# Was Darth Vader named after the Dutch for father, or for "invader"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [January 16, 2024, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167 "2024-01-16T14:33:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/21 "2024-01-16T19:37:26Z")
Darth Smallberries ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/22 "2024-01-16T19:38:36Z")
Supposedly at one point George Lucas said that “Darth Vader” was a variation of “Dark Water”, and he went to high school with a bully named Gary Vader. That sounds like a joke but I promise it’s not. > **[Abandoned ‘Star Wars’ Plot Points, Episode III: Evolution of Light and Dark,...](https://www.popmatters.com/193389-abandoned-star-wars-plot-points-episode-iii-evolution-of-light-and-d-2495532121.html)** > > In the beginning (or, August of 2012 to be more accurate) there was Abandoned 'Star Wars' Plot Points, Episode I: The Ties That Surround Us, Bind Us and... > In fact, according to Michael Kaminski’s _The Secret History of Star Wars_ , “Vader” was actually chosen for the character because it was the last name of a bully at Lucas’ school. Yes, the most dreaded name of all of _Star Wars_ came from “Gary Vader”, which is, to be honest, even less scary than “Darth Wilson”. At this point everything is apocrypha. ---
**Author:** ![Coriolanus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coriolanus/32/18769_2.png) [@Coriolanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coriolanus)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/23 "2024-01-16T20:58:37Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > > [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > > > Star Wars No Number. > > I agree with this. Also agree and love the “Star Wars No Number” which I will call it from now on. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/24 "2024-01-16T21:07:08Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Supposedly at one point George Lucas said that “Darth Vader” was a variation of “Dark Water”, and he went to high school with a bully named Gary Vader. So the documentary “George Lucas In Love” is more accurate than I expected! “Write what you know!”\* \*together: “mom? MOM!” ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/25 "2024-01-16T21:36:23Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Just as you have Darth Sidious (for Insidious), Darth Maul, Darth Plagueis, Darth Bane (from a Phantom Menace deleted scene), and so on. Don’t forget Darth Insanious and Darth Icky - Lucas’s two suggested names for the [_Star Wars:Force Unleashed_](https://screenrant.com/star-wars-force-unleased-starkiller-darth-icky-name/) protagonist. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/26 "2024-01-16T21:55:49Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > Don’t forget Darth Insanious and Darth Icky I’d prefer to thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/27 "2024-01-16T21:57:42Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Oh, so it’s really Darth Big-bootay? Darth Vaid-AIR… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/28 "2024-01-16T22:12:43Z")
Plus, does Lucas even know Dutch? I mean, you can’t draw names from languages you don’t know. I guess it’s just barely possible that he’d go “I want a name that means ‘father’ in some random language”, and then go look it up, but in the pre-Internet days, that was unlikely unless it was a language you already had some exposure to. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/29 "2024-01-16T22:17:43Z")
The German is Vater so that seems more plausible to me (someone in the US knowing the German word as opposed to the Dutch word - and adapting it in a way that happens to be the Dutch spelling.) ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/30 "2024-01-16T22:22:16Z")
I mean George Lucas says its from father. Without something that documents him saying something else, I’m gonna stick with that. Not that everyone is always a reliable narrator of their own creative process, but no amount of postulation from some rando online is more convincing IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/31 "2024-01-16T22:26:36Z")
Given a choice between the writer himself and a random person on the internet… my jury’s out. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/32 "2024-01-16T22:53:57Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > I mean George Lucas says its from father. Without something that documents him saying something else, I’m gonna stick with that. And George Lucas also said that he always intended for Greedo to shoot at Han first, but the technology didn’t exist at the time to make that happen. And also said that lightsabres changing colors in the middle of the movie and yellow boxes appearing around the TIE fighters was just a result of people not having their TVs adjusted correctly. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2024, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/33 "2024-01-17T04:44:37Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Oh, so it’s really Darth Big-bootay? > [@Pork\_Rind](#): > > Darth Smallberries I wanted to use either of these as a stage name, so I bounced them off the wife. “Darth Big-bootay?” “That doesn’t work, you have no butt. Your back ends in legs.” “Darth Smallberries?” “Nope, you have giant balls. That doesn’t work, either.” Honestly, she’s right about both. So my stage name is currently Darth No-Booty. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2024, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/34 "2024-01-17T08:18:13Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > There’s rewrite, and then there’s Lucas’ MiniTrue version. Changing the films for DVD and claiming “it was always that way, and you can’t prove different” just doesn’t cut it. It would be almost like claiming that Greedo shot first. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2024, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/35 "2024-01-17T08:24:56Z")
> [@MrAtoz](#): > > There’s nothing wrong with changing your plans when you get a better idea–all writers do that–but I’m not crazy about the way Lucas has maintained (and maybe convinced himself) that this was the idea from the beginning. I think that’s Gaslighting 101. Certain politicians excel at it. ---
**Author:** ![Banksiaman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banksiaman/32/3334_2.png) [@Banksiaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banksiaman)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2024, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/36 "2024-01-17T09:18:04Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > It could still be a name. All who become Sith also change their first name to Darth. Like the aliens in Buckaroo Banzai. It was originally Jeff Vader, as shown in [this deleted scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw). ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2024, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/37 "2024-01-19T06:32:38Z")
That’s really helpful - thank you! ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2024, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/38 "2024-01-19T13:28:29Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Were any other Darths even mentioned in Episode IV (no further name)? I remember thinking that Darth was his first name and Vader his last name, and when Ol’ Ben called him Darth, it wasn’t as a title but as his first name. Me too. Probably later retconned to make us think it was an epithet. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2024, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/39 "2024-01-19T13:32:49Z")
> [@Biffster](#): > > It would be almost like claiming that Greedo shot first. In the latest [Lego Star Wars game](https://youtu.be/ycSuXhZM1to?si=65lXAkpDaXmuomgg&t=52), they have Han shoot first (and miss, of course, because it’s Lego), then they have a minor shootout. Nice touch to have Han shoot first, I think. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2024, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167/40 "2024-01-19T13:34:20Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > Honestly, she’s right about both. So my stage name is currently Darth No-Booty. **kaylasmom** used to call me “skinny butt.” She’s no longer with us, so you can use “Darth Skinnybutt” if you want it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-darth-vader-named-after-the-dutch-for-father-or-for-invader/996167.md?page=3)