# Web site fraud and World of Warcraft (long ass rant) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 16, 2006, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368 "2006-12-16T03:30:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/21 "2006-12-16T05:44:23Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] No…you don’t actually understand. This guy leveled 3 characters to 60 (and had several other alts)…all legit. He decided for the first time to TRY a service that would basically play his character for him in the PvP battle grounds for one day…and lost everything. Its definitely not a good thing he TRIED to do…but you guys are going batshit over board here. I know people who have paid folks to level their characters from level 1 to 60…THOSE folks are more in the category of scorn being heaped here. [/QUOTE] One’s a high priced escort, the other is a streetwalker. They’re both whores. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/22 "2006-12-16T05:45:19Z")
Feel superior now? 😛 If so, you got your months worth out of your dues to the board there. -XT ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/23 "2006-12-16T06:48:00Z")
Way I see it, **xtisme** , your attempt to warn people about the scammers is pretty irrelevant. Most people who play MMOGs already _know_ these creeps are out there. It’s much more interesting to mock the guy who _gave his password away_. I don’t condone the practice, but if you wanted your message to be taken the way you wanted it to, you would have done better to post this on a forum for people who do use third parties in WoW. Anywhere else (especially in the Pit), you’re going to get people who, yes, do feel superior because they know better than to get suckered into this shit in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/24 "2006-12-16T07:07:23Z")
Cheating asshole gets burned. And I should care because…? Your friend got exactly what he deserved. I hope the guys that did it go for one last burn and report him to Blizzard for violating their TOS. Fucks like you are what ruin online games. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/25 "2006-12-16T07:21:03Z")
[QUOTE=BayleDomon] Way I see it, xtisme, your attempt to warn people about the scammers is pretty irrelevant. Most people who play MMOGs already know these creeps are out there. It’s much more interesting to mock the guy who gave his password away. [/QUOTE] Obviously it was a mistake to post this here. Its not having anywhere near the effect I was going for…hell, assholes like Miller seem to think its great and that such predatory companies are a good thing. Makes little weaslets like him feel all goosefleshy in their superiority. 😛 At any rate, mock away…I know I did when he told me. And if this forum doesn’t get the message across that these guys are doing such things…well, I really don’t post on any other forums so its moot anyway. Just wanted a public place to say ‘Look! These guys are theives! Don’t use them!’. And I did. So, I gots my money’s worth. [QUOTE=Miller] Fucks like you are what ruin online games. [/QUOTE] :rolleyes: Yeah, fucks like me are stupid enough to try and help others. Obviously I need to be a superior asshole like you to really understand. Please…crawl back to thy hole. -XT ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/26 "2006-12-16T08:28:27Z")
Be kinda cool if the next major hack/anti hack struggle takes place in the online gaming universe. Nerd wars. ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/27 "2006-12-16T15:23:12Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Well FUCK YOU ASSWIPE! I wasn’t LOOKING for sympathy here…just getting the word out. Christ you guys are real assholes sometimes. -XT [/QUOTE] _shrug_ I’d feel about the same if you were warning that one particular store had attack dogs, so don’t try to steal from it. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/28 "2006-12-16T15:43:43Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Obviously it was a mistake to post this here. Its not having anywhere near the effect I was going for…hell, assholes like Miller seem to think its great and that such predatory companies are a good thing. Makes little weaslets like him feel all goosefleshy in their superiority. 😛 [/QUOTE] People are weaslets because your friend cheated and got burned. Right. That makes perfect sense. Oh, and you’re aware that your friend was giving this “predatory company” money, right? “Oh noes! Everyone be careful! This unethical illegal business did something illegal and unethical! But it’s bad because this time it happened to a friend of mine!” Most people like it when a cheater gets cheated. Funny that you didn’t understand that. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Menocchio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Menocchio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Menocchio)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/29 "2006-12-16T15:53:25Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Anyway, he bought the 24 hour service just to check it out. First time he’s ever done it, but the honor grind in WoW these days is horrendous and we are ALL looking for ways to get enough honor to actually buy some stuff (I’m SO pissed at Blizzard for this new system, especially in light of their intention to drop the prices of everything once the expansion comes out…but thats another rant for another day 😛 ). [/QUOTE] You’re kidding, right? The honor grind has become so much easier that one guy was seriously threatening to sue Blizzard because he was tired of seeing so many “noobs in epix”. (I’d love to see that brought before some crust old judge, btw.) It’s gone from “freaking impossible!” to “really hard”. And in either case the rewards will become pretty much moot after the expansion anyway. But that’s WoW players for you: “Blizzard hates my class! ZOMG why don’t the just call it world of droodcraft!” But cheater gets cheated. Yeah, can’t really muster up any sympathy for that. If it wasn’t for guys like you or your friend, the in-game economy wouldn’t be so screwed up, and I’d have a bit less spam to deal with. This isn’t like saying an immodestly-dressed woman had a rape coming, it’s like laughing at an athlete who pays for steroids and receives a bottle of baby aspirin. It’s never right to cheat someone out of their money, but sometimes it turns out to be karma in action anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Jurph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/50afbb/32.png) [@Jurph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jurph)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/30 "2006-12-16T16:22:24Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Just wanted a public place to say ‘Look! These guys are theives! Don’t use them!’. And I did. So, I gots my money’s worth. [/quote] Blizzard already told me that for free. I haven’t given anyone my password, and I haven’t had my account stolen. Surprise! If your friend had thought it through, he would have mailed all of his non-soulbound commodities (and gold) to a trusted friend’s account for the duration of the cheating. > [@](#): > > :rolleyes: Yeah, fucks like me are stupid enough to try and help others. Obviously I need to be a superior asshole like you to really understand. Please…crawl back to thy hole. If you want to try to help, convince people not to use Real Money Services with WoW – not because it’s a scam, but because it’s cheating. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/31 "2006-12-16T16:24:39Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] :rolleyes: Let me see if I understand it: Okay, so it appears that rather than play legitimately, and work his way through the levels, like everyone else, the “vic” paid someone to somehow hack or cheat his way into a higher status in said game, so he didn’t have to play by the rules. Doing so is prohibited by the terms of service of the company who makes said game (I’m guessing that if he’s caught, they’ll terminate his account). Why is it somehow acceptable for this guy to cheat, **Evil Captor**? [/QUOTE] Well, no. How does this “cheating” harm anyone? The guy is willing to pay real money to have someone with more skills power up his character. I don’t understand what’s wrong with that, morally. I’d say the guy is cheating himself of the pleasure of accomplishing something by gettin powerful within the venue of the game. (I’ve never played WOW myself, so I’m theorizing here, I don’t know what this grunt-work that’s being complained about is, and I’m kinda puzzled as to why anyone would pay money to play a game that involved a lot of such work.) As for the company made the rule: so what? Companies make bad or stupid rules alla time. You’re going to have to justify the rule on its own merits. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/32 "2006-12-16T16:30:11Z")
Anyone else find it ironic that someone way paying for ‘honor’ points? That said, what happened could have happened in real (virtual), life. I think the saying is virtual shit happens. Still sucks though ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/33 "2006-12-16T16:44:36Z")
[QUOTE=Evil Captor] Well, no. How does this “cheating” harm anyone? The guy is willing to pay real money to have someone with more skills power up his character. I don’t understand what’s wrong with that, morally. I’d say the guy is cheating himself of the pleasure of accomplishing something by gettin powerful within the venue of the game. (I’ve never played WOW myself, so I’m theorizing here, I don’t know what this grunt-work that’s being complained about is, and I’m kinda puzzled as to why anyone would pay money to play a game that involved a lot of such work.) As for the company made the rule: so what? Companies make bad or stupid rules alla time. You’re going to have to justify the rule on its own merits. [/QUOTE] Even if you feel that way (and to be fair, in the grand scheme of things, cheating at an online game in this manner is pretty far down the list of of Awful Bad Things People Do), I still wouldn’t feel sorry for the guy. You use, and you get used. These guys obviously weren’t all that ethical to cheat in the first place, so why did he think he could trust them? To somehow act shocked that a bunch of professional cheaters weren’t trustworthy strikes me as pretty fucking stupid. John Lennon said it best-instant karma’s gonna get you. ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/34 "2006-12-16T17:15:36Z")
[QUOTE=Evil Captor] Well, no. How does this “cheating” harm anyone? The guy is willing to pay real money to have someone with more skills power up his character. I don’t understand what’s wrong with that, morally. I’d say the guy is cheating himself of the pleasure of accomplishing something by gettin powerful within the venue of the game. [/quote] Cheating by buying gold ruins the in-game economy for normal players, because Chinese farmers can be paid so little per hour that gold inflation becomes a huge problem. This means I have to play many, many times as long to achieve certain goals or get certain items because the in-game economy has been ruined. It’s along the same lines as no-steroids rules. I’d have no problem with cheating-allowed servers, but I want to play on a non-cheating server. That’s what I pay for, and that’s why the rule’s in place. > [@](#): > > As for the company made the rule: so what? Companies make bad or stupid rules alla time. You’re going to have to justify the rule on its own merits. No, you don’t. Don’t play a game if you can’t play by the rules. Breach of contract is not OK because you don’t like the contract. There are many, many games out there where cheating is OK. Go play one of those, don’t ruin our game because you want easymode. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/35 "2006-12-16T17:24:58Z")
[QUOTE=fluiddruid] _shrug_ I’d feel about the same if you were warning that one particular store had attack dogs, so don’t try to steal from it. [/QUOTE] I gotta agree. I don’t play WoW, but I do play another MMORPG, and I hate the money, item, and critter inflation that comes from people cheating. Cheaters have forced the game designers to put a lower level cap into the game, among other things. I don’t get as much enjoyment from the game because of cheaters. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/36 "2006-12-16T18:35:58Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Anyway, he bought the 24 hour service just to check it out. First time he’s ever done it, but the honor grind in WoW these days is horrendous and we are ALL looking for ways to get enough honor to actually buy some stuff (I’m SO pissed at Blizzard for this new system, especially in light of their intention to drop the prices of everything once the expansion comes out…but thats another rant for another day 😛 ). [/QUOTE] Wait… what?? the new honor system boils down to “here have the best weapons in the game for basically no effort whatsoever, lets ignore the people who had to grind 10 hours a day for months to get the same reward!”. Some of my guildmates were able to get TWO rank 14 weapons the FIRST week and that was with the game being down all day tuesday and battlegrounds being down at least 2 other days. I could maybe understand paying for honor grinding back in the old system which was incredibly fucking harsh and idiotic but complaining about the system NOW is the worst case of looking at a gift horse in the mouth. Your friend tried to cheat, got burned for it. The only people you are helping with your “warning” are others who would be looking for ways to cheat so thats no good either. Honor farmers like this were the reason the previous system was so god damn fucking insane, competing against characters that are on 24/7 being played on rotation made it fucking hell on those who tried to do it the right way. Yeah im bitter, i grinded for rank 14 the right way so im glad theres assholes out there fucking over the people trying to buy their way into a game. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/37 "2006-12-16T18:36:08Z")
[QUOTE=Menocchio] You’re kidding, right? The honor grind has become so much easier that one guy was seriously threatening to sue Blizzard because he was tired of seeing so many “noobs in epix”. (I’d love to see that brought before some crust old judge, btw.) It’s gone from “freaking impossible!” to “really hard”. And in either case the rewards will become pretty much moot after the expansion anyway. [/QUOTE] You must either be an uber PvPer or you live on a different level of the tower than I do. Since the patch I’ve been playing consintently about 3-4 hours a night in the BG’s (AV and AB mostly)…and I’ve yet to get the GM bow. I’m still about 6k from getting it. Luckily for me I already had the full set of blue PvP armor and my character is pretty well set…just REALLY want that bow. But I don’t find this grind easy at all…I was doing better moving up the old PvP rank system to be honest (I was averaging about a rank a week up through level 10 and had gotten to level 13 when they changed everything). A night of hard play MIGHT get me 1-1.5k if I’m lucky and if the alliance guys I’m pugging with aren’t TOOO fucking stupid and lose in AV every time because they are all back on D trying to score HK’s (and not realizing that once you kill someone you get less honor for ever additional kill from there on out). Afaik no ‘noobs’ have gotten full sets of the phat gear as yet. Maybe on your server things are different…I certainly ain’t seeing a bunch of folks running around in new bright shinny purp GM gear. YMMV of course… -XT ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/38 "2006-12-16T18:41:48Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] A night of hard play MIGHT get me 1-1.5k if I’m lucky and if the alliance guys I’m pugging with aren’t TOOO fucking stupid and lose in AV every time because they are all back on D trying to score HK’s (and not realizing that once you kill someone you get less honor for ever additional kill from there on out). -XT [/QUOTE] See thats your problem right there. You are forgetting about the “multiplayer” part of MMORPG, frankly i cant understand why theres any pugs at all anymore. Don’t you have friends? a guild? regular companions? pugging is something you do while you wait for your regular group to log in, trying to pug your way to honor is like trying to crawl through a marathon. Nobody would try to pug their way through the hardest raids, why would you expect to get equivalent gear that way? ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/39 "2006-12-16T18:52:50Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Not only had the company NOT done what they advertised (i.e. taken his character to the BG’s and gotten him some or any honor)…they had completely stripped his account bare except for his hunter…which they had stripped bare of everything that wasn’t used to farm gold! Taking about fucking a guy over in as many ways as you can! The analogy I used was…it would be like going to a mechanic with your car and paying him for some repairs…only to find out that the mechanic had first used your car to mule some drugs about and then stripped it. Oh, and then happily refunded your money for the repairs he never did of course! [/QUOTE] Why on earth would you pay someone else to get on your account and play?! I’m sorry, but that is setting yourself up for a HUGE fall, it isn’t wise at all! I don’t play WoW, but there is no way on Og’s hairy bum I’d let anyone have my Guild Wars account information, nor my EQ account information when I played that! Not someone I knew, and sure as hell not a stranger working for a “company”. Your friend bears some of the responsibility, though I do offer him my sympathy for the robbery. (Even though he set himself up for the fall.) I daresay he’s beating himself up more than anyone else ever could. I hope he learns from this and doesn’t try shortcuts like that again. \*\*It isn’t at all like taking your car to a mechanic, it’s more like handing over your bank account information and PIN number, to a person who claims to be able to make a million dollars tax free legally just for you, for a small fee. \*\* It’s too good to be true, and therefore the motives of the person offering to do it are highly suspect. The point I am making is, don’t trust ANYONE (unless you know them personally, an even then if they rob you it’s your fault too) with your account information. The game companies themselves say this. If you want honor, platinum, (GW referance) armor, quest completion, missions mastered for that title, (GW referance) or whatever, DO IT YOURSELF! Don’t think some kindhearted person will do it for you. Raise hell with Blizzard until the revamp the honor system, and hold out until they do if nothing else! ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2006, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368/40 "2006-12-16T18:56:29Z")
[QUOTE=DigitalC] See thats your problem right there. You are forgetting about the “multiplayer” part of MMORPG, frankly i cant understand why theres any pugs at all anymore. Don’t you have friends? a guild? regular companions? pugging is something you do while you wait for your regular group to log in, trying to pug your way to honor is like trying to crawl through a marathon. Nobody would try to pug their way through the hardest raids, why would you expect to get equivalent gear that way? [/QUOTE] No, I have no friends. 😛 Yes, I have a few that PvP with me…but not enough for a full group. The guild we belong too isn’t a PvP guild though…nor a raiding guild. Most of them don’t play much PvP at all. And I HAVE mostly pugged my way through the hardest raids…which is why I don’t have the uber purple gear for the raids. My thoughts are…you shouldn’t HAVE to do such things to get decent equipment. -XT [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/web-site-fraud-and-world-of-warcraft-long-ass-rant/384368.md?page=3)