# Was I in Rome illegaly? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 15, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463 "2008-04-15T17:30:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![The\_Shroud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@The\_Shroud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Shroud)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/1 "2008-04-15T17:30:36Z")
Meant to ask this question several months back after my first trip to Europe. After a few days in London and Paris, I flew on easyjet from Paris’ Orly airport to Rome’s Ciampino airport. In Paris, I just went through a regular security check, and in Rome, I walked unimpeded from the terminal to the curb and caught a cab. It only later occurred to me that I hadn’t encountered any immigration officials that day. My passport bears this out…no stamps from that leg of the trip. I flew out of a different airport (Fuimicino) a few days later, and my passport was stamped there, and again when I got back to New York. (And for the record, it was also stamped at Waterloo station in London on my way to Paris.) So why not at Ciampino? Or did I just get lucky and walk through the wrong door? ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/2 "2008-04-15T17:32:47Z")
I’d say no. France and Italy are signatories to the Schengen Agreement, meaning that once you are cleared to enter one of the countries (that is, when you entered France from the UK) you are effectively cleared to enter them all. Edit: [Wikipedia Article](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Agreement) Basically the Schengen Agreement removes most border controls between signatory states. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/3 "2008-04-15T17:32:59Z")
No passport control because you were going from one part of the Schengen region to another. > **[Schengen Agreement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Agreement)** > > The Schengen Agreement (English: /ˈʃɛŋən/ SHENG-ən, .mw-parser-output .IPA-label-small{font-size:85%}.mw-parser-output .references .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .infobox .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .navbox .IPA-label-small{font-size:100%}Luxembourgish: \[ˈʃæŋən\] ⓘ) is a treaty which led to the creation of Europe's Schengen Area, in which internal border checks have largely been abolished. It was signed on 14 June 1985, near the town of Schengen, Luxembourg, by five of the ten member ... ---
**Author:** ![The\_Shroud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@The\_Shroud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Shroud)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/4 "2008-04-15T17:34:32Z")
That’s some quick straight dope. Thanks, folks! ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/5 "2008-04-15T17:37:19Z")
Once you arrived in France, you were inside the Schengen customs union. There are no internal border controls between France and other Schengen countries. It’s possible to go from Finland to France to Italy to Greece without hitting a _doganejo_ (customs checkpoint): I did the Finland to France thing in 2000. (I woke up in the middle of the night on a train, turned my phone on to check the time, got a text message: ‘Welcome to Belgium’. It was the only way I knew we’d even entered Belgium. 🙂 ) Not that the UK and Ireland are NOT in the Schengen zone; you still have to go through customs between France and England. Edit: man, you guys are quick on the draw… ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/6 "2008-04-15T17:52:58Z")
[QUOTE=The Shroud] That’s some quick straight dope. Thanks, folks! [/QUOTE] No problem. I always like a GQ thread where I actually know the answer 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mycroft\_H](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/898d66/32.png) [@Mycroft\_H](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mycroft_H)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/7 "2008-04-15T18:03:21Z")
Of course if you would have gone to Turin you would have had to stay there locked up in the Cathedral, but at least you still wouldn’t have had to show your passport. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/8 "2008-04-15T18:06:08Z")
[QUOTE=Sunspace] (I woke up in the middle of the night on a train, turned my phone on to check the time, got a text message: ‘Welcome to Belgium’. It was the only way I knew we’d even entered Belgium. 🙂 ) [/QUOTE] Possibly a stupid question: How did they do that? -FrL- ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/9 "2008-04-15T18:22:15Z")
[QUOTE=Frylock] Possibly a stupid question: How did they do that? -FrL- [/QUOTE] The cell company did it when handing off from the non-Belgian tower to the Belgian tower. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/10 "2008-04-15T18:23:22Z")
[QUOTE=Frylock] Possibly a stupid question: How did they do that? -FrL- [/QUOTE] Presumably, the phone registered on the Belgian network (I was in Germany before), they checked the IMEI, and since it was one that they’d never seen before, they sent a welcome message. Or maybe it was even easier: anytime something from outside was handed off to them, or activated on their network, it got a welcome message. The default language of the phone would tell them what language to use. Edit: scooped again,. Bother. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/11 "2008-04-15T18:29:28Z")
[QUOTE=Sunspace] Edit: scooped again,. Bother. 🙂 [/QUOTE] Wooo! Go me! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/12 "2008-04-15T18:38:52Z")
[QUOTE=Sunspace] Presumably, the phone registered on the Belgian network (I was in Germany before), they checked the IMEI, and since it was one that they’d never seen before, they sent a welcome message. Or maybe it was even easier: anytime something from outside was handed off to them, or activated on their network, it got a welcome message. The default language of the phone would tell them what language to use. Edit: scooped again,. Bother. 🙂 [/QUOTE] It’s standard procedure in Europe (and in a lot of other places). Typically you get a message from your home network’s partner in the country you have just arrived in, detailing rates and the local voicemail number you can use to avoid international rates, etc. It can be annoying when you keep switching between new networks and get “welcome” messages from three or four different companies - especially if you are near the international border. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/13 "2008-04-15T19:35:09Z")
Ah… okay then. It was a stupid question. 🙂 But the answers were supererogatorily informative, so thanks! -FrL- (I was thinking, “Don’t they have to know your phone number to do that?” Problem was I hadn’t thought through as to what the antecedent of “they” could be in that sentence.) ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/14 "2008-04-15T19:51:05Z")
[QUOTE=Colophon] It can be annoying when you keep switching between new networks and get “welcome” messages from three or four different companies - especially if you are near the international border. [/QUOTE] They used to do this every, flipping time I entered Ontario. And when I was with my wife, it hit both of our phones. And since we don’t carry a text plan, we were charged 10¢ a pop for receiving the message every, single time. For some reason, it only affects my personal (AT&T phone), and not my work (Sprint) phone. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/15 "2008-04-15T19:56:34Z")
[QUOTE=Balthisar] They used to do this every, flipping time I entered Ontario. And when I was with my wife, it hit both of our phones. And since we don’t carry a text plan, we were charged 10¢ a pop for receiving the message every, single time. For some reason, it only affects my personal (AT&T phone), and not my work (Sprint) phone. [/QUOTE] Maybe it’s only a GSM thing. AT&T is GSM (which is why they can carry the iPhone). Sprint is CDMA, I _think_. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2008, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/16 "2008-04-16T01:45:14Z")
[QUOTE=Frylock] Ah… okay then. It was a stupid question. 🙂 (I was thinking, “Don’t they have to know your phone number to do that?” Problem was I hadn’t thought through as to what the antecedent of “they” could be in that sentence.) [/QUOTE] It _wasn’t_ a stupid question. I wondered exactly the same thing when I read the “welcome to Belgium” thing, and would have asked exactly the same question you did, following exactly the same reasonning. Are you implying that I’m stupid? :mad: 😉 ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2008, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/17 "2008-04-16T08:06:49Z")
Ok, then, explain this: My very first trip to Europe was to Italy, back in 1994. I never went through customs on my arrival, in Rome, or on my departure, from Milan. Nobody even asked for my passport. And both flights were directly from/to JFK. According to my passport, I wasn’t there. Could this have anything to do with the fact that it was an “independent tour”? (I was a newbie traveler and needed a sense of security.) The tour company shuttled us back and forth in each city, but still, nobody ever looked at my passport. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2008, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/18 "2008-04-16T08:59:59Z")
1994 - Didn’t need Visa to / from most Western European countries and US. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2008, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/19 "2008-04-16T09:10:58Z")
[QUOTE=smithsb] 1994 - Didn’t need Visa to / from most Western European countries and US. [/QUOTE] Visa or no Visa, you still need to go through immigration ---
**Author:** ![kferr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71e660/32.png) [@kferr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kferr)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2008, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463/20 "2008-04-16T10:00:25Z")
I visited Italy in around 1997. There was immigration but it was very lax. Once they saw the blue cover on the passport they just waved me thru. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-i-in-rome-illegaly/445463.md?page=2)