# Was Doctor Who's Tom Baker Really an Alcoholic? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 1, 2011, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028 "2011-01-01T05:52:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/21 "2011-01-02T18:05:31Z")
You’re assuming they drink common drinks when it’s free. _Free Single Malt Scotch? Just keep it coming!_ ---
**Author:** ![MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MPB_in_Salt_Lake)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/22 "2011-01-02T18:09:19Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > You’re assuming they drink common drinks when it’s free. > > _Free Single Malt Scotch? Just keep it coming!_ A very good point, and something that I never thought of. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/23 "2011-01-02T21:47:05Z")
Not to mention “Bartender - another round for me and my twenty friends. And put it all down on my tab!” “Certainly, Doctor!” ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/24 "2011-01-02T22:14:03Z")
> [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](#): > > I wasn’t going to ask until I saw you back today, but while I don’t know anything about conventions AT ALL, I am wondering how even a few incredibly huge bar/room service tabs could bankrupt a fan convention. > > If a guy charged 25 drinks (and survived the alcohol poisoning) at $5 a drink, that’s only $125, and let’s say with another $50 in food. If they do this for all three days of the convention, that’s still less than $500. If there are 5 actors who keep up this kind of pace, that’s still under $3000. > > Are the profit magrins so thin that this would be something that could take an entire convention down? I’ve always assumed the idea of a SF Con is to neither make money or lose money. I I to understand that there is a contractual alcohol _per deim_? ---
**Author:** ![MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MPB_in_Salt_Lake)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/25 "2011-01-02T22:32:36Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > I’ve always assumed the idea of a SF Con is to neither make money or lose money. Once again, Ignorance Fought, as I would have assumed that Sci-Fi conventions were a for-profit affair, with the profits actually split between the talent (who would be paid in advance) and the promoter, who keeps whatever is left over after all the various bills have been paid. I am not a Sci-Fi person, and have never been to a fan convention of any kind, however I am familiar with how music promoters do business, and the concert industry in general, and I guess that I figured that convention promoters followed a similar business model… ---
**Author:** ![GythaOgg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/49beb7/32.png) [@GythaOgg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GythaOgg)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/26 "2011-01-02T22:58:48Z")
> [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](#): > > I wasn’t going to ask until I saw you back today, but while I don’t know anything about conventions AT ALL, I am wondering how even a few incredibly huge bar/room service tabs could bankrupt a fan convention. > > (SNIP) > > Are the profit magrins so thin that this would be something that could take an entire convention down? > > How much is admission for a fan? > > How many fans would show up to a Doctor Who convention? > > Do these conventions make money on anything besides selling admission? (food or drinks, memorabilia, etc.?) In the day - I’m talking about the 1980s, not now- yes, profit margins on media fan cons were very thin. The aim was usually was to break even, and to give any overage to charity. Conventions that incorporated did so as non-profits. This was mostly before the rise of the ‘professional’ SF fan conventions such as Creation…indeed, when those organizations started up, they were dissed by fans precisely because they were ‘for profit’ and fans felt that wasn’t traditional. If a group of fans got together and decided to run a convention, they usually did so with their own money. There would probably be some fund-raising done in the form of T-shirts and presales of convention admissions and dealers tables. However, there would be expenses almost immediately - for printing of flyers, buying ad space in newsletters and other conventions’ program books, locking down guests, plane tickets for guests, and reserving hotel or function space. (Hotels gouge like crazy for everything from providing the tables for the dealer space to water setup to sound system setup to chairs in the function space) This could very quickly run to a lot of money, before the convention even started. Now, at the end of the convention, there are various ways a convention would see money come back to help them break even. On source would be from at-the-door sales. Another small source would be from things like selling t-shirts. The biggest factor would be if enough people stayed in the convention hotel to meet the usual clause in the hotel contract about reduced rates on the function space. This could scale up to 100% if enough ‘room nights’ were sold. Conventions don’t make money on food or drink. Hotels make money on food or drink and conventions don’t get a cut - and are often specifically prohibited from bringing in their own food or drink by the hotel. It was pretty standard for the convention to pay the guests’ expenses, including room, food, transportation, etc etc. This all had to be figured in at the end of a con. If the convention had budgeted well, usually things were OK. (Some guests would waive their appearance fees if the convention would promote their charity. For example, Colin Baker lost a child very young to SIDS and did a lot of good work promoting causes related to that at his convention appearances.) I don’t mean to turn this into a lecture on the economics of fans running a convention, but what’s important to remember was that, back then, these things were largely being done by inexperienced amateurs who had almost no idea what they were doing or getting into. For every fan convention that broke even there were probably at least five that were true disaster stories. This was a time period when there was very, very little crossover or communication in the fan community between the media fans and the literature fans, and only slightly more crossover between the new Brit-media fans and the older Star Trek fans. (Who had convention experience) To boil it all down - yeah, a $500 bar bill in those days could easily put a convention underwater at the end of the weekend. I think most people who run these things now know better; they certainly have more access to information about what and what not to do. I hope so, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MPB_in_Salt_Lake)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2011, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/27 "2011-01-02T23:06:32Z")
GythaOgg, thank you for the very interesting info—I obviously had no idea what the fan-convention world is like, and instead thought it was similar to a promoter putting on a concert or a lecture, which typically are for-profit affairs. I think it’s great to see some money going to a charity, at least if all goes well at the convention… ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2011, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/28 "2011-01-03T00:55:19Z")
> [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](#): > > GythaOgg, thank you for the very interesting info—I obviously had no idea what the fan-convention world is like, and instead thought it was similar to a promoter putting on a concert or a lecture, which typically are for-profit affairs. Far too often, those are also non-profit events…though not intentionally. One major advantage of the non-profit status of fan-run Cons is that some folks would buy advance memberships of one they had no intention of attending as “Supporting members”, just because they like the location, or the people running it, or the guest. With [Worldcons](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worldcon), membership also includes the right to vote on awarding Hugos, although I don’t know if non-attending members can vote. I’ve only been to two Worldcons, both in Chicago. One tradition is that the members get to vote on the location of upcoming ones. The committees vying to host a future Worldcon traditionally host a party every night in a hotel suite. There are enough competitors that two or more floors of a hotel are filled with party suites. ---
**Author:** ![Scubaqueen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@Scubaqueen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scubaqueen)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2011, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/29 "2011-01-03T20:54:27Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > You’re assuming they drink common drinks when it’s free. > > _Free Single Malt Scotch? Just keep it coming!_ Just as long as it’s Macallan it’s all good. 😃 Seriously? Tom Baker? Who knew? (aparently not I :eek:) ---
**Author:** ![vislor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vislor/32/5933_2.png) [@vislor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vislor)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/30 "2011-01-03T21:22:14Z")
I never saw the label alcoholic applied to Tom Baker but I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised. I read a lot more Dr Who related stuff and did know he came drunk to film several episodes. The only time he didn’t, which kept my opinion of him high, was when he was going to see kids. He didn’t drink before or during then, as I understand it. However, while it’s bad and not something we would condone now, he seemed to be a functional alcoholic. He could still do the job, mostly. As best I remember what I read. I think it was in his fifth and sixth seasons and then he stopped during the seventh and his final season. I could be wrong on those points. So, yes, we would call him an alcoholic for it and not condone it today. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2011, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028/31 "2011-01-05T15:19:54Z")
> [@GythaOgg](#): > > Some smaller conventions found out - at considerable cost - that it was a good idea to put a strict cap on the amount the British actors were allowed to charge in the hotel bar at the convention’s expense. I hadn’t previously heard that the British were particularly prone to boozing. But just recently a [wire story](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110104/ap_on_re_eu/eu_britain_smaller_beer) claimed: > [@](#): > > Liam Donaldson, then Britain’s chief medical officer, said in 2009 that while per capita alcohol consumption had fallen since 1970 in many European countries, it had increased by 40 percent in Britain, The article seems to suggest that allowing pubs to sell beer 400 ml at a time rather than 190, 284 and 568 ml only will help reduce the alcohol consumption in Britain. Yeah, lots of luck with that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-doctor-whos-tom-baker-really-an-alcoholic/566028.md?page=1)