# Was Yoda Cheapened by the Light Saber Fight In Star Wars II? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 29, 2003, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166 "2003-10-29T03:45:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![vibrotronica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@vibrotronica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vibrotronica)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/61 "2003-10-30T20:10:10Z")
I don’t think the saber duel cheapened or was inconsistent with his character, but I do think his performance as a field commander was not very impressive. “Around the survivors, a perimeter form!” ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/62 "2003-10-30T23:52:27Z")
Of course, Yoda exists to be parodied, including one amusing passage from _Futurama_: Nibblonian 1: “Does he not know?” Nibblonian 2: “He does not know.” N3: “He knows not?” N2: “Knows not, does he.” N4: “Not, he knows-” N1: “Enough!” ---
**Author:** ![Moo\_the\_Magic\_Cow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ebca7d/32.png) [@Moo\_the\_Magic\_Cow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moo_the_Magic_Cow)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/63 "2003-10-31T00:32:44Z")
Yep. Also, not ALL of his sentences were inverted in the originals. He had so much dialogue in the prequels that it just got ridiculous. He never said “Another Skywalker, there is.” ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/64 "2003-10-31T00:40:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BMalion \* > **By the way, I find the first three movies far superior but, having said that, I still think that Darth Maul kicks butt.** Why? I’ve heard this POV expressed before and it completely loses me. A) He’s got really dumb make-up. “Gene Simmons called and said he wants his look back” level bad. B) He doesn’t say anything. He makes noises like he’s got indigestion. C) He doesn’t _do_ anything. Oh, he kills a Jedi, only to be sliced up by another. Not a good track record. D) His “Slice his own legs off if he parries wrong” weapon just didn’t work for me. Other than snuffing one of the few people who could act in Episode 1, what did he do to win you over? Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/65 "2003-10-31T02:16:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by C K Dexter Haven \* > \*\*Yoda, the one who said “War does not make one great”, now turns out to be a Great Warrior. Remember how Luke thought he was going to find a Great Warrior when he went looking for Yoda, and he was wrong? > > It undoes everything that the real STAR WARS movies established. \*\* You’re totally misunderstanding him, Dex. Even tho’ Yoda is a top-notch warrior, he realizes that there’s nothing “great” about causing death and destruction. The fact that he could chop an attacker to bits with ease isn’t something that he takes any pride in. Also, he never says that he _isn’t_ a mighty warrior 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/66 "2003-10-31T05:55:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\*Why? I’ve heard this POV expressed before and it completely loses me. > > A) He’s got really dumb make-up. “Gene Simmons called and said he wants his look back” level bad. > > B) He doesn’t say anything. He makes noises like he’s got indigestion. > > C) He doesn’t _do_ anything. Oh, he kills a Jedi, only to be sliced up by another. Not a good track record. > > D) His “Slice his own legs off if he parries wrong” weapon just didn’t work for me. > > Other than snuffing one of the few people who could act in Episode 1, what did he do to win you over? > > Fenris \*\* His make-up was supposed to be tattoos, rather than just weird alien coloring. I didn’t like the lightstaff either… two slightly shorter than normal lightsabers would have been much more interesting. Tricky to figure out a fighting style with two weapons of equal length, but it can be done. ---
**Author:** ![Yumblie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/76d3ee/32.png) [@Yumblie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yumblie)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/67 "2003-10-31T06:21:48Z")
Jedis most likely don’t toss each other around during duels because it takes a lot of concentrating to do that, and during duels both jedi are under intense concentration, so they could easily counter the force that would push them away. But shoving an injured person, or catching someone off guard, or of course an inanimate object, is no trouble. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/68 "2003-10-31T12:37:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\*Other than snuffing one of the few people who could act in Episode 1, what did he do to win you over? > \*\* Gave me one of my favorite Halloween [costumes.](http://www.boston-baden.com/hazel/Pix/p.cgi?1999+0144-1+l26p051.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/69 "2003-10-31T12:55:43Z")
> [@](#): > > I don’t think the saber duel cheapened or was inconsistent with his character, but I do think his performance as a field commander was not very impressive. “Around the survivors, a perimeter form!” WHy would he? he’s no military commander. He’s never been a general, and the Clone army wasn’t made with one. He was in command because its all he could do. And his ideas worked pretty well, too. ---
**Author:** ![Mycroft\_Holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a5b964/32.png) [@Mycroft\_Holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mycroft_Holmes)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/70 "2003-10-31T14:23:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tars Tarkas \* > \*\*the fight was awesome, Yoda was cheapened not, as mentioned above, any Kung Fu fan knows the master always fights like a God while acting like a weak old man. It also had the loudest cheers in a theater i have ever heard when he whipped out his saber. \*\* Yeah, but it would have been so much better if he had first asked Dooku if he remembered Rule One, and then used some _déja-fu_ on him. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/71 "2003-10-31T15:41:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BMalion \* > \*\*Gave me one of my favorite Halloween [costumes.](http://www.boston-baden.com/hazel/Pix/p.cgi?1999+0144-1+l26p051.jpg) \*\* Objection sustained. Who did your make up for you? Its awesome. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/72 "2003-10-31T17:11:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dutchboy208 \* > \*\*Objection sustained. Who did your make up for you? Its awesome. \*\* Thank you. I did it myself using a teeny black and white photo from the cassette tape label as a guide. I forgot to bring my big color photo. The top half is a really cool Darth-Maul skullcap that was sold at some halloween shop. Saves alot of time as you only have to paint your face/neck up to the eyebrow ridges. Stayed up all night scrubbing it off because I forgot to also bring coldcream! ---
**Author:** ![butter\_pie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aca169/32.png) [@butter\_pie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/butter_pie)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/73 "2003-10-31T21:09:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gadfly \* > **Jin, hasn’t yoda always sounded like Gonzo?** Yeah, but having seen Yoda in pictures and such, and then not seeing him actually in the movie until the originals were re-released a few years ago, that’s _not_ what I was expecting him to sound like at all. So for me he was ruined the very first time I heard him talk, it’s all downhill from there. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2003, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/74 "2003-11-01T00:00:15Z")
On the one hand, I liked the fight. On the other hand, though, it might have been even better. Consider this: Dooku flails away furiously, and Yoda never seems to move his sabre… But then, just as Dooku’s blow is about to strike, Yoda’s is there in position to block it. Swing again, blocked. We never even see Yoda move his blade, he’s so quick. Eventually, Dooku gets frustrated, and either flees, or becomes overagressive. Suddenly, where Yoda’s sabre needs to be to block Dooku is also where Dooku’s lungs need to be, to keep him alive. Sabre trumps lungs. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2003, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/75 "2003-11-01T05:25:12Z")
I would have loved to have seen Mace Windu take on Dooku using _vaapad_. THAT would kick serious ass. ---
**Author:** ![INSANE1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f0a364/32.png) [@INSANE1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/INSANE1)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2003, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/76 "2003-11-01T07:30:26Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by C K Dexter Haven_ > Yoda, the one who said, “War does not make one great”, now turns out to be a Great Warrior. Remember how Luke thought he was going to find a Great Warrior when he went looking for Yoda, and he was wrong? I don’t see anything wrong with Yoda’s statement, some might say he even fore sore what was going to happen. Luke didn’t defeat Darth Vader and the Emperor by being a warrior. He managed to defeat the dark side with compassion, a truly noble way and very ‘Jedi’ like if you ask me. Luke could have destroyed Darth in ROTJ but instead shows compassion for his father, a very hard thing to do after all the evil things Darth has done. Luke shows that he is above hate and vengeance or he would have killed Darth. Of course Darth notices this, comes to the realisation of what he has become because of his lack of compassion, and knowing that he is destined to die decides to destroy the Emperor, the very man that corrupted him to save his son, the very man that saved him. Luke managed to Destroy the Emperor and Darth, not by killing them, but by using love and compassion as a weapon. I don’t see any problem with the Yoda/Dooku fight either, in fact watching it made me feel all funny inside, I kind of felt like crying out of joy seeing this scene (don’t laugh I get very emotional with films Yoda didn’t have a choice but to battle Dooku to save Obi Wan and Anakin, so he did what he had to do, and he did it well. Yoda was manipulating his whole body using the force. Unlike the Jedi leap (which is only vertically up) Yoda was leaping from side to side, up and down, twisting his body, its like his whole body was an extension of his light sabre and being controlled by the force. I think that requires more skill than to only manipulate his light sabre with his mind (the light sabre would weigh a lot less) as some people in this thread mentioned he should have done to show his true power. ---
**Author:** ![ProjectOmega](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b487fb/32.png) [@ProjectOmega](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ProjectOmega)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2003, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/77 "2003-11-01T08:13:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CyberPundit \* > \*\*A couple of questions : > When Yoda was trying to save Obi-wan and Anakin couldn’t he just push them away from the falling structure? Why couldn’t Dooku attack Yoda when he was busy trying to save the two? \*\* As others have pointed out, throwing two immobile, injured guys across the room isn’t the best way to keep them alive. Also, Dooku had to get the hell out of there with the good guy clone army almost upon that cavern. If he spent any more time fighting Yoda, he would have been surrounded by soldiers. Also, as far as the actual physics/nuances of the Force goes, you can’t “push” other force users if they’re unwilling. Jedi and such have a certain level of concentration that prevents them from being manipulated and thrown around like rag dolls. Yoda may have known he wouldn’t be able to “push” at least Obi-Wan out of the way. Obi-Wan was probably still too out of it to willingly drop that passive Force defense. How did Dooku knock Anakin back then? He cut off his friggin’ arm first! I’m sure Anakin was either immediately knocked unconscious from the shock or his “Force concentration” was at least interrupted long enough to be susceptible to the attack. A question _I_ have though: Anakin got his arm cut off. They replaced it with a mechanical one. With all the technology they have, including those bacta tank thingies and whatnot, how come they couldn’t have simply reattached his arm? Are you telling me they have sources of unlimited power compact enough to fit into a sword hilt but they can’t sew limbs back on bodies? Luke, sure; his hand fell down that tube and ended up godknowswhere, but Anakin’s arm would have still been lying on the floor in that cavern. The lightsaber’s actually “blade” is supposed to be razor thin, and even though the wound was instantly cauterized, I don’t buy that their medical technology is so far behind a procedure we ourselves on puny Earth are almost capable of. ---
**Author:** ![sturmhauke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e47c2d/32.png) [@sturmhauke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sturmhauke)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2003, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/78 "2003-11-01T09:04:19Z")
[[The Cold War] is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.](http://www.wisdomquotes.com/001489.html) - Eisenhower Part of being a “Great Warrior” is knowing all the horrors that violence can bring. Ike knew this, and Yoda knew this. When violent action had to be taken, they took it, and they didn’t screw around. They did not revel in violence. As for Anakin’s arm, we don’t know how long it took for a rescue party to arrive. The arm’s tissues could have died waiting, especially in the hot desert environment. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2003, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/79 "2003-11-01T23:40:20Z")
I’m guessing it’s just easier to give him a replacement arm. The blade DOES cauterize wounds, and who knows what kind of condition the stump was in. Maybe they weren’t able to save it in time? ---
**Author:** ![Yumblie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/76d3ee/32.png) [@Yumblie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yumblie)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2003, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166/80 "2003-11-02T05:06:51Z")
Well what better time to get a newer, better arm? _We can rebuild him, we have the technology…_ If nothing else, it comes full circle when Luke cuts off Vader’s hand again in RotJ and you see the circuitry on the stub. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/was-yoda-cheapened-by-the-light-saber-fight-in-star-wars-ii/210166.md?page=5)