# We don't need to 'understand the issues that led' to Tuesday's atrocities
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [September 17, 2001, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167 "2001-09-17T15:20:22Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 8
### Author:  [@Blackclaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackclaw)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/141 "2001-09-18T12:34:01Z")
Tejota,
Lemur866 was clearly directing his thoughts towards terrorists, not Arabs.
I agree with you that terrorists are an abberation but the cause of that abberation seems fairly clear. It is tied in with a political power struggle, the existence of Israel, and their desire to overthrow secular Arab states. So I’m obviously not understanding your point.
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### Author:  [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/142 "2001-09-18T12:46:56Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Fenris \*
> \*\*#1) I’m fine “understanding” as meaning: intelligence gathering. Learn everything about the fuckers who did this and the uber-fuckers who funded them. Then kill them all.
>
> #2) I’m not fine with “understanding” as empathizing, putting myself in their shoes, trying to “understand what drove them to this”, “finding a solution so this doesn’t happpen again”.\*\*
I think that pretty much sums it up for me.
I am of the opinion that our government has a pretty good idea about _why_ these fucks did what they did and how they percieve us and our actions.
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### Author:  [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/143 "2001-09-18T13:28:10Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Fenris \*
> I’d like to know how much reason, reflection, memory, consideration, and doubt you’ve put into trying to understand Fred Phelps and his evil “God Hates Fags” organization? How much into trying to understand the radical Militia (like McVeigh) types? How much into neo-Nazis? How 'bout abortion clinic bombers? The KKK?
A great deal, if you must know.
> [@](#):
>
> How many peace marches have you gone to supporting a measured response to Fred Phelps’s “antics”, abortion clinic bombings or KKK lynchings?
None, because as far as I know, nobody’s ever mentioned storming Topeka with bombs or ground troops or harassed innocent Kansans due to Phelps’ antics. Nor does Phelps’ yelling and flag-burning - nor even do antichoice bombings and racist lynchings - have worldwide, complex geopolitical implications involving the military might of the most powerful state in the world and several others to boot. That’s a silly argument, and I think you’re aware of it.
Look, we may be misunderstanding the word “motivations” here. I’m using it at the political level: looking at diplomatic considerations, attitudes towards Americans in different regions among different groups, in general just understanding the complex currents of culture and prejudice at play here, just so we know how deep and how strong the river is before we dive in.
I don’t think anyone at all has suggested putting bin Laden on a couch and going “tell me about your mother.” I suppose that makes it my turn to get huffy about strange imputations of irrelevant arguments.
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### Author:  [@CrankyAsAnOldMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrankyAsAnOldMan)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/144 "2001-09-18T13:38:32Z")
Ah, I got it, Blackclaw. Thanks for the clarification. 🙂
“well-respected poster” may be going by the wayside. I’ve never had people disagree with me so strongly. Then again, I usually post about things like cat food brands, so therein lies the difference.
I wish I’d said it like someone else did, so late in the discussion:
“What is it that makes young people in the middle east think Bin Laden isn’t some psychopath that they wouldn’t touch with a ten-foot pole?” I’m curious. I think we’d be better off knowing. Even if it doesn’t, alas, change the way the U.S. comports itself in the world. I’d like to think we’d change at least somewhat, but some of you find that so abhorrent that I’ll stop talking about it.
I’m also a glimmery-eyed optimist, one of the other faults I bring to this discussion. I don’t believe, in the end, that hatred of the United States is inevitable. I just don’t think hatred is a given. It may be for the next fifty years, but I can envision a future where we’re not hated. I’d like us to work for it. If that makes me laughably naive, well, there are worse things for me to be. I’m not changing my username to Pollyanna, though. Not even for you, Milo.
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### Author:  [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/145 "2001-09-18T13:59:12Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by CrankyAsAnOldMan \*
> \*\*Ah, I got it, Blackclaw. Thanks for the clarification. 🙂
>
> “well-respected poster” may be going by the wayside. I’ve never had people disagree with me so strongly. Then again, I usually post about things like cat food brands, so therein lies the difference.\*\*
What the _hell_ are you dissing Iams for! Whiskas and Purina SUCK!!! EVERYONE SUCKS!!! I HATE YOU FOR YOUR EVIL GAWDDAMNED CATFOOD STANCE!!!
😉 😃
Fenris, a “Hill’s Science Diet” or “Iams” guy
---
### Author:  [@CrankyAsAnOldMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrankyAsAnOldMan)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/146 "2001-09-18T14:03:16Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Fenris \*
> \*\*
>
> Fenris, a “Hill’s Science Diet” or “Iams” guy \*\*
So you’re a pussy, an idiot, _and_ a bigot. What’s wrong with the Nutro brand, asshole?
[sub]sorry for the hijack all. Lightheartedness was just so welcome for a change[/sub] 😃
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### Author:  [@Blackclaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackclaw)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/147 "2001-09-18T14:08:04Z")
But I… I feed my pets both Iams and Science Diet!!!
(Runs off weeping.)
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### Author:  [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/148 "2001-09-18T14:26:48Z")
> [@](#):
>
> _Originally posted by CrankyAsAnOldMan \*
> \*\*
> So you’re a pussy, an idiot, and a bigot. What’s wrong with the Nutro brand, asshole?_\*
My…my local petshop doesn’t carry it!
:: cries ::
\*\*
> [@](#):
>
> [sub]sorry for the hijack all. Lightheartedness was just so welcome for a change[/sub] 😃 \*\*
Lord, yes!
🙂
Fenris
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### Author:  [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/149 "2001-09-18T14:28:09Z")
Geeze, **Cranky**!
You made two people cry with that comment!
You’re mean! :eek:
Fenris
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### Author:  [@Orbifold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orbifold)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/150 "2001-09-18T15:22:16Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Fenris \*
> \*\*I don’t need to wallow in pigshit to realize that pigs stink and I don’t need to delve into Bin Laden’s troubled psyche (beyond what’s needed for intelligence-gathering) to see the need to destroy him and his organization.
> \*\*
The problem is, there are other terrorists in the world besides Bin Laden and the members of his organization. _They_ are the reasons we need to understand the motivation behind last Tuesday’s attack. Because no matter what action is taken against Osama Bin Laden, we need to know: what effect will that action have on other terrorist organizations? Will it deter them? Or will they view Bin Laden as a martyr and try to perform other, equally villianous acts in a twisted quest for glory?
This isn’t questioning who’s at fault for Tuesday’s deaths, and it isn’t an attempt to empathize with sociopaths. It’s an attempt to figure out where the next punch is coming from. Because like it or not whatever we do in Afghanistan will have an effect on future terrorist behaviour, and _we need to know what that effect will be_, as much as possible.
**matt\_mcl** has it exactly right: the actions that we take now will have repercussions around the world for years. To not try and predict those repercussions as best we can would be foolish. And figuring out why terrorists act as they do is one of the tools at our disposal.
This is not the only battle to be fought. We have to think of the future as well.
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### Author:  [@magdalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magdalene)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/151 "2001-09-18T15:27:14Z")
I feel I need to understand my cat’s innermost motivations before choosing a cat food. In the meantime, the high protein content and wide availability of Iams will have to do.
😛
I just want to say I respect all the posters in this discussion SO MUCH. Here is a very interesting opinion piece from the [NY Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/18/opinion/18FRIE.html?ex=1001820448&ei=1&en=d385f1bd30da798a) (you have to register to read it, unfortunately, so I’ll quote some of it as well).
> [@](#):
>
> The Big Terrible
>
> \>By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN
>
> AMMAN, Jordan
>
> By quirk of fate I have been in Jordan for much of the World Trade Center crisis. Sitting here, I’ve been struck by the number of e-mails that have reached me from friends around the Arab-Muslim world - from Kuwait and Cairo, from Lebanon and Turkey - all just wanting to say how upset they were with what happened and checking if the family was O.K. In their own way, they each echoed what a secretary in Jordan tried to say to me in the most eloquent broken
> English - that this terrorist attack was “the big terrible.”
>
> I relate this not to suggest that my friends around the Middle East reflect all public opinion out here. They do not. One need only visit some of the most popular Arabic Web sites and chat rooms to see that public opinion in the Arab world is split about 50-50 - **\**
>
> No, I relate this simply to say that America still has many
> admirers in this part of the world. For all that Middle Easterners get enraged with America, many others value it, envy it and want their kids there. They envy the sense of ownership that Americans have over their own government, they envy its naïve optimism, its celebration of individual freedom and its abiding faith that the past won’t always bury the future. For a brief, terrifying moment last week people out here got a glimpse of what the world could be
> like without America, and many did not like it. America is not something external to them; people carry around pieces of it in ways often not articulated.
>
> Why does all this matter? Because we need the help of the moderate Arab states to fight this war. And for now, most of these Arab leaders are ready to cooperate with us - because enough of their publics are tilted our way. But the moderate Arab leaders are praying that the U.S. will proceed carefully and surgically, because they know that public opinion here, even after all the American deaths, is by no means solidly pro-American.
>
> On Sunday I interviewed Jordan’s King Abdullah, one of America’s real friends. He had three wise messages: We can win if you Americans don’t forget who you are, if you don’t forget who your friends are and if we work together. “The terrorists are trying to break down the fabric of the U.S.,” said the Jordanian monarch. "They want to break down what America stands for. The terrorists actually want to provoke attacks on Arabs or Muslims in the U.S., because if the American communities start going after each other,
> if we see America fragment, then you destroy that special thing that America stands for. That’s what the terrorists want - they want to be able to turn to your friends here and say, `Look, this is all a myth.’
>
> “That is why you have to be very careful when you respond - make sure you respond in a way that punishes the real perpetrators, that brings justice, not revenge, because otherwise you will be going against your own ideals, and that is what the terrorists want most.”
>
> **\**
I realize that I probably presented my opinions badly yesterday. I hate that people read sympathy for terrorists into my posts.
I just want to say: We can go forward with our justice and retaliation in a way that completely alienates the Arab world or we can also do it in a way that includes the Arab world and makes it easier for our allies to support us, as Friedman suggests. I grok JODI’S arguments of yesterday, that understanding the motives of terrorists does not change anything about what they did or the need for justice. I still argue that information and understanding helps us defeat them, in the short-term war of violence and security and in the long term war of public opinion, diplomacy, and world politics. I recognize that many people don’t care about that right now, but **I do**.
My plea for “understanding” is twofold. Firstly, **I** need to try to understand the what, the who, the when, the how, the why - for myself, as part of my own healing process. I need to understand what these people want and how they came to want it and what their justifications are. I need to look through history and see where this thinking came from, what made these people join a terrorist movements, what propaganda they grew up with, what propaganda they are spreading to the rest of the world, why 50% of the Muslim world would applaud their actions.
Needing this or wanting this does not make me a “philosopher” or a tepid America-basher or “unconcerned with national security” or any less of a patriot than anyone else.
Secondly, I am in no way arguing that we should “cave in” to terrorists on matters of Israel, women’s rights, national security, or any other demand they make. However I have been a long-term advocate of greater, yes, understanding between the U.S. and the Muslim world as a whole. I think many of actions on both sides in this century have been based on ignorance about religious and political realities. Bin Laden speaks for Islam the way Pat Robertson speaks for Christianity. Moderate Christians and non-Christians laugh at the idea of Pat Robertson speaking for anyone, yet he continues to be a major financial and ideological force in U.S. politics with many supporters. If we don’t understand how he gains his legitimacy among these people, we can bomb him all we want - other people will rise and take his place. That doesn’t mean we don’t bomb the holy living fuck out of him and his crew, but we need the larger understanding so we can be watchful when the next crew appears, so we can help our Arab allies defeat the threat from within their own countries, and so we can conduct diplomacy better in the future.
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### Author:  [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/152 "2001-09-18T15:45:05Z")
My cat’s breath smells like cat food.
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### Author:  [@magdalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magdalene)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/153 "2001-09-18T15:51:52Z")
I just realized that my post could be construed as wanting to bomb Pat Robertson - The rest of my Evil Feminist Agnostic Operatives and I plan to hold off on that one for right now.
Oh, and does anyone else spoil their cats with a small amount of wet food in the morning?
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### Author:  [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/154 "2001-09-18T16:02:59Z")
MATT –
> [@](#):
>
> It’s just that when you’re dealing with something of this unprecedented scale, any amount of willful ignorance strikes me as irresponsible.
I am not advocating willful ignorance, and you are a **LIAR** to say that I am. If you expect me to believe you have any principles at all, then I suggest you refrain from gross dishonesty.
> [@](#):
>
> Get over yourself. Not everything I attribute to “some people” or to “other people on this board” or what have you is in reference to you. I am making arguments; the fact that they are in response to your statements doesn’t mean that they’re against your statements.
I find your posts and your posting style offensive in the extreme, for reasons better set forth by FENRIS. Now you admit you make the comments in response to me, but you expect me to somehow divine they are not _to_ me or _about_ me because they are attributed to “some people.” If that is the level of careful hair-splitting you engage in, I respond that some people can go fuck themselves.
BLACLCLAW, CRANKY is not the one unable or unwilling to see my point. She understands it, as does TAMERLANE, who said:
> [@](#):
>
> Jodi: Well speaking only for myself, the “why?” of “why discuss motivation” is not of any use short-term. You’re quite right. In the short term it gives us little advantage, with the possible exception of strategic arguments to help leverage countries like Pakistan. I am interested in the long-term question. And I don’t see where examining the long-term is an impediment to accomplishing short-term goals. One can do both, IMHO.
Sure. It’s just the timing I object to, as I have said. To attempt to delve into the motivations of the terrorists _right now_ detracts from the task at hand; can add nothing of any practical worth to what must be done next; and runs the risk of being a justification for this monstrosity. To me, it’s like attempting to figure out what the vicitm could have done to invite attack, in the immediate wake of that attack. People who do so should not be surprised others take them indignantly to task for appearing to imply the victim “deserved” it. If that is not what the speaker intends, and if there is no pressing need for the discussion _immediately_, then it seems to me the better part of senstivity and valor to postpone it, until the necessary immediate work has been done and until tempers and emotions have cooled. I trust you see this. I’m at a loss to imagine why so many others do not. Truly, I don’t mind that people disagree with me; I’d just like a little acknowledgement that the issue _does_ have two sides and that just because I’m on the other one doesn’t mean I’m “willfully ignorant” or “jingoistic” or anything other than in actual – and valid – disagreement.
MATHGEEK –
> [@](#):
>
> The problem is, there are other terrorists in the world besides Bin Laden and the members of his organization. They are the reasons we need to understand the motivation behind last Tuesday’s attack.
I’m going to tease this out, because I don’t think your assumption follows.
> [@](#):
>
> Because no matter what action is taken against Osama Bin Laden, we need to know: what effect will that action have on other terrorist organizations?
How does understanding the motivations of these particular terrorists – the specifics of what their gripe is with the United States – illuminate in any way the “effect” of the action upon other terrorists?
> [@](#):
>
> Will it deter them? Or will they view Bin Laden as a martyr and try to perform other, equally villianous acts in a twisted quest for glory?
What does the “why” have to do with this? Would they not be more concerned with understanding the mechanics of the operation, in light of its spectacular success, and how they could duplicate it? How does knowing that the specific reason these planes blew up was because bin Laden believes American troops in Saudi Arabia “defiled” it (despite being there by invitation), in any way clue us in as to the potential future actions of, say, the IRA?
> [@](#):
>
> Because like it or not whatever we do in Afghanistan will have an effect on future terrorist behaviour, and we need to know what that effect will be, as much as possible.
I agree with this completely. Of course, it has nothing to do with the motivations of the terrorists.
> [@](#):
>
> The actions that we take now will have repercussions around the world for years. To not try and predict those repercussions as best we can would be foolish. And figuring out why terrorists act as they do is one of the tools at our disposal.
Except this is not the subject under discussion. No one is saying that we should not take a hard look at the _future_ results of _our_ own actions – not our motivations, but our actions. We are saying that _at this point in time_ the specifics of _why_ the terrorists did this are largely irrelevant. It doesn’t change that the attack took place. It does not justify or mitigate the attack. It doesn’t change our likely response to the attack. That is why at _this_ point, explanations of motivations are largely irrelevant.
And as I have also said repeatedly, I don’t care if people wish to delve into the workings of these terrorists’ minds and try to understand why they did it. There are always people who believe that we have an obligation to try to “understand” criminals, and who refuse to see that “understanding” them, while having long-term value, doesn’t mean anything in the context of determining who committed the crime and how he or she should be punished. I simply refuse to be told that _I_ must care about such things right now, when there is IMO more important work to be done and more constructive things to devote my energy to.
MAGDALENE, I am glad you “grok” my argument, and I appreciate your plea for tolerance and greater understanding between people. I hope you understand that nothing I have posted is in anyway inconsistent with that goal.
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### Author:  [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/155 "2001-09-18T16:06:49Z")
Holy kitty uppers, this thread has been an intersting read. As someone else pointed out, I think we all really are pretty close on this issue. Many of our differences may lie with our interpretations of “understanding” and whether or not we associate empathy, guilt, forgiveness, acquiesence, etc. in any degree with that word.
By understanding the terrorists motivations, I:
- will never forgive them for what they did or reason with their explanation,
- will try and take action that would circumvent any other “impressionables” from embracing the same tenets and hatred toward us.
I heard on the radio on the way in this morning about the declared jihad and listened to the insistance from a young Afghan that this was because America has been looking for an excuse to attack Muslims around the world. I understand that he doesn’t know why we fought and died in Yugoslavia. I understand that he doesn’t know that 5,000,000 Muslims live and worship in the US in peace, protected by our laws, with the same rights as a Buddhist or Christian.
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### Author:  [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/156 "2001-09-18T16:31:20Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Jodi \*
>
> > [@](#):
> >
> > It’s just that when you’re dealing with something of this unprecedented scale, any amount of willful ignorance strikes me as irresponsible.
>
> I am not advocating willful ignorance, and you are a **LIAR** to say that I am. If you expect me to believe you have any principles at all, then I suggest you refrain from gross dishonesty.
If you’re determined to find offense where there is none, and assume that comments are in specific reference to you and only to you when I’ve explicitly stated that they aren’t, there’s very little I can do to stop you, but it strikes me as a very ulcerogenic way to go through life.
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### Author:  [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/157 "2001-09-18T16:36:42Z")
I suppose I would have to have an iota of respect for you or your opinions in order to care how anything I say “strikes” you. As must be clear by this point, I do not.
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### Author:  [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/158 "2001-09-18T16:42:32Z")
Can’t we all just get a thong?
C’mon girls, y’all first…
damn!
---
### Author:  [@Orbifold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orbifold)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/159 "2001-09-18T16:53:31Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Jodi \*
> How does understanding the motivations of these particular terrorists – the specifics of what their gripe is with the United States – illuminate in any way the “effect” of the action upon other terrorists?
It’s not just the nature of their “gripe”, but what they were trying to achieve. Other posters have suggested that perhaps the hijackers were hoping to provoke a U.S. invasion of Afghanistan. If that were true, and if the hijackers had reason to believe that other terrorists would react violently to such an invasion, don’t you think that would be good to know?
> [@](#):
>
> How does knowing that the specific reason these planes blew up was because bin Laden believes American troops in Saudi Arabia “defiled” it (despite being there by invitation), in any way clue us in as to the potential future actions of, say, the IRA?
It doesn’t, because the IRA probably couldn’t care less about Saudi Arabia. But there are undoubtably people in the world who share Osama Bin Laden’s views and his lack of respect for human life, and who aren’t part of the Taliban or Osama Bin Laden’s organization. And I want to know how they will react to whatever reprisals are taken against Bin Laden. Again, will they be deterred, or will they view him as a martyr and try to imitate him? And one clue would be the views of Osama Bin Laden himself: is he adversely affected by the strength of U.S. resolve, or is he ready to die a martyr’s death? Or in other words, did he underestimate the strength and violence of our response, or is he anticipating and counting on our anger to fuel his own vision of himself as a noble figure?
You’ve said repeatedly that such questions shouldn’t change our response, but even if that’s true we shouldn’t deny ourselves the chance to better anticipate attacks in the future.
> [@](#):
>
> > [@](#):
> >
> > Because like it or not whatever we do in Afghanistan will have an effect on future terrorist behaviour, and we need to know what that effect will be, as much as possible.
>
> I agree with this completely. Of course, it has nothing to do with the motivations of the terrorists.
Not the ones involved in Tuesday’s attack, no, but it has everything to do with the motivations of people who might try to follow in their footsteps. The motivations of one will hopefully give us a clue as to the motivations of the other.
> [@](#):
>
> It doesn’t change that the attack took place. It does not justify or mitigate the attack. It doesn’t change our likely response to the attack. That is why at _this_ point, explanations of motivations are largely irrelevant.
I have to disagree, with the last sentance at any rate. Ideally it would have been better to know more about how Osama Bin Laden ticks long ago, so that we could have seen how far he was willing to go. Obviously we missed that chance, but that’s all the more reason to catch up on our homework now. It doesn’t prevent us from taking action against Bin Laden in any way, but it does help prepare us to live in the world that Tuesday’s events forced us to acknowledge.
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### Author:  [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)
#### Post date: [September 18, 2001, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-dont-need-to-understand-the-issues-that-led-to-tuesdays-atrocities/82167/160 "2001-09-18T16:53:57Z")
Yes, Bin Laden is crazy. No, he cannot be reasoned with.
BUT…WHY do some people follow him? Because he gets them young and manipulates them to think as he does. WHY is he able to do that?
Think about it.
Remember-we are not changing our foreign policy because of terrorists, we should change it because it was wrong, and because we cannot support conditions that encourage a terrorist mindset.
No one is saying we have to ignore Israel. But why do we have to ignore one to help the other?
Nothing is black and white. It’s all shades of grey.
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