# Was premarital sex uncommon in days past? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 16, 2006, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716 "2006-07-16T07:02:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/21 "2006-07-17T00:25:09Z")
[QUOTE=gabriela] An “action for the breach of promise” was a lawsuit in past centuries, under British law, in which a girl sued a man who had promised to marry her if she had sex with him, for not marrying her. It was only brought if she was pregnant, I do believe. IANAL. [/QUOTE] And going back to the days of Henry VIII deciding to get married at some point in the future and then had sex you were married. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/22 "2006-07-17T00:39:04Z")
In rural, and even moreso in frontier environments marriage was not so formal in nature. While a church was often the first thing a town wanted to build, that didn’t happen until you got enough people to have a town. that state of affairs was still the rule until the late 19th century, throughout much of the US. Tris ---
**Author:** ![R.P.McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@R.P.McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R.P.McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/23 "2006-07-17T03:02:20Z")
As Thudlow said, people used to get married much younger. In addition, many marriages were (and still are) arranged by the families while the family tried to keep strict control of the females until they married them off. In the scheme of history, the idea of marriage being based solely on romantic love is a fairly recent development. Of course, the issue is full of contradictions and exceptions. Then you can get into the practice of female circumcision which is an attempt to prevent the female from desiring the sex act in order to control her behavior. (Let’s not go there.) ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/24 "2006-07-17T09:25:28Z")
[QUOTE=chorpler] Okay, clearly that’s what you _must_ mean, because otherwise the statement makes no sense. \ [/QUOTE] I assume he meant within 6 months AFTER the wedding date. This still makes perfect sense when you consider the human gestational period of ~ 9 months. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/25 "2006-07-17T09:35:19Z")
We were just having this discussion last night. An older friend said his grandmother had a saying “the first child can come at any time, the rest take 9 months”. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/26 "2006-07-17T12:20:59Z")
[QUOTE=Triskadecamus] While a church was often the first thing a town wanted to build, that didn’t happen until you got enough people to have a town. [/QUOTE] More often, it was a saloon, jail or house of ill-fame. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/27 "2006-07-17T14:38:09Z")
A recently published book – _The Girls Who Went Away_ by Ann Fessler – discusses the large number of unwed girls who were forced to give their babies up for adoption in the pre-_Roe_ era. One of the points of that book was that in the pre-sexual revolution era, people were having a lot of premarital sex, and they were doing it without rudimentary sex education or access to contraception. ---
**Author:** ![Sparrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Sparrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparrow)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/28 "2006-07-17T15:49:36Z")
[QUOTE=Alive At Both Ends] In the UK, it’s been estimated that a third of all Victorian brides were pregnant. So much for “Victorian morals”. This was particularly true for farmers - it was essential that they have children to pass the farm on to, and would not marry until they knew that their prospective brides could bear children. [/QUOTE] What AABE said. Virginity might have been prized among the upper classes, but for the working classes it was commonplace for the bride to be pregnant - proving her fertility. ---
**Author:** ![Rayne\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@Rayne\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rayne_Man)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/29 "2006-07-17T15:59:54Z")
The BBC have just broadcast a series about the 18th century. One programme dealt with prostitution in London. One fact that emerged was that one in eight females in London were either part or full-time prostitutes. ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/30 "2006-07-17T16:20:25Z")
[QUOTE=Sparrow] What AABE said. Virginity might have been prized among the upper classes, but for the working classes it was commonplace for the bride to be pregnant - proving her fertility. [/QUOTE] nitpick: “Virginity might have been prized among the FEMALE upper classes…” ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/31 "2006-07-17T17:05:00Z")
[QUOTE=Carnac the Magnificent!] nitpick: “Virginity might have been prized among the FEMALE upper classes…” [/QUOTE] No, you mean female virginity was equally prized among both the male _and_ female upper classes. Even the slightest hint that a female may have “compromised” herself was enough to derail a Victorian man’s interest. Males themselves did not have to be virgins, and indeed were not expected to be. But that’s not quite what your nitpick says. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/32 "2006-07-17T17:14:06Z")
Wiliam Shakespeare’s daughter was born six months after the wedding. I’ve read that engagement was legally binding, and many folks figured “what the hell?” ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/33 "2006-07-17T17:59:38Z")
[QUOTE=Annie-Xmas] Wiliam Shakespeare’s daughter was born six months after the wedding. I’ve read that engagement was legally binding, and many folks figured “what the hell?” [/QUOTE] Shakespeare was not a Victorian. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/34 "2006-07-17T18:06:05Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] Shakespeare was not a Victorian. [/QUOTE] In either sense of the word. Neither was Chaucer, for that matter. But I think the point is that there is a cultural thread that says: “People in the past were better. Our society today is degenerate.” ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/35 "2006-07-17T20:02:51Z")
[QUOTE=DanBlather] We were just having this discussion last night. An older friend said his grandmother had a saying “the first child can come at any time, the rest take 9 months”. [/QUOTE] It’s scientific fact! ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/36 "2006-07-17T20:47:04Z")
[QUOTE=acsenray] But I think the point is that there is a cultural thread that says: “People in the past were better. Our society today is degenerate.” [/QUOTE] I suspect people have been saying that for as long and as often as humans have been screwing. In other words, throughout our evolutionary history (well, at least since the development of language). ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/37 "2006-07-17T21:09:11Z")
An ancestor of my grandmother’s (I think it was her grandfather) was born out of wedlock in Sweden in the early 1800s. He had a different last name than her maiden name and her eventual husband’s name (I don’t even think his last name could have been a patronymic from her eventual husband’s name, unless those rules work entirely differently than is my understanding). His mother didn’t get married for quite a while after he was born, either. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/38 "2006-07-17T21:43:21Z")
[QUOTE=Annie-Xmas] Wiliam Shakespeare’s daughter was born six months after the wedding. I’ve read that engagement was legally binding, and many folks figured “what the hell?” [/QUOTE] At what point in history were people aware that gestation was roughly equal to 9 months? ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/39 "2006-07-17T23:18:53Z")
[QUOTE=ShibbOleth] At what point in history were people aware that gestation was roughly equal to 9 months? [/QUOTE] Probably at the same time that they realised that sex was what caused babies. And I find it hard to believe that was anytime in recorded history. I suspect even Neanderthals knew that. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2006, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716/40 "2006-07-17T23:57:02Z")
It also depends on what you mean by sex. I recall a writer in the NYTBR who discussed the “sexual culture of ‘anything but’” that was prevalent in the 40s and 50s. ::remembers parents’ birthdates:: ::shudders:: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-premarital-sex-uncommon-in-days-past/364716.md?page=3)