# Way to start a holy war, Newsweek **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 15, 2005, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951 "2005-05-15T18:58:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/141 "2005-05-17T14:33:42Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I was unaware a story had to be good for America in order to be newsworthy. It was a very recent directive from the Propaganda Ministry. Did you get the memo? Happy news good. Other news bad. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/142 "2005-05-17T14:56:46Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > It was a very recent directive from the Propaganda Ministry. Did you get the memo? Happy news good. Other news bad. Eh, that’s impossible. You’re forgetting about the left-wing bias. It’s the left-wing bias that made Kerry a FLIPFLOPPERFUCKINGFRENCHLOOKINGFLIPFLOPPER and yet, for some reason, McClellan contradicting himself on record is totally unremarked. You know, the guy that’s the official spokesperson of the White House. -Joe, wonders when Left and Right swapped ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/143 "2005-05-17T15:01:55Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > You’d almost have a point if talking about a specific subset of radicals was the same as generalizing about all Christians. “Fundies” != all (or even most) Christians. And not all fundimental christians act similarly. Some don’t believe in violence at all. Some don’t believe in forcing their religion upon you. > [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Notice how I was NOT generalizing? > [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Nobody has a bigger martyr complex than American Christian fundies. > [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I’m saying it’s an indication that Christian fundies would be no less prone to riot if the situations were reversed. Suuuuuuuure, no generalizations there. ---
**Author:** ![Flyhalf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ea5d25/32.png) [@Flyhalf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyhalf)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/144 "2005-05-17T15:28:19Z")
> [@BabaBooey](#): > > I felt that it was clear in context that I feel said logic is incorrect. That’s bullshit and you know it. :wally ---
**Author:** ![Tracy\_Lord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@Tracy\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracy_Lord)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/145 "2005-05-17T15:49:06Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > It was a very recent directive from the Propaganda Ministry. Did you get the memo? Happy news good. Other news bad. I believe you mean MiniTrue. Anybody check out the headline on the NY Post today? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/146 "2005-05-17T17:53:42Z")
Take off for a day and miss 3 pages. > [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > > [@furt](#): > > > > I’d even bet that if there wouldn’t be rioting even if, say, there was confirmed national media coverage of an activist group storming into a Catholic cathedral during services and desecrating the communion host. > > I beg to differ. Look what happens when you do something as simple as taking a concrete slab out a courthouse. ACT-UP got national headlines at St. Patrick’s Cathedral in 1989, disrupting an advent service; parishoners said some of the protestors threw the host on the ground and stomped on it. I don’t recall any riots. Andres Serrano got lost of ink over dropping a crucifix and rosary beads in urine; again, no riots. I could go on, but there’s no point. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/147 "2005-05-17T18:11:59Z")
Young unemployed males riot. Angry middle aged males with something to lose call talk radio. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/148 "2005-05-17T19:39:06Z")
> [@Barbarian](#): > > Lemme get this straight. > 1-Newsweek fucks up on a story by relying on a single anonymous government official. > 2-A bunch of idiots\* riot in several countries, leading to a few dozen deaths. > 3-Newsweek retracts article, hopefully realizing that just because relying on anonymous gov’t officials for stories is status quo, it is incredibly stupid. Actually, #3 looks more like “Newsweek is left holding the bad when their source says, ‘Hey, I think I referenced the wrong government document about the Koran-flushing incident.’” Also of note is that the chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff [does not believe the rioting is related to the article:](http://usinfo.state.gov/usinfo/Archive/2005/May/12-273892.html?chanlid=washfile) > [@](#): > > According to initial reports, the situation in Jalalabad began on May 10 with peaceful student protests reacting to a report in _Newsweek_ magazine that U.S. military interrogators questioning Muslim detainees at the Guantanamo detention center “had placed Quran s on toilets, and in at least one case flushed a holy book.” By the following day the protests in the city had turned violent with reports of several individuals killed, dozens wounded, and widespread looting of government, diplomatic and nongovernmental assets. > > However, Myers said an after-action report provided by U.S. Army Lieutenant General Karl Eikenberry, commander of the Combined Forces in Afghanistan, indicated that **the political violence was not, in fact, connected to the magazine report.** ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/149 "2005-05-17T19:43:00Z")
Thanks **rjung**! I suspected that this could be the case. God knows they have plenty of things to riot about. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/150 "2005-05-17T20:08:29Z")
It’s tempting to say a newspaper or magazine needs to have multiple sources for everything they print, even if the one source is considered reliable. But I wonder how many important stories would not have been printed under that standard. Require too much confirmation, the public’s right to know suffers. Require too little, and we have more messes like this one. Likely no matter where the line is drawn, there’s going to be problems. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/151 "2005-05-17T20:40:27Z")
The whole “Koran flushed down the toilet” claim [was made several times](http://corrente.blogspot.com/2005/05/flushing-newsweek.html) in the media before Newsweek, going back to March 2003. Newsweek’s was the first attributed to an Administration official, rather than to a detainee. Who knew that that distinction would make all the difference to a bunch of people on the other side of the world? :rolleyes: As for me, I’m thinking that Pentagon spokesman Lawrence DiRita’s wonderful quote - “People are dead because of what this son of a bitch said. How could he be credible now?” would look great on a protest poster in front of the White House. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/152 "2005-05-17T20:52:01Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > It’s tempting to say a newspaper or magazine needs to have multiple sources for everything they print, even if the one source is considered reliable. But I wonder how many important stories would not have been printed under that standard. Again, stories of this sort have been trickling out for over a year. It’s absurd to suggest that they shouldn’t be printed until the fucking pentagon, AKA the alleged perpetrator, acknowledges the reality of the charges. Molly Ivins offers a nice history of Koran abuse claims in today’s column: [Despite sloppiness, Newsweek didn’t fabricate Koran story](http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=19061) ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/153 "2005-05-17T21:29:16Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > It’s absurd to suggest that they shouldn’t be printed until the fucking pentagon, AKA the alleged perpetrator, acknowledges the reality of the charges. You didn’t get that suggestion from my post that you quoted, did you? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/154 "2005-05-17T22:08:07Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > You didn’t get that suggestion from my post that you quoted, did you? No. However, there are some, perhaps even in the white house, who are willing to extend that line of argument to ridiculous extremes. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/155 "2005-05-17T22:43:54Z")
True. And this is their golden opportunity. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/156 "2005-05-17T23:04:02Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > This story is really just two far right movements firing up their outrage-craving footsoldiers over the same incident. > > “They desecrated the Koran. We must riot!” > > “The liberal media is attacking Bush! We must drool over our keyboards in outrage (and try to shift some blame for this shitstorm away from our beloved leader)!” Yeah. And both are good for the Administration (especially now that Newsweek has buckled). The conspiracy theorist in me is waking up… ---
**Author:** ![cppguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@cppguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cppguy)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/157 "2005-05-17T23:51:31Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Molly Ivins offers a nice history of Koran abuse claims in today’s column: [Despite sloppiness, Newsweek didn’t fabricate Koran story](http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=19061) And she lies as usual (this time in the title–even Newsweek admits they can’t substantiate their story). Her implication is that people have been accusing the US of abusing the Koran for a long time, so this MUST be true! I hope she’s never served on a jury. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2005, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/158 "2005-05-18T00:02:36Z")
Now you just hold on there, podnuh! You’re talking about Molly now, the correct tone is hushed reverence. But more to the point, there is a considerable area of real estate between failing to substantiate a story and fabricating the story out of whole cloth. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2005, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/159 "2005-05-18T00:21:22Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Molly Ivins offers a nice history of Koran abuse claims in today’s column: [Despite sloppiness, Newsweek didn’t fabricate Koran story](http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=19061) I skipped the Ivins article. Where’s the sloppiness though? They reported what one source said. They checked the interview against 2 other sources. When the first source retracted, they reported that. Seems to me that Newsweek did a fine job. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2005, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951/160 "2005-05-18T00:25:42Z")
Those who can’t distinguish between “fabrication” and “failed to get triple-verification” should not be trusted when they accuse others of lying. For shame. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/way-to-start-a-holy-war-newsweek/303951.md?page=9)