# Was Q (on Star Trek: TNG) good or evil? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 23, 2009, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109 "2009-04-23T16:29:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/21 "2009-04-23T18:17:36Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > Dude. He killed Baldur. Come on. Hod it was who hurled the lethal dart. And Odin took his vengenace on Hod as well as Baldr, going so far as to rape the giantess Rind so as to beget Vali specifically for that purpose. (He needed an assassin unrelated to Baldr on his mother’s side, so he could not simply sire a child on his wife. Also Odin is, well, evil.) > [@](#): > > And Q led to the deaths of some of the Enterprise crew after they encountered the Borg. > > So, if he’s not Loki, he’s a troll. Imagine if Q had gone wenching that decade rather than screwing around with Picard & Company. The Federation does not then encounter the Borg until the latter are knocking on the door of the Alpha Quadrant; Starfleet is still in its silly “we are not a military organization” thing made possible only because of so many years of peace with the Klingons and the Romulans being busy behind their borders. They get slaughtered. It’s off topic, but do any of the Trek novels ever speculate what the Romulans were doing for so many years that led to the long "peace’ between them & the Federation? ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/22 "2009-04-23T18:19:23Z")
Cool, there are at least three of us who crossover the _TNG_ and _DOOL_ fandoms. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/23 "2009-04-23T18:23:51Z")
> [@SHAKES](#): > > One thing I always wanted to know about Q is what the hell was that exchange all about when Q and Gynan (SP?) first crossed paths? (on the show) > > I can’t remember the exact episode it was, but Q was acting like he was scared of Gynan. (Gynan held her hands up to him like she was going to do some weird voo-doo stuff on him) > > Why the hell would Q be scared of anybody? > > As to the OP: > > I’d say Q is like a two year old. He’s OK as long as he’s entertained, but man, you don’t want to be around when he starts to throw a temper tantrum. I’ve always taken it that Guinan had acquired some specific anti-Q mojo. Hell, she may have even gotten it from the Suzie Plakson Q. It’s clear that Guinan and Delancie Q had already encountered one another and that she has interfered with him before, and that SP-Q can, at best, just barely stand JD-Q. Yeah, I know, I’m ignoring my own adomition to disregard Voyager. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/24 "2009-04-23T18:25:30Z")
Crap, missed the editing window. Agreed with most that Q is neither good nor evil, but a willful trickster. And I understand Picard not being able to play along; he was responsible for 1000+ lives on board. When Q shows up, Picard has no idea what “mischief” they’re all in for – and some crew deaths can be placed squarely on Q’s plate. It’s fun for us to watch, but realistically, I can’t imagine someone living through Q’s pranks would be as amused by 'em. Well, except for those who saw Beverly turned into an Irish Setter. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/25 "2009-04-23T18:34:15Z")
The novels do tend to paint Q in a more negative light. _Q-in-Law_ has Q deliberately screwing with two young lovers, and with his interference the plot nearly resembles Romeo and Juliet step for step. His motive, as he explains it, was to understand what it is to love and be loved, but he gets nasty enough that it’s probable he’s just full of spite and is using the ‘immortal trying to understand mortals’ line as an excuse. The novels are essentially fanfic, though, so it’s difficult to say how much they should be relied on. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/26 "2009-04-23T18:35:11Z")
Can anyone who loves mariachi music truly be considered Evil? ---
**Author:** ![Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bc8723/32.png) [@Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fish)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/27 "2009-04-23T19:21:01Z")
A truly evil immortal and omnipotent being would have been able to leave more permanent scars on the populace, not just on humanity but all races in the quadrant. Q could have set the Klingons and Romulans and the Ferrengi and the Federation and the Bajorans and the Cardassians all fighting one another in a six-way bloody battle for no discernable purpose. Q could have transformed them all into mice and had them devoured by wolves. Q could have exposed everyone to the one thing he or she feared most. A truly evil Q would have done these things _and then gloated about it._ So everyone would know who was to blame. In general, however, Q left things almost exactly as he found them. While he did some evil things, it’s hard for me to say he’s an evil being at heart, because with his power and knowledge he could have done _so much worse._ ---
**Author:** ![melodyharmonius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/melodyharmonius/32/21310_2.png) [@melodyharmonius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/melodyharmonius)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/28 "2009-04-23T19:51:23Z")
> [@MN\_Maenad](#): > > [whine] [Euge](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_Bradford)! [/whine] > [@choie](#): > > Cool, there are at least three of us who crossover the _TNG_ and _DOOL_ fandoms. 🙂 Thank you! I was so worried I would be the only one and drummed out of the thread. :rolleyes: I do think that Q thought he was not evil. But then, so very few of us rarely think we are. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/29 "2009-04-23T20:13:25Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Hod it was who hurled the lethal dart. > > And Odin took his vengenace on Hod as well as Baldr, going so far as to rape the giantess Rind so as to beget Vali specifically for that purpose. (He needed an assassin unrelated to Baldr on his mother’s side, so he could not simply sire a child on his wife. Also Odin is, well, evil.) Hod was blind, and Loki tricked him into shooting a mistletoe arrow at Baldur. So that was rather mean, if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/30 "2009-04-23T20:21:11Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > Hod was blind, and Loki tricked him into shooting a mistletoe arrow at Baldur. So that was rather mean, if you ask me. Did you miss the part where Odin rapes the giantess to beget the avenger? And we still haven’t touched on the meanness in this tale. Part of Loki’s punishment involves his sons Narfi and Vali, the former of whom the Aesir turns into a wolf and sets upon the other. Once Narfi has killed VAli, the Aesir chase him off, then use the dead son’s entrails to bind Loki with, turning the guts to stone once Loki is bound. Then, of course, there is the snake with the acidic venom set to drip upon Loki’s face till Ragnarok. And Thor kicked a dwarf into Baldr’s funeral pyre for no especial reason. Do not annoy the Aesir. Do not go to the funeral of one of the Aesir. If you find yourself in a situation in which someone you are related to has annoyed the Aesir, commit suicide immediately. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/31 "2009-04-23T20:29:26Z")
Damn straight. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/32 "2009-04-23T20:39:29Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Did you miss the part where Odin rapes the giantess to beget the avenger? > > And we still haven’t touched on the meanness in this tale. Part of Loki’s punishment involves his sons Narfi and Vali, the former of whom the Aesir turns into a wolf and sets upon the other. Once Narfi has killed VAli, the Aesir chase him off, then use the dead son’s entrails to bind Loki with, turning the guts to stone once Loki is bound. Then, of course, there is the snake with the acidic venom set to drip upon Loki’s face till Ragnarok. > > And Thor kicked a dwarf into Baldr’s funeral pyre for no especial reason. > > Do not annoy the Aesir. Do not go to the funeral of one of the Aesir. If you find yourself in a situation in which someone you are related to has annoyed the Aesir, commit suicide immediately. It’s been years since I read my Norse mythology, and I don’t remember Odin raping a giantess, although it wouldn’t surprise me. I do agree, however, the Aesir could kick Q’s ass and drink a pint of mead while doing it. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/33 "2009-04-23T21:52:06Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > It’s been years since I read my Norse mythology, and I don’t remember Odin raping a giantess, although it wouldn’t surprise me. _Shockingly_, that story is not in Colum’s The Children of Odin\*. 😃 Well the Aesir weren’t as bad as the Olympians (who, as we all know, were pure, unblinking, puppy-raping kitten-strangling hamster-barbecuing evil-- they weren’t all that nice; and Odin was vile enough to fit in quite well with Zeus and his villainous brood. Thor, of course, rocks. He’s the god of the common man, not of kings & warriors. I’m willing to give him a pass because it was his brother’s funeral; I’m willing to bet the dwarf made an ill-timed joke. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/34 "2009-04-23T22:51:17Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Can anyone who loves mariachi music truly be considered Evil? I would posit the exact opposite. And Q never meet Oprah…he would have died of fright 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/35 "2009-04-23T23:04:01Z")
Q allowed the writers to do bad things, or at least produce bad episodes. ---
**Author:** ![Catamount](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/catamount/32/2840_2.png) [@Catamount](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catamount)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/36 "2009-04-23T23:28:41Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Hod it was who hurled the lethal dart. And Loki it was who disguised himself as an old woman and refused to weep for Baldr, rendering his death permanent. Q is totally a Loki figure. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2009, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/37 "2009-04-23T23:42:47Z")
> [@SpazCat](#): > > And Loki it was who disguised himself as an old woman and refused to weep for Baldr, rendering his death permanent. I wasn’t arguing that Loki wasn’t guilty, just that, as far as the Aesir was concerned, Hod was equaly guilty of the original murder. But the Aesir were fairly bloodthirsty and not given to niceties. I’m sure after Loki was bound with his son’s intestines, Odin said, “Yo, Frey, go find Laufey and strip her naked and drop her into a pit filled with horny bears. I’d do it myself, but I need to consult the runes and make sure I haven’t overlooked anyone I could be taking vengeance upon.” ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2009, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/38 "2009-04-24T01:36:35Z")
I think Q is Q. Neither generally good nor generally evil. That said, DeLancie Q is a bit juvenile & does some dangerous things, without being actively malicious. In D&D terms, he’s chaotic neutral, with maximum power. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2009, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/39 "2009-04-24T02:07:38Z")
You have to understand (as much as humans can) the Q perspective. Here is a race of beings who can not just do anything, but can make anything **have happened or will happen**. They can pick and choose out of all possible different timelines all possible things. Pick any imaginable alternate universe, and the Q can make it so by an act of will. The Guardian of Forever is a child’s toy compared to what the Q can do. Which inevitably leads to a certain degree of ennui. If you can make **anything** have happened, what _should_ you do? From what we see in “All Good Things”, the Q want to see if there’s a version of history where some species transcends mere time and starts to see history from the outside, the way they do. The Q Picard and company encounter is in charge of one part of this project. Q’s bullying and contradictory nature is probably due to his own internal conflicts: he’s a cynic who secretly wishes to be proven wrong. Part of the problem is that despite being hyperintelligent and having a vast intellectual knowledge of humans, Q doesn’t really understand humanity very well. He has a sort of cartoonish, cliched view of human society because he (initially) finds it hard to understand that what humans do seems _important_ to them. The very concept of having to work within time with limited resources to achieve an outcome is alien to someone who can reorder reality with a wave of a hand. Q is in some ways like Mark Twain’s Mysterious Stranger, of whom it is said > [@](#): > > …And always when he was talking about men and women here on the earth and their doings- even their grandest and sublimest- we were secretly ashamed, for his manner showed that to him they and their doings were of paltry poor consequence; often you would think he was talking about flies, if you didn’t know. Once he even said, in so many words, that our people down here were quite interesting to him, notwithstanding they were so dull and ignorant and trivial and conceited, and so diseased and rickety, and such a shabby, poor, worthless lot all around. He said it in a quite matter-of-course way and without bitterness, just as a person might talk about bricks or manure or any other thing that was of no consequence and hadn’t feelings. ETA. I also suspect that Q quite simply has bad taste. He probably has the Q-Continum equivalent of pink flamingos on his lawn. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2009, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109/40 "2009-04-24T03:20:26Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > The very concept of having to work within time with limited resources to achieve an outcome is alien to someone who can reorder reality with a wave of a hand. From the episode “Deja Q” Q: “Simple: Change the gravitational constant of the universe.” LaForge: “What?” Q: “Change the gravitational constant of the universe, thereby altering the mass of the asteroid.” LaForge: “Redefine gravity. And how the hell am I supposed to do that?” Q: “You just DO it. GAHH! Where’s that doctor, anyway?” Data: “Geordi is trying to say that changing the gravitational constant of the universe is beyond our capabilities.” Q: “Well, then… never mind.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-q-on-star-trek-tng-good-or-evil/494109.md?page=3)