# Was "a horse of a different color" a common phrase around the time of The Wizard of Oz? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 22, 2021, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164 "2021-01-22T03:20:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/1 "2021-01-22T03:20:14Z")
I put this in General Questions because even though it pertains to a certain movie, it _is_ asking for a factual answer. May need to be moved to Cafe Society; I don’t know. When Dorothy and her friends are trying to enter the Emerald City in _The Wizard of Oz_, the gatekeeper originally denies them entry. Then they mention that Glinda gave her the ruby slippers. The gatekeeper says, “That’s a horse of a different color! Come on in!” They soon find out that Emerald City has a _literal_ Horse of a Different Color which changes color from red to green to blue to yellow and so on. Was “a horse of a different color” a common phrase around the time that _The Wizard of Oz_ was released? I’ve never heard it out of this context, but I was born long afterwards. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/2 "2021-01-22T03:27:36Z")
_The Wizard of Oz_ was published in 1900. I don’t know if the phrase was used in the book. The movie came out in 1939. There is a bit of a peak in the phrase’s usage in the 1930s so it may have been somewhat known before the movie. > **[Google Books Ngram Viewer](https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=Horse%2Bof%2Ba%2Bdifferent%2Bcolor&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3&direct_url=t1%3B%2CHorse%20of%20a%20different%20color%3B%2Cc0#t1%3B%2CHorse%20of%20a%20different%20color%3B%2Cc0)** > > Google Books Ngram Viewer ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/3 "2021-01-22T03:41:18Z")
It was definitely in use when the book was written- Anthony Trollope’s _Last Chronicles of Barset_ (1867): “What did you think of his wife? That’s a horse of another colour altogether.” ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/4 "2021-01-22T04:05:02Z")
Which is a play on a Shakespearean metaphor; “a horse of that color”. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/5 "2021-01-22T04:08:22Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > I don’t know if the phrase was used in the book. Nope. (The text is online, at Project Gutenberg, so it’s easy to search.) ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/6 "2021-01-22T04:13:50Z")
It also occurs to me that “seeing a man about a horse” was probably a rural catch-all for doing any kind of business. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/7 "2021-01-22T04:57:15Z")
According to my [ngram search](https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=horse+of+a+different+color%2C+horse+of+a+different+colour&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3&direct_url=t1%3B%2Chorse%20of%20a%20different%20color%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2Chorse%20of%20a%20different%20colour%3B%2Cc0), “horse of a different colour/color” began rising in frequency after about 1905 and was common by 1939, peaking in 1946. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/8 "2021-01-22T05:11:31Z")
That really seems to indicate that _The Wizard of Oz_ itself drove the popularity of the phrase. Note that “colour” with a superfluous u didn’t have as strong a relative peek in 1939-40, perhaps since the UK was in the middle of a war when _Oz_ was released there in 1940. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/9 "2021-01-22T17:13:19Z")
The OED has a US citation from 1798: > 1798 _Aurora (Philadelphia)_ 27 Aug. Whether any of them may be induced…to enter into the pay of King John I. [_i.e._ President Adams] is ‘a horse of another colour’. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/10 "2021-01-22T17:42:11Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Nope. (The text is online, at Project Gutenberg, so it’s easy to search.) In fact, in the book Emerald City wasn’t green at all. All the residents wore green glasses and before the doorkeeper let the four companions in, he locked glasses onto their heads – Toto got a pass. At one point Dorothy’s glasses slipped and she noticed things were only gray before she adjusted them back in place. Also, in the fourth book, when a cousin’s cab-horse, [Jim](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Oz_characters_(created_by_Baum)#Jim_the_Cab-Horse), winds up in Oz he’s regarded as a curiosity because, while there is an animated sawhorse, there are no regular horses in Oz. I don’t know how this fits in with the _[Oz as populist allegory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_The_Wonderful_Wizard_of_Oz)_ meme. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/11 "2021-01-22T19:44:39Z")
FWIW my parents were born in the early 1930s and grew up in suburban Chicago. By then Chicago had just about zero horses of any color, much less multiple changing colors. In the early 1960s when I was little up through their final days decades later that was a standard phrase they both used regularly. Though less and less as time went along. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/12 "2021-01-22T19:55:51Z")
When the horse is actually seen in the movie, the line is “He’s the horse of a different color **you’ve heard tell about**.” - a direct reference to what was then a common phrase > [@Colibri](#): > > According to my [ngram search](https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=horse+of+a+different+color%2C+horse+of+a+different+colour&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3&direct_url=t1%3B%2Chorse%20of%20a%20different%20color%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2Chorse%20of%20a%20different%20colour%3B%2Cc0), “horse of a different colour/color” began rising in frequency after about 1905 and was common by 1939, peaking in 1946. So the phrase had become quite common by the time the movie came out - and the movie couldn’t have much to do with the phrase’s popularity since the movie itself wasn’t hugely popular when it was initially released. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/13 "2021-01-22T19:56:22Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > In the early 1960s when I was little up through their final days decades later that was a standard phrase they both used regularly. Similar to my experiences - same time/area (tho I wasn’t a rich suburban brat! ;)). Not sure where I first heard it, but as a kid I really liked jokes and puns, and I recall a sense of seeing the movie and appreciating the visual pun - which suggests to me a knowledge of the phrase before I saw the movie. Don’t know that my Ps used the phrase often, but it certainly was something that was instantly understandable and meant something specific. Just wondering, what other phrases would you use INSTEAD OF HoaDC? Brief google turned up: -another can of worms -a different tune -different breed of cat -a different kettle of fish… Pretty sure I’ve heard the “kettle of fish”, but not as often as “horse”. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/14 "2021-01-22T20:57:22Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Similar to my experiences - same time/area (tho I wasn’t a rich suburban brat! ;)). To clarify … My parents born in the 1930s grew up as Chicago suburbanites. They _used_ the phrase a lot. I grew up in the 1960s in SoCal suburbia. I _heard_ the phrase a lot from them. Darn few horses in 1960s SoCal either. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2021, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/15 "2021-01-22T21:06:05Z")
Ooh - SoCal burbs! Was it really like the Wonder Years? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2021, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/16 "2021-01-23T06:22:36Z")
The “horse of a different color” phrase derives its rhetorical power from the fact that there are, in truth, no horses of a different color. I can give a mathematical proof by induction that all horses are the same color. > **No peeking until you've given it a serious try yourself!** > > To prove that all horses in any set of n horses are all the same color: > > First, arrange all the horses in a straight line in front of you. (For clarity, let’s say this line of horses is oriented such that, from your point of view, the line has a “left” end and a “right” end.) > > Now, if you have just one horse ( n = 1 ), it is clear that all the horses in the line are of one color (there being just one horse there). > > Now consider the case for a line of n \> 1 horses. We wish to show that if any set of n horses are all the same color, then any set of ( n + 1 ) horses are all the same color. > > So line up your ( n + 1 ) horses as described above. By assumption, the left-most n horses are all the same color. But likewise, the right-most n horses are all the same color. Thus, by transitivity of equality of color, all ( n + 1 ) horses are the same color. > > Q.E.D. This proof may seem cute, but I believe it actually contains a valuable lesson about doing proofs by induction. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2021, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/17 "2021-01-23T06:32:49Z")
BTW, there’s also a corollary: There is no such thing as a unicorn. > **Proof** > > Assume there is a unicorn. > > Now, that’s a horse of another color! > > Which he have just proved does not exist. > > Q.E.D. ---
**Author:** ![vbob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vbob/32/4439_2.png) [@vbob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vbob)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2021, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/18 "2021-01-23T16:36:53Z")
My mother was born 1928, grew up in Kennett Square, PA surrounded by mushroom growers. As a young woman she moved to Providence, RI to go to art school, and started hanging out with writers and [gasp] POETS. She was fond of bad poetry and worse puns. She used the phrase “that’s a horse of a different garage” - but probably mostly to be contrary and obtuse. Just like her kids. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2021, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/19 "2021-01-23T17:06:18Z")
> [@vbob](#): > > She used the phrase “that’s a horse of a different garage” - but probably mostly to be contrary and obtuse. Just like her kids. My Mom used that variant too. I never asked for or got an explanation as to why. I wonder if that wasn’t something some comic on some radio show humorously butchered back in the 1940s and it stuck. Some very quick Googling suggests it’s a variant used by lots of people, but I wasn’t able to find anything that looked like an original attribution. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2021, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164/20 "2021-01-24T00:23:46Z")
This is the first time for me to hear this expression. . . should I sue my parents? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-a-horse-of-a-different-color-a-common-phrase-around-the-time-of-the-wizard-of-oz/931164.md?page=2)