has oversight on such matters, he stated that he _wasn’t_ going to subpena anything related to Katrina, because he felt that it would be more beneficial to be forward looking and _not_ dwell on the past. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] That was then (when he still needed some Dem votes to win re-election), and this is now, when he’s got six years of freedom to kiss up to Publicans as much as he wants to. Not that his logic holds. If Congress wants to be “forward-looking” and make sure NOLA and the Gulf coast are rebuilt after Katrina, the first thing they need to do is figure out what’s gone wrong with the first 18 months of the reconstruction effort - how much has been spent already, where it’s gone, what’s been done and what’s still undone so far, and why it seems to have accomplished so little. How do you know whether or not to ‘stay the course’ on Katrina reconstruction, or make modest changes or wholesale changes, unless you know whether what you’ve _been_ doing is working? He’s fooling nobody who doesn’t want to be fooled. He’s just covering up Bush’s sins, and he likes it that way. Thank goodness the pretense of his being a Democrat is over and done with. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2007, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737/80 "2007-04-15T14:07:30Z")
You’ll still find \*Fox \* “commentators” calling Lieberman a Democrat. Any bets against Lieberman being the keynote speaker at the 2008 GOP convention, now that Zell Miller’s checked into the county home? Collins’ opponent is likely to be Rep. Tom Allen, btw, even though he hasn’t formally announced. Too early to call that one yet. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/war-czar-what-the-hell-is-that/399737.md?page=5)