# Was that you, Libertarian? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 25, 2004, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927 "2004-04-25T17:03:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/1 "2004-04-25T17:03:42Z")
> [@](#): > > Libertarian Reluctantly Calls Fire Department > CHEYENNE, WY—After attempting to contain a living-room blaze started by a cigarette, card-carrying Libertarian Trent Jacobs reluctantly called the Cheyenne Fire Department Monday. “Although the community would do better to rely on an efficient, free-market fire-fighting service, the fact is that expensive, unnecessary public fire departments do exist,” Jacobs said. “Also, my house was burning down.” Jacobs did not offer to pay firefighters for their service. [News In Brief](http://www.theonion.com/) 😃 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/2 "2004-04-25T17:16:09Z")
“Also, my house was burning down.” 😃 Man, I hate having to wipe beer off my monitor! ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/3 "2004-04-25T18:06:57Z")
That’s gold! ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/4 "2004-04-25T18:17:16Z")
You know, I’d respect libertarians so much more if they just had the courage of their convictions. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![dnooman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/839c29/32.png) [@dnooman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dnooman)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/5 "2004-04-25T18:24:45Z")
That’s exactly what I thought when I read it. “Plus my house was burning down”, freakin priceless! ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/6 "2004-04-26T01:51:37Z")
And that, my friends, is why my brethren and I will always just be a freak show. Most members of the party are idiots more in love with their intellectual convictions than the practical aspects of governing even a small city. Dammit. ---
**Author:** ![Chairman\_Pow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Chairman\_Pow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chairman_Pow)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/7 "2004-04-26T02:42:41Z")
On the other hand, we all know how well Crassus’ fire department worked… ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/8 "2004-04-26T03:08:08Z")
Eh, Jonathan, you did notice this is the Onion, right? ---
**Author:** ![iampunha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/74df32/32.png) [@iampunha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iampunha)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/9 "2004-04-26T04:32:29Z")
**Lib** lives in the Carolinas, last I checked, so there’s that at least going for him. ---
**Author:** ![mallocks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f4b2a3/32.png) [@mallocks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mallocks)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/10 "2004-04-26T12:34:30Z")
Ah, after reading it in the OP I thought it had to be too good to be true. Shame. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/11 "2004-04-26T12:38:46Z")
> [@Jenaroph](#): > > Eh, Jonathan, you did notice this is the Onion, right? Yeah, I did. But this is only indicative of a true picture. Like that libertarian flake who turned himself blue out west a while ago. When they came to cover him being blue he self-identified as a libertarian for the media. We are our own worst enemies. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/12 "2004-04-26T12:49:00Z")
> [@Chairman Pow](#): > > On the other hand, we all know how well Crassus’ fire department worked… Oh, yes, a prompt and efficient service that was. By golly, we need more Roman ways in our lax, corrupt society! I say, bring back the ancient ways! Let’s have that old-time government like Caligula used to have! ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/13 "2004-04-26T14:49:40Z")
I’m going to put my pretend libertarian hat on here, because what’s been said so far has been unduly harsh to the fictional chap (and hence hasn’t appreciated the quality of the wrinting). Where the government provides fire services largely financed by coercion, it is not possible for market-based alternatives to compete. In the absence of government, good market-based alternatives would emerge. There would be an interplay of insurance, land values and club-like behaviour that would deal with the problem. The government-subsidised approach prevent voluntary, innovative, low cost alternatives from emerging. Should a person like this let their house burn down? I don’t see why. And why should he offer to pay - he’s entered no contract. And the “social contract” to which he objects doesn’t require him to anyway. Why should a libertarian (or anyone else) be expected to act as though he lives in his perfect world? The bloke isn’t flaky. Nor does he lack the courage of his convictions. He just has to live in an imperfect world with its daily petty indignities. ---
**Author:** ![paperbackwriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@paperbackwriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paperbackwriter)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2004, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/14 "2004-04-26T17:30:25Z")
Except that we _did_ have free-market fire departments at one time in this country. Ever watch _This Old House_ on PBS? You know that “sponsorship announcement” (aka, commercial) at the start of the show from State Farm? The one with the odd sort of plaque thing floating through the camera range? The design of that was taken from cast-iron plaques that you used to nail to the outside of your house. If you were a State Farm insurance holder, that told the State Farm firemen that they should save your house. If you had another insurance company’s plaque, the State Farm guys wouldn’t show up – the other company guys would. If you were a cheapskate, then they all would show up and stand around watching your house burn until you paid one of them to get off their collective ass and get to work. Of course, this was at a time when the hand-drawn hose reel was the epitome of fire-fighting technology, so any efforts wouldn’t have been very helpful, anyway. But the point is, this country did experiment with other forms of fire protection and went the other way. Not by Federal government fiat, but by local communities agreeing that community-supported fire departments were better. ---
**Author:** ![Chairman\_Pow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Chairman\_Pow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chairman_Pow)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2004, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/15 "2004-05-01T19:14:33Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Oh, yes, a prompt and efficient service that was. By golly, we need more Roman ways in our lax, corrupt society! I say, bring back the ancient ways! Let’s have that old-time government like Caligula used to have! The gentleman understands that that was a joke. ---
**Author:** ![Shade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@Shade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shade)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2004, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/16 "2004-05-01T20:10:59Z")
I realise this is a joke, but many people, both those of the differing political beliefs, and those mocking them, seem to think this. It looks to me like he HAS paid: he presumably was required to pay taxes, some of which go to the fire service. Just because I don’t want to do that, once I’ve been forced to, I don’t see why I shouldn’t get the benefit. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2004, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/17 "2004-05-01T21:28:14Z")
“Is your house on fire? Why not call us today?” ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2004, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/18 "2004-05-02T00:00:02Z")
> [@paperbackwriter](#): > > But the point is, this country did experiment with other forms of fire protection and went the other way. Not by Federal government fiat, but by local communities agreeing that community-supported fire departments were better. Very likely because, ivory tower free-enterprise theories notwithstanding, in crowded areas the department had to fight the fire in nonsubscribing building A anyway in order to prevent the loss of the subscribing building B abutting A. ---
**Author:** ![fortytwo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f9ae1b/32.png) [@fortytwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fortytwo)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2004, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-that-you-libertarian/241927/19 "2004-05-02T00:02:23Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > “Is your house on fire? Why not call us today?” Thank you for calling the Bradbury 451 Fire Service. Unfortunately all our operators are busy right now. You call is important to us, …Thank you for waiting, you are now…fourth in the queue…Thank you for waiting, you are now … third in the queue… Thank you for waiting, this is the Bradbury 451 automatic answering facility: If you wish to hear our current charges for fire cover… please press button 1. If you are an existing customer… please press button 2. If your house is burning down please hang on, an operator will be with you as soon as possible to laugh their socks off at you for not having fire cover…