# was Hitler a Christian? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 8, 2013, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455 "2013-01-08T06:17:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2013, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/41 "2013-01-10T23:32:58Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > I cannot think of a single Christian who does any of this. Then you haven’t been paying attention. It’s historically been the norm. I live on a continent full of Christians who got to their present position of dominance that way. ---
**Author:** ![monkeydoodle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@monkeydoodle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monkeydoodle)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/42 "2013-01-11T00:09:13Z")
> [@TonySinclair](#): > > From my reading of the Gospels, Jesus would have despised Hitler, but Jesus didn’t have much say in how Christianity developed. **IMO** Paul directly contradicted Jesus on observing the Mosaic Law, and it went downhill from there. Not so much just your opinion. Going by the words of Jesus himself (and also of his brother, James), he was a Pharisaic, observant Jew who would have been appalled not only by Hitler, but also by Paul’s version of Christianity. Paul is the one who sold the religion to the nations by making it more palatable and less “Jewish”. So, if Hitler was a Christian, he was only following the trajectory that Paul started - not Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/43 "2013-01-11T00:32:32Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Then you haven’t been paying attention. It’s historically been the norm. I live on a continent full of Christians who got to their present position of dominance that way. I don’t know. People are selfish enough to do terrible things to each other regardless of whether they try to justify it by invoking God’s Will, Manifest Destiny, or the inevitable unfolding of the historical dialectic. I don’t know if Christianity can be blamed for people being selfish if you can’t also give it credit for those people who give it as their reason for being altruistic. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/44 "2013-01-11T00:46:17Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > I don’t know. People are selfish enough to do terrible things to each other regardless of whether they try to justify it by invoking God’s Will, Manifest Destiny, or the inevitable unfolding of the historical dialectic. > > I don’t know if Christianity can be blamed for people being selfish if you can’t also give it credit for those people who give it as their reason for being altruistic. As if they ever shut up about how “altruistic” they are. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/45 "2013-01-11T00:54:22Z")
But they have you to keep them honest. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/46 "2013-01-11T00:56:39Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > In the Middle Ages antisemitic violence was often performed by the common people, often against the will of both church and secular authorities, who were both cosmopolitan enough to realize that senseless violence was wrong (and used the Jews as moneylenders in the latter case,) but of course did not often put their lives on the line to defend the Jews against the hordes of lower class people determined to seek out a scapegoat (sometimes probably egged on by the merchants who owed them money, but I’m a bit hazy on that point.) Of course, when it suited them, [the rulers also used the Jews as scapegoats.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion) ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/47 "2013-01-11T13:02:21Z")
> [@Condescending\_Robot](#): > > Gee, I thought Christianity believed that no one is capable of avoiding sin and that the test for salvation was believing in absolution through the crucifixion, but I guess when the consequences of that belief (e.g., that Hitler must have been saved if he believed) are too embarrassing for Christians, suddenly we can pretend there’s a covenant of works and that no one who does bad things could possibly be a Christian. You religious people sure are funny in your obvious lack of comfort with your own beliefs. As I read the Bible, Jesus told a woman who wanted him to help her ill child, he is quoted as saying he only came for the lost sheep of Israel. That would mean his purpose was not the salvation of all mankind…would it not? He did help the woman but that wasn’t his purpose of coming as I understand it. ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/48 "2013-01-11T18:50:17Z")
Keep in mind, folks that **Der Trihs** is a hard anti-religious type fellow, with a special hate for Christianity. You literally cannot convince him of anything good from Christianity. And because he’s HIM, he won’t argue once you start asking for cites and stuff, so there’s that. And for the record, though I am an athiest, I am pretty sure Hitler would not have thought of himself as a Christian in any way it is recognized today at all. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/49 "2013-01-11T19:49:02Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > As I read the Bible, Jesus told a woman who wanted him to help her ill child, he is quoted as saying he only came for the lost sheep of Israel. That would mean his purpose was not the salvation of all mankind…would it not? He did help the woman but that wasn’t his purpose of coming as I understand it. Not really. This is usually interpreted as him challenging her to demonstrate real faith (which she does). There is also good reason to view it this way as he was quite willing to aid other non-Jews before and after. ---
**Author:** ![powhatan\_bolling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@powhatan\_bolling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/powhatan_bolling)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2013, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/50 "2013-01-12T09:44:40Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > Hitler met the requirements to be called a Christian, which is simply for him to refer to himself as one. In Mein Kampf, Hitler wrote: “I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord..” > > He is not in heaven, since the place is mythical. But according to the particular flavor of the Christian faith that I grew up in, a suicide cannot go to heaven since he or she has committed murder and cannot repent. Other flavors will vary, I’m sure. do you actually believe that the quoted passage reveals hitler to have been a christian? there is nothing christian about it. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2013, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/51 "2013-01-12T10:28:59Z")
> [@powhatan\_bolling](#): > > do you actually believe that the quoted passage reveals hitler to have been a christian? there is nothing christian about it. Once again, the only thing that is required to be a Christian is to name it. I can’t read your mind, so I don’t know if you’re \*actually \*a Christian. So I go by what you say. The problem here is that Christians are as vile, stupid and evil as everyone else on the planet. They don’t want to think that anyone Christian could do something as evil as Hitler did, but evil Christians are hardly rare. In fact, religion gives certitude, and when you’re certain that God is on your side, you say stuff like, “Kill them all, God will know his own.” ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2013, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/52 "2013-01-12T10:32:27Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > Hitler met the requirements to be called a Christian, which is simply for him to refer to himself as one. In Mein Kampf, Hitler wrote: “I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord..” There’s nothing specifically Christian about that statement. Evidence that he may have been a Deist, yes, but nothing that speaks to Christianity. I’m not saying that he didn’t identify as a Christian, simply that the statement doesn’t show that he did. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2013, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/53 "2013-01-12T12:31:29Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Not really. This is usually interpreted as him challenging her to demonstrate real faith (which she does). There is also good reason to view it this way as he was quite willing to aid other non-Jews before and after. He still said he came only for the lost sheep of Israel and even though he may have helped others his purpose doesn’t mean saving the whole world. There was a Messiah named Simon (self proclaimed) in 4 BCE who also believed he should die for the people. Jesus didn’t try to get people to give up their being Jews just tried to get them to do better. So I still think he had his own people in mind. He had at least one occasion when he was quoted,“even the gentiles do that” I would have o re-read the Bible to find the quote but I know it is there\> ---
**Author:** ![copperwindow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@copperwindow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/copperwindow)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/54 "2013-01-13T18:21:26Z")
If Hitler is in heaven, then that means that Ghandi is burning in hell… ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2013, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/55 "2013-01-13T18:34:52Z")
> [@copperwindow](#): > > If Hitler is in heaven, then that means that Ghandi is burning in hell… Many Christians believe non-Christians automatically burn in hell. Although, Hitler did commit suicide, so some Christians think he’s automatically in hell, regardless of if he repented. In reality though, he’s pickled in a giant jar in Putin’s office. ---
**Author:** ![R3d\_Anonymous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aeb1de/32.png) [@R3d\_Anonymous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R3d_Anonymous)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/56 "2013-01-17T12:05:04Z")
Why isn’t this in GQ? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/57 "2013-01-17T12:26:12Z")
> [@Anonymous User](#): > > Why isn’t this in GQ? If you feel it requires a forum change, then Report it and have a Mod decide. If the Moderator does not agree with you, then PM any of the designated Mods for this forum and they will be more than happy to explain their reasoning to you. (ETA:In my experience, these type of questions always deteriorate to the “He couldn’t be a Christian because he was a bad person” / “Christians have done bad things in spite of / because of their religion” pseudo debates, and ultimately lead to philosophical questions about “True Christians” versus “Cultural Christians.” That makes them GD material.) ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455/58 "2013-01-17T12:31:43Z")
> [@Anonymous User](#): > > Why isn’t this in GQ? Because Christians don’t like the idea that Hitler was one of them, so they try to come up with any bullshit argument that they can to _no true Scotsman_ him out of their camp. So the clear fact that _he said he was_ and that is all we ever use to define a Christian normally, is subject to debate. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-hitler-a-christian/646455.md?page=2)