# We love you. You have your Nobel Prize. Now, please shut up! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 9, 2002, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630 "2002-12-09T22:25:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/21 "2002-12-09T23:29:40Z")
I know that Bush Sr. explicitly chose not to take a public position on Clinton’s impeachment. He was a speaker at a meeting I attended, and that question came up. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/22 "2002-12-09T23:31:27Z")
To hell with politeness. If Carter wants to voice his opinions instead of fading off into the sunset, then more power to him. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/23 "2002-12-09T23:34:13Z")
That idea that dissent should be put aside when potential armed conflicts come about is one of the most vile ideas ever to come out politics. This is the time where if there are dissenting opinions, they are the most needed. Oh wait, I forgot, it’s only human life. Never mind, that’s nothing compared to a homily like “politics stops at the water’s edge”. I stand corrected. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/24 "2002-12-09T23:34:19Z")
I don’t care what kind of protocol Jimmy Carter may be violating by speaking his mind (and yes, I do happen to agree with him the vast amjority of the time). He was the last President I respected as a human being, and he’s done enough to advance peace and human rights since he left office to earn the right to say whatever he damn well wants, to whomever he damn well wants. ---
**Author:** ![Alma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@Alma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alma)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/25 "2002-12-09T23:37:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jackmannii \* > I am entirely willing to hear anything Carter has to say, about foreign policy, drywall, nuclear subs, you name it. Hear, hear. …Well, except poetry. His poetry was pretty bad. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/26 "2002-12-09T23:38:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lard2000 \* > \*\* > …Well, except poetry. His poetry was pretty bad. \*\* And maybe we should add UFO’s and bunny rabbits to that list. ---
**Author:** ![RexDart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b77776/32.png) [@RexDart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RexDart)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/27 "2002-12-09T23:41:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Revtim \* > \*\*That idea that dissent should be put aside when potential armed conflicts come about is one of the most vile ideas ever to come out politics. This is the time where if there are dissenting opinions, they are the most needed. Oh wait, I forgot, it’s only human life. Never mind, that’s nothing compared to a homily like “politics stops at the water’s edge”. I stand corrected. \*\* It’s not about dissenting opinions _in general_. It’s about dissenting opinions from a former President. The mythology of the Presidency was such that the office was treated as a single, almost sacred entity. The people who filled the office of the Presidency were to simply pass power to the next person in line, and not complain about that new person’s policies, symbolizing a peaceful exchange of power down the line of every occupant of that office. With democracy firmly entrenched for over 200 years now, that may not seem as important to you, but it has been helpful to have that symbolic unity in the past. Don’t worry about lack of voices of dissent. There are many far more visible, far more articulate, and far more outspoken dissenters of U.S. foreign policy than Carter is. There will be no lack of dissent, and the idea that dissent was unwanted in a time of war went out permanently with Vietnam. It’s not about dissent in general, but about who is voicing dissent, and about a specific tradition for ex-Presidents. ---
**Author:** ![Muad\_Dib](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/35a633/32.png) [@Muad\_Dib](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muad_Dib)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/28 "2002-12-09T23:41:30Z")
Yes, he certainly does have the right to say what he wants. That does not make it any less crass. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/29 "2002-12-09T23:43:47Z")
Wait a minute…is Carter even disagreeing with current administration policy? He basically seems to have said, “If the Iraqis are behaving, then we shouldn’t bomb them.” Is anyone even arguing with that premise, even the President (at least publicly)? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/30 "2002-12-09T23:49:24Z")
RexDart, I’d still put the value of one person’s opinion over some archaic tradition. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2002, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/31 "2002-12-09T23:54:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Muad’Dib \* > \*\*Yes, he certainly does have the right to say what he wants. That does not make it any less crass. \*\* Yeah, that’s pretty crass, saying that if Iraq complies the UN Security Council that no one should die. I bet he wears white after labor day, too. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/32 "2002-12-10T00:00:01Z")
First, Jimmy wasn’t not never a peanut farmer. He operated a peanut wholesaling business. More importantly, there may be something to be said for a degree of circumspect behavior, as regards one president to another, sure, that makes sense. On the other hand, if the issue is serious enough, (and what issue is more serious than war?) a refusal to speak out isn’t justified. An ex-presidents words carry more weight than yours and mine, if he has something to say about an important issue, _screw_ propriety. Let 'er rip, Jimmy! You Da Man. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/33 "2002-12-10T00:14:46Z")
Question for **december** : no citizen of the United States may publically disagree with a presidential policy. Yes or no? ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/34 "2002-12-10T00:18:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by El\_Kabong \* > \*\*Question for **december** : no citizen of the United States may publically disagree with a presidential policy. Yes or no? \*\* What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![Kat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b19c9b/32.png) [@Kat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kat)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/35 "2002-12-10T00:28:16Z")
When did they start stripping ex-Presidents of Freedom of Speech? What other rights do they lose? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/36 "2002-12-10T00:45:25Z")
The right to pay for postage. ---
**Author:** ![Robb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Robb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robb)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/37 "2002-12-10T00:54:37Z")
Somehow President Bush will be diminished because a man with a Nobel Peace Prize [“for his decades of untiring effort to find peaceful solutions to international conflicts, to advance democracy and human rights, and to promote economic and social development”](http://www.nobel.se/peace/laureates/2002/index.html) speaks in favor of a peaceful solution? Please tell me that I don’t live in your world. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/38 "2002-12-10T01:01:30Z")
1. Carter has the right to speak out when he disagrees with the President 2. December has the right to speak out when he disagrees with Carter speaking out about the President. See how that works? It’s the 1st amendment in action. Now you all have the right to speak out against December when he disagrees with Carter speaking out about the President. It’s all very meta. But when yell at him about #1, please try to keep in mind #2. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/39 "2002-12-10T01:03:44Z")
Enderw24, who said December didn’t have the right to speak out? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2002, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630/40 "2002-12-10T01:06:31Z")
actually, if I read this correctly, **december** is not in agreement w/your “#1”, **Ender** in respect that he claims that it’s traditional for living presidents to not vocalize disagreements with current sitting presidents. I’d like to see that bit proven first though. (and Trent’s comment doesn’t do it). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/we-love-you-you-have-your-nobel-prize-now-please-shut-up/141630.md?page=3)