# Was it a False Flag attack by a couple of IRS employes to lead to mainstream Tax Revolt **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 1, 2013, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850 "2013-06-01T10:16:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/101 "2013-06-03T10:59:44Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > No its not. On what basis do you get to decide if it is or if it isn’t? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/102 "2013-06-03T11:10:01Z")
Let’s go with your theory for a minute: I don’t think a tax revolt would be the goal, so much as a total discreditation of government gathering data in general, something that’s very important right now due to the background checks legislation and Obamacare. If the government can’t gather data on Americans, it can’t do a lot of the things liberals want it to do. If I was planning this whole thing, that’s what I’d be looking to accomplish anyway. Tax revolts are so 1970s and we’ve pretty much already accomplished as much as can be accomplished with them. Taxing the middle class is pretty much over now in all 50 states and the federal government. So now we right-wing types have to move on to bigger goals. And the IRS targeting controversy isn’t even the big fish yet. That lawsuit alleging that the IRS stole 10 million peoples’ medical records in California under the pretense of investigating a tax issue, it’s so brazen, so lawless, that you’d think it would have to be a false flag operation. The alternative is that the IRS is really just that arrogant and think they can do anything they want. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/103 "2013-06-03T11:53:42Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Let’s go with your theory for a minute: I don’t think a tax revolt would be the goal, so much as a total discreditation of government gathering data in general, something that’s very important right now due to the background checks legislation and Obamacare. If the government can’t gather data on Americans, it can’t do a lot of the things liberals want it to do. > . A response along the lines I thought would be debateable. Unfortunately I can’t get back to this until later tonight. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/104 "2013-06-03T12:34:09Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Unfortunately I can’t get back to this until later tonight. Isn’t that the next play in the JAQing playbook? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/105 "2013-06-03T12:52:45Z")
Stilll waiting on that list of conservative/Tea Party orgs crushed beneath the liberal jackboot. If there were a massacre, shouldn’t there be some bodies? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/106 "2013-06-03T13:27:34Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Oh definitely. My common sense only told me that the administrations’ attempt to just blame low level employees in Cincinnati was dishonest on two levels: first, low level IRS employees would not be able to get away with what they were doing, and second, Cincinnati is the place where the IRS non-profits division is. It would be like blaming Wal-mart malfeasance on “just some low level employees in Bentonville.” They didn’t get away with it. Now, will you drop this silly line? It’s nearly as bad as the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kearsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/107 "2013-06-03T13:53:21Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > I wrote what I wrote, so there is no need to rephrase what I wrote. > > Now if you could respond to what I actually wrote, I will take a look at it. > > And please be mindful of the fact that I did not say that ‘it was’ anything. I asked a question ‘could it be’. > > Your error in interpretation is duly noted as so many are making the same mistake. You are that guy aren’t you. You are that guy that calls in to ‘talk’ to Sean Hannity (is he still on the radio?) or Rush Limbaugh because you are going to be better than they are dammit. You are going to get the truth out. So you sit and listen to every word they say, you listen for every inflection that tells you they are flat out lying and then you pounce, like a lion on a baby gazelle, not wanting to wait until you taste that fresh baby blood. I’d call that “guy” ,crazy. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/108 "2013-06-03T14:10:22Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > …you pounce, like a lion on a baby gazelle, not wanting to wait until you taste that fresh baby blood. > I’d call that “guy” ,crazy. If your choice of simile is anything to go by, you should probably both be in therapy. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/109 "2013-06-03T14:25:07Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > I’d call that “guy” ,crazy. > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > If your choice of simile is anything to go by, you should probably both be in therapy. This thread was ridiculous before; if people are going to insult each other I’ll close it. Don’t do this again. ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kearsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/110 "2013-06-03T14:34:14Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > If your choice of simile is anything to go by, you should probably both be in therapy. C’mon, I was just trying to be more like my friend elucidator! ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kearsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/111 "2013-06-03T14:35:14Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > This thread was ridiculous before; if people are going to insult each other I’ll close it. Don’t do this again. My apologies, it was an attempt at humor. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/112 "2013-06-03T14:36:32Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Now has anyone seen or heard the anti-IRS fever on the right and would even consider that the establishment Republicans could lose what little control they have of their right wing nut jobs like Glenn Beck and Mark Levin and see the possibilty of a large scale tax revolt starting to emerge and taking on a course of its own? There is no controlling authority orchestrating the activities of either the right wing or left wing nut jobs. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/113 "2013-06-03T14:57:33Z")
Apologies to all concerned. Got a bit out of line there. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/114 "2013-06-03T15:02:46Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > If you ask the “who benefits” question Asking “who benefits” leads some people to conclude that 35% of the Western Hemisphere conspired to kill JFK. > [@](#): > > This can discredit an ideology. At this point, we’re debating whose. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/115 "2013-06-03T16:30:23Z")
I’d like some explanation of what the OP believes a “tax revolt” would consist of and who would stand to benefit from such a thing. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/116 "2013-06-03T16:35:47Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I’d like some explanation of what the OP believes a “tax revolt” would consist of… Everyone not paying their taxes. > [@](#): > > who would stand to benefit from such a thing. _Them._ Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/117 "2013-06-03T16:48:28Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > That’s not the devious part. The devious part is how they managed to avoid accountability: slow walk an investigation until after the election, and of course the investigation reveals “rogue employees”. > > If the issue had been addressed promptly, it would have come out before the election. The targeting started in 2010, the complaints about the targeting started immediately after, but it took until after the President was safely reelected to finish the investigation? How convenient. You realize that a Bush appointee was in charge of the IRS during this slow walking of the investigation, right? > [@](#): > > Have to admit though, the OP isn’t crazy. If you ask the “who benefits” question, it’s pretty clear that my side gets a huge bonanza from this. Joe Scarborough, who favors background checks for gun owners, now says he’s not sure because the government has proved they can’t be trusted with private information. A panelist from the Huffington Post agreed, saying, “This feeds the notion that government is corrupt or incompetent”. Well, yeah. Which discredits the entire enterprise, not just the IRS. > > That’s why Republicans aren’t pouncing on this as greedily as with the Benghazi thing. This is much bigger for us than just hurting a President. This can discredit an ideology. The rogue employees youa re talking about are people who applied an inappropriate filter to determine which applications should receive more scrutiny. > [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > On what basis do you get to decide if it is or if it isn’t? If your theory requires the existence of several layers of extreme right wing federal employees (a largely left leaning workforce) to discredit their own institution, you are tilting at unicorns. This was just a fuck up. They had a huge surge of work and they took an ill advised short cut. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/118 "2013-06-03T17:14:53Z")
A general tax revolt stemming from this scandal is about as likely as the next president being a former member of the Beach Boys. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/119 "2013-06-03T17:15:19Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I’d like some explanation of what the OP believes a “tax revolt” would consist of and who would stand to benefit from such a thing. The tax revolt we possibly could see would be, as I have stated, contingent upon the failure of the Republican controlled House to impeach Obama within the next couple years. The tax revolt would not be waged for the benefit of any major Political Party, it would be fueled by anger, hatred and the fear that Obama is destroying America and driven to remove liberty from the only real and great Americans that make up all these loosely knit grassroots Tea Party groups. These were the groups that were targeted by the IRS, they believe, to win a second term to finish destroying America and destroying their freedom. There could be a point where establishment Republicans and the Party’s extremist Tea Party wing part ways over the failure to impeach and failure to repeal Obamacare. If the GOP won’t remove what the extreme right wing sees as an illegitimate and tyrannical government the these hate-filled individuals may take matters into their own hands to stop Obama and Obamacare before he leaves office. The only way Tea Partiers and anti government extremists can revolt and do real damage is to stop paying taxes and dare the Federal Government to arrest them or seize their property This trumped scandal at the IRS could under certain conditions could push millions who have believed Obama was not a legitimate President from the start. They now believe he stole a second term by using the IRS to strong arm the opposition, And as John Mace pointed these nut jobs have 3/4 of Americans believing that the IRS abused its power - So the right wing’s scandal antics should be perhaps more cause for concern than it was a month ago. The IRS’s role in implementing Obama care and second amendment rights folks could all add fuel to s potentially harmful fire, I’m not predicting that it will happen, but that we should watch what happens as out summer of scandal gets heated up. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850/120 "2013-06-03T17:19:29Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > You realize that a Bush appointee was in charge of the IRS during this slow walking of the investigation, right? > > The rogue employees youa re talking about are people who applied an inappropriate filter to determine which applications should receive more scrutiny. > > If your theory requires the existence of several layers of extreme right wing federal employees (a largely left lbeaning workforce) to discredit their own institution, you are tilting at unicorns. > > This was just a fuck up. They had a huge surge of work and they took an ill advised short cut. It is not a theory. It is a what if question. And it does not require several layers if employees. Just a couple right wing minded acting on their own. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-it-a-false-flag-attack-by-a-couple-of-irs-employes-to-lead-to-mainstream-tax-revolt/659850.md?page=7)