# Was there a lot of racism directed towards Desi Arnaz? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 10, 2013, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343 "2013-04-10T18:14:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![seal\_cleaner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@seal\_cleaner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seal_cleaner)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/81 "2013-10-19T23:15:26Z")
Vivian Vance and her husband had dinner at my house when I was a kid. Lotsa diamonds and a mink coat. Very glamorous. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2013, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/82 "2013-10-20T00:44:48Z")
It’s been a long time since I’ve read any Lucille Ball biographies. But I don’t remember anything outrageous that sticks in my mind. It could be there, just don’t remember. CBS was very reluctant to cast Arnaz and when they did, they kept his name off the title (the I in I Love Lucy was their concession, I meaning Desi). But they wanted a tv version of Ball’s three year old radio show “My Favorite Husband” where her husband was Richard, whom I assume was of German descent since he was born as Denninger. They may have felt why change something that is working. I think around 1950 Latin/South Americans were seen as emotional, romantic,exotic with such glamorous places as Havana, Buenos Aires and Rio de Janeiro. One case of discrimination involves Lucy’s second husband, Gary Morton. The two owned a house at an exclusive private community but he couldn’t play golf there because he was Jewish. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2013, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/83 "2013-10-20T20:46:55Z")
> [@seal\_cleaner](#): > > Vivian Vance and her husband had dinner at my house when I was a kid. Lotsa diamonds and a mink coat. Very glamorous. I’ve seen pictures of Vance when she was younger - very glamorous indeed ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2013, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/84 "2013-10-20T22:30:07Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Apparently his saying, “Hey, Boy!” Nope. I am literally watching the episode now. Ricky says “Hey porter” and “thank you, porter.” You may have misheard him due to his accent, as there is some elision there, but it’s pretty clearly “porter.” Here’s the scene: > [@I Love Lucy](#): > > _Porter takes Ricky and Lucy’s bags to their compartment just as Ricky is stepping outside of it._ > > RICKY: Hello porter. How soon do we leave? > > PORTER: Right away, sir. You can set your watch by the Dome Liner. > > RICKY: Oh! Well that’s right. Those go right in there. (_Referring to the bags_) > > _Porter steps inside to bring in the bags. Meanwhile, Lucy exits the compartment from the inside._ > > LUCY: Oh well isn’t this cute? Ricky! > > RICKY: Yeah? > > LUCY: There’s a little door connecting the two rooms just like a little apartment! > > RICKY: They think of everything. > > _Porter steps out of the room, tips his hat at the two of them as he passes by._ > > PORTER: Pardon me. > > LUCY: Oh certainly. > > RICKY: Thank you, porter. (_Hands porter a dollar_) > > PORTER: Thank you, sir! > > _Exit porter._ > > Later, his only other appearance is when Ricky has just dashed off the train to get Lucy’s bag, with the tickets in it. > > _Porter passes Ricky, no exchange of words. Lucy is hurrying through the berth car when the Porter announces “All visitors off, please!”_ > > LUCY: What do you mean, why do you say that? > > PORTER: Well, the train’s about to leave, ma’am. > > LUCY: But it can’t leave, it can’t leave! Tell them to stop the train, porter! Tell them to hold the train! > > PORTER: I’m sorry, ma’am. You’ll have to speak to the conductor. > > _And thus exits the porter from the show, never having been called anything but “porter.”_ Definitely no “boy.” 🙂 Although interestingly, Ricky _does_ have a habit of calling other men “boy,” particularly Fred and his band members. I think it’s a remnant of his band/jazz/club background. This service brought to you for the Society of Preserving the Dignity of _I Love Lucy_, its writers and producers. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2013, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/85 "2013-10-21T06:47:37Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > In some episode of I Love Lucy, Arnez calls a 40 year old Black Conductor “Boy”. :rolleyes: In some of the episodes, Lucy and Ethel call Fred and Ricky ‘the boys.’ Employers often call employees of their same race ‘my boys’. My friend, who is Celtic said to me (Celt) and friend (Japanese) " Let’s go, boys". ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2013, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/86 "2013-10-21T06:48:47Z")
**seal\_cleaner** “Vivian Vance and her husband had dinner at my house when I was a kid. Lotsa diamonds and a mink coat. Very glamorous.” I am very, very impressed. ---
**Author:** ![brotherfelder\_aol.com](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8edcca/32.png) [@brotherfelder\_aol.com](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brotherfelder_aol.com)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/87 "2017-04-23T12:27:52Z")
I wasn’t around in the 50s but I know there was definitely a 'West Side Story" attitude in parts of the US regaurding Latin and Anglo couples. My friend, an Italian woman married a light skinned Spanish guy in Buffalo and they had all kinds of harassment back in the day. She said no one minded Desi Arnaz because he had money. ---
**Author:** ![GrumpyBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc8723/32.png) [@GrumpyBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrumpyBunny)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/88 "2017-04-23T13:43:09Z")
Arnez _ **looked** _ white. Maybe it’s the one-drop rule in reverse, and besides, it was Hollywood. What’s more, people are not consistent or logical in racism. Many Cubans have more obvious European ancestry than not. A Cuban friend of mine has black hair, blue eyes, and Type 1 never-tanning skin paler than mine (I’m of British and German ancestry). Until he opens his mouth or someone learns his surname, the shortcut assumption is that he’s white. Proving “race” is a stupid construct, or something. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/89 "2017-04-23T15:03:52Z")
> [@Hockey\_Monkey](#): > > [The famous catchphrase that Ricky never said](http://http://www.quotecounterquote.com/2011/05/lucy-you-got-some-splainin-to-do.html) > > 😛 But, but… I \*heard \*Ricky say it! It was the episode when Cary Grant guest-starred, and was heard saying, “Judy, Judy, Judy…” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/90 "2017-04-23T15:48:35Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > And their last name was Ricardo. Yes, basically “Richards”. Still hispanic, but closer to an english name than, say, Ramirez or Gonzales. ---
**Author:** ![syncrolecyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@syncrolecyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/syncrolecyne)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2017, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/91 "2017-04-25T05:39:46Z")
As said, “Hispanic” was not a common general category in the 1950s. It would be interesting to see if Arnaz ever toured as a musician or visited a place where Mexican Americans faced overt discrimination at the time, or if newspapers in those areas ever commented on it. I think the interesting thing about Arnaz on that show is the fact that, even though he was a white/light skinned Cuban with a white American wife, he played decidedly Afro-Cuban music. I think his music might have caused more of a stir than his origins. Elvis and other white rock stars initially faced hostility for playing black music, Arnaz was bringing very African music into living rooms in 1953… ---
**Author:** ![syncrolecyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@syncrolecyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/syncrolecyne)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2017, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/92 "2017-04-25T05:41:22Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Yes, basically “Richards”. Still hispanic, but closer to an english name than, say, Ramirez or Gonzales. Indeed, there was a famous English economist - of Sephardic origin - named David Ricardo. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2017, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/93 "2017-04-25T09:44:49Z")
> [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > But, but… I \*heard \*Ricky say it! It was the episode when Cary Grant guest-starred, and was heard saying, “Judy, Judy, Judy…” 😉 I thought it was the one in which James Cagney said, “You dirty rat!” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2017, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343/94 "2017-04-25T12:39:38Z")
> [@shilohbleu712](#): > > You say that like there is no such thing as Black Cubans. What difference would it have made if he were Cuban? He still was Black. Cubans come in both Black and White and mixtures of the 2. You say that like racism and segregation was always logical and rational. The fact is that there are cases of black players breaking the color line pre-Robinson by saying they were Latino. > **[Latino Players Blurred MLB's Color Line Before Robinson's Debut](https://www.wbur.org/onlyagame/2015/07/11/latino-baseball-history)** > > Our colleagues at NPR's program Latino USA have produced an episode devoted to Latin America's influence on the game of baseball. We present their story of how Latin American players blurred baseball's color line before Jackie Robinson ended... > [@](#): > > “They were presented to the public as, ‘He’s not black; he’s Cuban.’ ‘He’s not black; he’s Puerto Rican,’” Burgos said. “Latinos who made it into the major leagues are not welcomed as fellow whites. They are welcomed as not black.” > > Early on, both players and managers recognized how flexible the color line was when it came to Latinos, and they tried their best to take advantage of it. Take the New York Cuban Giants, a team made up entirely of African-Americans who, legend has it, would speak gibberish to each other on the field in the hopes of convincing crowds that they weren’t black but rather Cuban. > > Then there’s the story of the manager who plotted to send black players down to Cuba, have them learn Spanish and bring them back to try pass them off as authentically Latino. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-there-a-lot-of-racism-directed-towards-desi-arnaz/655343.md?page=4)