Webster's Dictionary

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First, we’ve both overestimated poor Hoff’s rank. Not even a lowly private, Hoff is actually a mere DRUMMER!!! I don’t believe he’s in the chain of command at all!

I confess it’s been decades (really: decades) since I’ve seen the book wherein the crime is committed. But if I remember correctly, Drummer Hoff has a doofy smile and the vacant stare of the recently lobotmized. If memory serves me right, we’re not speaking of limited learning, but actual diminished capactity.


But the genetic imperitive is a contributing factor! If we allow that DrummerHoff is…specially abled, expecting him, in the face of millions of years of evolution teaching men to delight in things that go BANG!, to resist the screaming in his soul of 10,000 ancestors to Fire it Off may be too much to ask.


But even if he’s not challanged, I submit that most males, given the option to “Fire it Off” or Not, would rather “Fire it Off”. Adulthood and maturity can temper that drive, but to hand a teen a cannon and say "Go for it! Cannons go BANG! is equivialant to handing a teenage male a bottle of Jack Daniels, a condom and a hooker.



Hmmmm. Interesting. The problem is that some of the actions, (bringing the shot, buying the powder, etc) are clearly volitional acts that people hopped up on acid would be hard pressed to do. I don’t understand the reasoning for the outlandish colors and uniforms, but I don’t know that LSD can explain everything.


Yes. One Tin Soldier rode away.


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::makes mental note to never ever read a thread that has both Fenris and Sexy Writer poting in it while drinking Dr Pepper::

Ow. My poor keyboard.

Laughing to hard to spell correctly, obviously. Posting, not poting. I have no idea what that would be like!

As an aside, SexyWriter,

As far as I can tell,
General Border gave the order
Major Scott brought the shot
Sgt Chowder broght the powder

Private Partridge broght the cartridge (which makes little sense, since cannons don’t require cartridges)

Private Parriage brought the carriage, I don’t know which.

All these people (and more) had to set the situation up for Drummer Hoff to fire it off. I submit that he was the victim of a vast organized conspiracy!

Fenris “A conspiracy? Hoff must go free!”

BTW: I note that I am the one responsible for the rank-inflation with regards to Drummer Hoff’s status. Mistakes were made.While I deeply regret any pain my actions may have caused, I would like to state I am not a crook. I maintain plausible deniablilty. I did not have sex with that Drummer, Drummer Hoff. It depends on what your definition of the word “IS” is. There was no controlling legal authority.

PS: Arden: Poting. Wouldn’t that have to do with whether you inhaled or not? :slight_smile:

May I suggest http://www.websters.com?

I present to you Exhibit A: Private Parriage brought the carriage, and some lackey named Corporal Farrel brought the barrel. Do note in Exhibit A that all parties are of adult age, though rather short and squat, and perhaps suffering from any of a number of diseases caused by genetic mutations, perhaps those that involve the sex chromosomes.


All these people (and more) had to set the situation up for Drummer Hoff to fire it off. I submit that he was the victim of a vast organized conspiracy!**[/QUIOTE]

And here, I present you with Exhibit B: Hoff’s glove, clearly coated in gun powder from having fired it off. However, do note that the glove is three sizes too big for the squat drummer to have realistically worn. Th only answer is that Hoff has been FRAMED. I assert that the rest of this twisted army, clearly immersed deeply in drug culture,has set up our Hoff so that he looks like the culprit.

Did Hoff fire of his own free will because of the vast conspiracy to force him to take resonsibility? Or was he framed after the act was committed by one of the others? It matters not…I agree with this statement:


However, I believe that Hoff should be acquitted, clearly SOMEONE fired it off…I have this blue dress here to prove it. Therefore, SOMEONE must be held accountable. It’s only a matter of time before I root out the real culprit. I offer here, a reward of 1,000 pennies for the capture of the actual Firee!

There won’t be any trumpets blowing,
Come that judgment day…

Wait…was the one tin soldier the ONLY survivor? How many others were there in the tin army? And was there something MORE buried on that hill than just the “Peace on Earth” slogan that was subsequently covered up? Is this part of the vast conspiracy against Hoff?

I think we need to bring in the ATF to find out just what DID happen when that hill went up in flames.


Thank you, thank you, for bringing up one of my pet rants.
I can’t complain to my children about this any more because they are sick of it.

Why do labradorian an I complain, you ask?

Did you notice on the Oscars that this opening was used 4 times? (Once by Steve Martin with a goofy definition, but 3 times seriously.)

These are people who make their living with the spoken word and they can’t figure out how tired it is. What are the odds your local chapter of Toastmasters does it any less frequently?

If you are a prospective speaker, be forewarned that to many people this is like nails scratching the chalkboard.

Hmmm…a conspiracy of sexually deviant mutants, with limited color sense…wasn’t Hoff closer to the human norm in height? If so…could it be a frame job? Embittered mutants, angered at their outcast status slaughter a human town, and pin the blame on a human

Be afraid. Be VERY afraid.




He’s squat? So much for my radioactive druggie, color-blind mutants frame good upright humans theory.

Alright. Then why would Hoff be the fall-guy? Could it be that Hoff opposes their evil agenda to destroy humans and pollute our precious bodily fluids? Could Drummer Hoff be the leader of a secret pro-human conspiracy, that General Border opposes?


SW: It’s clear that all the mountain (mountain=Tall!) people were slaughtered by the valley (valley=squat, short, low! A lyrical clue! :eek: ) people:

And we can assume that “Peace on Earth” is some sort of riddle or code. Perhaps directions to a treasure? If it wasn’t the song would be incredibly banal. And it COULDN’T be banal, could it?

By the way, we know at least two other members of the mutant army: Billy and his unnamed, yet irritating girlfriend. See below:

Note the similarity of motif? The Hillside (or mountain)? The Sargent (Sargent Chowder?!)?

I think I’ve got it! Billy KNEW TOO MUCH! He was sent up the hill by Sargent Chowder, acting on orders from General Border. Once he rode halfway up the hill (proof that it was a set-up! The mutants are from the valley, so why would he get reinforcements from UP the mountain!?), General Border gave the order and Private Hoff, completely unaware that Billy was half-way up the hill, fired it off!

Billy was killed, murdered, by intentionally directed friendly fire!

I rest my case.


What about the mysterious man on the grassy knoll, a.k.a. Captain Bammer who brought the rammer? Surely he is far from innocent in this matter…

*Originally posted by Fenris *

Oh, I’m afraid all right.


I think this is on the right track. Clearly, Border used his cult of personality to lure Hoff into thinking he had no other choice but to follow orders. Perhaps he even convinced him that the slaughter of the mountain people was just. Or maybe the pollution of bodily fluids took place PRIOR to the battle, and therefore, Hoff was compelled to follow orders to avoid extortion.


Well, we know nothing of the value of real estate on the mountain. Perhaps taking over prime building locations was the valley peoples’ only interest.


Who then, is primarily responsible? Shall we hang Border? Only Border and his closest men? Someone must pay for the slaughter of Bobby McGee’s brother, Billy!

[Edited by Eutychus55 on 04-06-2001 at 03:33 PM]

OH my god, I can’t believe I forgot about Bammer. That’s GOT to be how my dress got ruined. Perhaps we should look into his culpability a bit further. Since he WAS, as you put it, hiding “on the grassy knoll” maybe he was making serious attempts to stay in the background. I suspect him as the birthplace of this conspiracy.


Or even, dare I say, the pollution of precious bodily fluids involved the aforementioned LSD?

I’m convinced that you’re right about it being a radioactive-mutant personality cult.


OK. here’s the thing. We know Border and Chowder are directly involved, but how deep does the conspiracy go and how wide does it reach. Border must hang. I can’t compromise on that point, but could we offer Chowder some sort of deal, perhaps a life sentence in a medium security prison in exchange for all he knows? Would the trade-off be worth it? Would Chowder even go for it? He’s intensly loyal to Border, after all. Would the shock of seeing Border getting hung from the side of the Talahachee Bridge shock him into cooperating or would it anger him into reticence?

The one thing that throws the whole friendly fire theory into doubt, however is the startling new evidence from Fretful Porpentine: If Captain Bammer was UP on the grassy knoll (aka the hill aka the Mountain), we are suddenly at an impasse. All Border and Chowder have to do is claim that they sent Billy up the hill to fetch Bammer. You know it’s a lie, and I know it’s a lie, and Porpentine knows it’s a lie, but can we convince a jury? And if we admit your dress as evidence, that might prove that Bammer was up on the hill, so Border and Chowder have a legitimate out and simply point the finger back at Hoff.


We have more than one mystery here, and they are deepening.

First, I would observe that we need to resolve how SexyWriter’s dress got stained. And I submit to you that we know that Drummer Hoff was implicated from the start in the debacle that happened, and that one tin soldier was the only survivor. Therefore, it becomes evident that they were Grass stains. And we should be looking for someone named Gunt(h)er.

Now, as to the blame for the battle, it seems clear to me that the real culprit has not been mentioned at all up until now. That would be Colonel Mustard, who, ignoring his responsibility to his nation, his superior officers, and his troops, went off to a house party in hopes of getting into Miss Scarlett’s pants. There, folks, is the man you want to look for!

By the way, does anybody on board this thread speak the Cuban dialect of Spanish? I’m certain it will touch down at Havana Airport quite soon. :slight_smile:

Damned that Gunter! Leaves his Grass all over my dress and then…well…LEAVES! The nerve.

I’d like to suggest that we bring Border, Chowder, and Bammer up on charges of conspiracy to commit murder. I think we should at the very least hang Border from the Owl Creek…err…Talahachee Bridge. I’m going to have to sleep on this tonight, and carefully consider how we might turn these men against one another. I want to further examine Bammer’s hand in all this. I daresay this conspiracy is wide and deep indeed. Wide and deep.

In addition, we must find Mustard and Miss Scarlet. And the surviving tin soldier (not to be confused with the tin man) must be fully interrogated. Perhaps he was a traitor…a double agent.


Could we PLEASE leave Walt Whitman out of this?

Hmm…a bridge across a creek, or a river. Wide and deep.

According to the evidence before me, it is the River Jordan which is deep and wide. We have yet another suspect: some guy named Michael, last seen in a rowboat.

And there are a number of independent booksellers across America who would gladly assist in your proposal to hang Border(s) from one bridge or another. Not to mention his accomplices, Messrs. Walden, Noble, and Barnes. As well as some Amazon who only makes her presence known online.

Bringing in the Good Grey Poet was simply a ruse to throw us off the track, I’m sure.

As usual, you’ve all missed a critical piece of evidence. Hoff was a drummer. Not a gunner, a drummer! And yet this poor young man was charged with setting down his drum and picking up a box of matches; a boy sent to do a man’s job.

Obviously this regiment was already losing the battle. Cannon to left of them, cannon to right of them, all their gunners dead, General Border had no choice but to gather his dwindling forces and try to save the day with one last, inexpertly fired cannonball. And he failed, since only “one tin soldier” rode away.

You’re all a bunch of bargain-basement Nuremberg judges, flinging scorn into the bloodstained graves of Border, Scott, Hoff and the other noble souls who fought and died, while calling for the testimony of the absent tin soldier (a deserter, might I point out) to clear everything up!

Have any of you considered questioning the only eyewitness who’s actually been posting to this thread? Tell us, SexyWriter, what were you, a civilian, doing on a battlefield and in a position to get your dress stained in the first place?

Or should I say “positions?” Yes, that’s right: you were there to provide “aid and comfort” to the troops, weren’t you? And it was your distaste for Colonel Mustard’s muttonchop sideburns that drove him away from the battlefield, away into the fickle arms of Miss Scarlet. No doubt it was the loss of the colonel’s battle experience that allowed the day to be lost for gallant General Border. J’accuse, SexyWriter! J’accuse!

So, to sum up, I think Merriam-Webster’s owns the trademark.

Ah. But why is it assumed that said powder is gun powder?

I’m wondering if we have any data available regarding subsequent cocaine-related disciplinary actions, or rehab treatments, from this unit.

And the powder could be the kind used to finish makeup. Let’s just say I’ve heard, uh, “things” about Chowder.

And as if the conspiracy didn’t run deep enough already, what about Oliver Stone’s contention? About Agent Joel from the Grassy Knoll?

Well, it was Major Scott who brought the shot.

Now, I think most of us would be well aware of what his opinion of Lieutenant O’Reilly, who brought the smileys.

This dissention in the ranks probably contributed in great measure to the defeat and slaughter.

That one tin soldier probably needs to be found and questioned thoroughly. And of course, the context in which he was brought into the investigation furnishes us an additional piece of information: the Billy who was killed halfway up the hill obviously was William Jack. Whether Jack was his surname or middle name remains to be discovered.

That’s right…we know that William Jack did not make it back.

Perhaps I am thinking of the wrong battle, but what about Major Banks and his division of armored tanks?