# Watchmen 2009 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 28, 2017, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232 "2017-03-28T17:41:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2017, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/41 "2017-03-29T21:14:18Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > Totally agree about the unsuitability of Ozy - bad casting and directing there. He was a perfect fit compared to the casting of Laurie. Akerman only measured up in a few scenes and was an overacting princess in the rest. > [@muldoonthief](#): > > That was a reference back to something in the comic (I don’t think it was in the movie) - after Rorschach meets with Ozy the first time to talk about the Comedian’s murder, he writes in his journal: > > “Meeting with Veidt left bad taste in mouth. He is pampered and decadent, betraying even his own shallow, liberal affectations. Possibly homosexual? Must remember to investigate further.” That line was quoted verbatim in the movie. The only reference to Veidt’s possible homosexuality in the film, though, other than the cryptic “boys” folder. I think there are other references in the snips from “Under the Hood” in the book. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2017, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/42 "2017-03-29T21:26:35Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > That line was quoted verbatim in the movie. The only reference to Veidt’s possible homosexuality in the film, though, other than the cryptic “boys” folder. I think there are other references in the snips from “Under the Hood” in the book. Not as far as I can recall. (The book specifies that two of the 1940s-era _Minutemen_ were gay – but not in the “Under The Hood” excerpts.) ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/43 "2017-03-29T21:33:04Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Not as far as I can recall. (The book specifies that two of the 1940s-era _Minutemen_ were gay – but not in the “Under The Hood” excerpts.) I thought there was a snarky comment by Mason about “others” in referring to the original two. Could be wrong, as it’s been a while since I read the book. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2017, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/44 "2017-03-29T22:15:34Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > That is amazing! > > Totally agree about the unsuitability of Ozy - bad casting and directing there. I blame Snyder. Matthew Goode is a fine actor, and perfectly capable of playing a warm, sympathetic character. The fact that he came across as a creep had to have been a conscious directorial decision. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2017, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/45 "2017-03-29T22:43:05Z")
Chiming in as another who loved the movie. The opening credit sequence really is the best part of it, though. > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The point of Moore’s book was that normal well-adjusted people don’t put on masks and go out to fight crime. The people who do that are borderline crazy and the deeper you got into being a superhero, the crazier you got. Moore saw that the mentality of a superhero isn’t all that far from the mentality of a serial killer. That seems quite present in the movie, too. It’s such a _deeply_ embedded theme that I’m not sure how you could tell basically the same story without it being very clear. People who’ve seen multiple versions, I think I’ve seen the theatrical version, but how would I know? Is the extended better enough to watch it instead? I don’t care about the pirate interstitial story. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2017, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/46 "2017-03-29T23:12:01Z")
> [@Trancephalic](#): > > Except making Manhattan the unifying force doesn’t make sense since he is a direct product of the US. The ruskies would never believe they’d turn against their own creation. > > The catalyst needs to be alien to work or else the logic falls apart. They thought he blew up a shit ton of cities all around the world, why wouldn’t they turn against the guy who killed millions? ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/47 "2017-03-30T01:51:42Z")
I just rewatched the film last week when it was airing on IFC, I loved it when I first saw it and had wanted to rewatch it for a while. I’m guessing it was the theatrical version that was on TV, can someone who has seen both that and the director’s cut list what was added? ---
**Author:** ![TYphoonSignal8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@TYphoonSignal8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TYphoonSignal8)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/48 "2017-03-30T02:19:52Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Must he have known though? I’m not sure if he could “see” events that occurred before his creation. Plus, I didn’t get the feeling he omnisciently knew everything - he could “look” at a certain point in space-time, but he didn’t automatically have all knowledge just due to his powers. > > Heck, remember on Mars, he was telling Laurie something like “In eleven minutes, you tell me you’ve been sleeping with Dreiberg.”, then when she actually told him, he acted surprised and hurt: “You’ve been sleeping with Dreiberg?” Yep, precisely. Your second comment underscores my point which you addressed in your first comment. He had a different, full-linear time perspective on time, but just because he could see the river didn’t mean he could swim against the flow. His own actions and responses were predetermined. ---
**Author:** ![Trancephalic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trancephalic/32/380_2.png) [@Trancephalic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trancephalic)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/49 "2017-03-30T05:36:09Z")
Yeah, Dr Manhattan is pretty much Calvinism personified ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/50 "2017-03-30T09:39:40Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > All i know is that Rorshcachs casting was brilliant. > > It’s not like Jackie Earle Haley was on the tip of everyone’s tongue in 2009. He’s really nailed down the whole “scary intense” thing - if you have access to Amazon shows his Odin Quincannon in _Preacher_ is mesmerizing and his brief scene as The Terror in the new _Tick_ series pilot is, well, genuinely terrifying. See it if you can. _ **“YOU’VE GOT NOTHING!”** _ ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/51 "2017-03-30T09:41:17Z")
I’m a huge fan of the original series and of Alan Moore’s work in general (discovered him when he was still writing for 2000AD in the UK). And yep I think both the Watchmen and V for Vendetta are pretty good adaptions overall. Alan Moore is an incredibly talented writer but his attitude towards adaptations of his work is so extreme it’s almost comical. He hates every single adaptation into another format that’s ever been made of his work. > **[Hero Complex](https://www.latimes.com/topic/hero-complex)** > > Science fiction, comic book, fantasy, and video game news. Personally I think a lot of the fan hate for Watchmen was them hating it because Alan Moore told them they should hate it, not their own opinion. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/52 "2017-03-30T14:41:56Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I blame Snyder. Matthew Goode is a fine actor, and perfectly capable of playing a warm, sympathetic character. The fact that he came across as a creep had to have been a conscious directorial decision. I agree. No question in my mind that Snyder had him play it that way deliberately, for reasons that are completely unfathomable to me. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2017, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/53 "2017-03-30T14:48:02Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > I agree. No question in my mind that Snyder had him play it that way deliberately, for reasons that are completely unfathomable to me. Because, like, he’s all up in Egyptian shit and stuff, so let’s have him play the role as if he’s really a cobra! (Thinking mostly of the glassy stare and deceptively soft movements.) ---
**Author:** ![TYphoonSignal8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@TYphoonSignal8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TYphoonSignal8)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2017, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/54 "2017-03-31T09:50:21Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > I’m a huge fan of the original series and of Alan Moore’s work in general (discovered him when he was still writing for 2000AD in the UK). And yep I think both the Watchmen and V for Vendetta are pretty good adaptions overall. > > Alan Moore is an incredibly talented writer but his attitude towards adaptations of his work is so extreme it’s almost comical. He hates every single adaptation into another format that’s ever been made of his work. > [Hero Complex](http://herocomplex.latimes.com/uncategorized/alan-moore-on-w/) > > Personally I think a lot of the fan hate for Watchmen was them hating it because Alan Moore told them they should hate it, not their own opinion. As I understand it, Moore threw a hissy fit because someone at Warner (I don’t think it was Snyder) said Moore had approved the adaption. That was untrue. Moore asked Warner to publicly retract the statement. Warner prevaricated. Moore publicly resolved never to work with DC (a subsidiary of Warner) again. Moore has said in at least one interview (from memory, in the context of the lacklustre “League of Extraordinary Gentlemen” movie) that he doesn’t get upset by crappy adaptions of his work, because he doesn’t consider the adaptions to be his work. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2017, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/55 "2017-03-31T10:26:14Z")
> [@TYphoonSignal8](#): > > As I understand it, Moore threw a hissy fit because someone at Warner (I don’t think it was Snyder) said Moore had approved the adaption. That was untrue. Moore asked Warner to publicly retract the statement. Warner prevaricated. That wasn’t over Watchmen, it was over V for Vendetta. It was Joel Silver, claiming to be quoting one of the Wachowskis, who said it. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2017, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/56 "2017-03-31T13:52:40Z")
> [@TYphoonSignal8](#): > > Moore has said in at least one interview (from memory, in the context of the lacklustre “League of Extraordinary Gentlemen” movie) that he doesn’t get upset by crappy adaptions of his work, because he doesn’t consider the adaptions to be his work. Methinks the laddie doth protest too much. ---
**Author:** ![HelenGawn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@HelenGawn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelenGawn)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2017, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/57 "2017-04-01T03:27:24Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Otherwise I thought it was pretty solid and most of the rest of the performances were spot-on. Particularly Rorschach and the Comedian. I absolutely agree. Jeffrey Dean Morgan was born to play the Comedian. Sadly for him, now he has. Every performance since has been mediocre at best. You can do a lot with that dirty smile as the Comedian, but not with every character ever written. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2017, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232/58 "2017-04-01T14:50:30Z")
> [@HelenGawn](#): > > Sadly for him, now he has. Every performance since has been mediocre at best. You can do a lot with that dirty smile as the Comedian, but not with every character ever written. “I’m sorry, Mr. Morgan. We just feel you’re not quite _right_ to play Willy Wonka.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/watchmen-2009/783232.md?page=2)