# Weigh the importance of control of the three elected branches **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 9, 2021, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070 "2021-11-09T21:14:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2021, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/1 "2021-11-09T21:14:11Z")
You’re in control of a political party and your # 1 political advisor asks you a question: _Rank control of the three elected branches… President, Senate, and House… in percentages so that, in total, the rankings equal 1_ You ask for clarification. He responds _Well, let’s say that you think control of the Presidency is most important… and you rank that 50%, for example. Then you think that having control of the House is 2nd, and you go with 35%. That means the Senate is 15%. Got it?_ “Oh, OK. That’s easy. But what about, say, the House _and_ the Presidency?” _That’s for another time. For this question, I’m just interested in control of any one branch as a thing in itself, not combinations._ So what is your answer - using percentages, what is the relative importance of control of any _one_ of the elected legislative/executive branches of the US Federal Government, so that the sum of the percentages = 1? (For me, I would probably rank them as my example above. And yes, this does have a purpose.) ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2021, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/2 "2021-11-09T21:25:48Z")
It depends on what “control” of the legislature means. If we’re talking about a massive advantage, like having 80+ senators and a 200 seat advantage in the House, then the legislature wins out, 100%. With that sort of control, the legislature could impeach and convict / remove from office any POTUS, VPOTUS, cabinet secretary, and SCOTUS justices that refuse to go along with their legislative agenda. ETA: I see I misread. the OP 😅. I assumed, without reading carefully, that the traditional executive, legislative, and judicial branches were up for discussion. I still think that defining what “control” of the House or Senate means would still matter a great deal in determining the answer to the question. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2021, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/3 "2021-11-09T21:38:28Z")
Thanks for allowing me to clarify. I just mean a basic numerical majority. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/4 "2021-11-10T00:51:05Z")
Senate 55% President 35% House 10% ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/5 "2021-11-10T01:00:09Z")
President - 70% Senate - 20% House - 10% The importance of the presidency is extreme. He can do so much by executive order alone, his words alone have enormous influence on the direction domestic or international events take, he has ultimate say over which judges or people get nominated (even if the Senate ultimately approves or not) and whether bills get passed. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/6 "2021-11-10T03:17:54Z")
Personalities and trust can go a long way to empower any particular group. On average, though… House: 25% Senate: 40% President: 35% If you add in the judiciary, I’d probably give similar rankings between The Supreme Court, Congress, and the Executive Branch (adjusting as necessary so the ratios continue to work when we zoom in, as above). Just looking at the Trump presidency, if it hadn’t been for Senate approved appointees, we would have been _real_ screwed rather than the mostly “he’s so non-PC!” screwed that we actually got. Their real power is that they tend to be more intelligent and more inclined to think in the long term. It’s hard to beat that. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/7 "2021-11-10T12:59:33Z")
I’d say with the filibuster, it’s: President: 65% House: 25% Senate: 10% My reasoning is that there are two kinds of Senates- one with 60+ Democrats and one where nothing substantial can get done. Without the filibuster, I say: President: 50% Senate: 25% House: 25% ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/8 "2021-11-10T13:38:56Z")
Just to answer my own question with some detail: Presidency - 50%. Power of the pulpit. Executive Orders. It’s the #1 job, one that everybody is interested in. House - 35%. You control the agenda. The President can’t sign legislation you don’t pass. You control the budget. Senate - 15%. Your job is to protect the plutocracy, the monied interests which puts all three elected-branches in place. The Senate rarely, if ever, proposes, it can only dispose. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/9 "2021-11-10T15:20:09Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > My reasoning is that there are two kinds of Senates- one with 60+ Democrats and one where nothing substantial can get done. Which is why I ranked the senate so high. They can stop the other branches from functioning. No cabinet, no ambassadors, no spending bills. The senate can’t do much but if all you controlled was the senate you could stop the other party from doing anything. ---
**Author:** ![DeadTreasSecretaries](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deadtreassecretaries/32/4817_2.png) [@DeadTreasSecretaries](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeadTreasSecretaries)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/10 "2021-11-10T15:27:46Z")
In modern times it’s somewhere near BobLibDem’s numbers. Past congresses have given the president so many blank checks to do whatever he wants, the courts tend to defer to executive power, and it’s nearly impossible nowadays for congress to be unified enough to use its true constitutional checks against the president - veto override on anythimg substantial, and impeachment. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2021, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/11 "2021-11-10T20:11:43Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Presidency - 50%. Power of the pulpit. Executive Orders. It’s the #1 job, **one that everybody is interested in**. The one that everyone is interested in…as in wanting the job or interested in…as in media attention, greater focus during election time as it is a nationwide election? ---
**Author:** ![DeadTreasSecretaries](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deadtreassecretaries/32/4817_2.png) [@DeadTreasSecretaries](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeadTreasSecretaries)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/12 "2021-11-11T02:23:11Z")
Oh should say that the Senate is still more powerful than the house though. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/13 "2021-11-11T08:35:53Z")
Is it common to refer to the Presidency, The Senate and the House as 3 branches of government? I know you qualified it by saying “elected branches” but even so, that is only 2 branches, executive and legislative. I’ve never heard the Senate and the House referred to as sperate “branches”. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/14 "2021-11-11T14:03:18Z")
> [@DeadTreasSecretaries](#): > > Oh should say that the Senate is still more powerful than the house though. I don’t understand any ranking that puts the House higher than the Senate (or either ahead of the Presidency). The Senate has the power to confirm or deny all executive and judicial nominations. The Senate is fully co-equal to the House as a legislating body. The one Constitutional imperative given to the House – that spending bills musts originate there – is functionally meaningless. As for the Presidency versus either chamber, the President has enormous power through control of the federal bureaucracy and specific Constitutional powers. Let’s see Mitch McConnel order troops into Kerplachistan and see what happens. I’d go with: President: 80 Senate: 15 House: 5 ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/15 "2021-11-11T14:09:44Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > Is it common to refer to the Presidency, The Senate and the House as 3 branches of government? I understand what they’re saying, but there’s no good word for what OP is getting at. There are three “branches” of government – executive, legislative and judicial – with the House and Senate being two chambers of the legislative branch. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/16 "2021-11-11T14:43:28Z")
I didn’t refer to them as branches. I referred to them as ‘elected branches’, and repeatedly defined what I meant by such. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2021, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/17 "2021-11-12T01:32:05Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > Let’s see Mitch McConnel order troops into Kerplachistan and see what happens. On the other hand without a declaration of war or the congressional authority to spend money In not sure that the president can send troops into kerplachistan either. ---
**Author:** ![DeadTreasSecretaries](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deadtreassecretaries/32/4817_2.png) [@DeadTreasSecretaries](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeadTreasSecretaries)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2021, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/18 "2021-11-12T01:37:50Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > On the other hand without a declaration of war or the congressional authority to spend money In not sure that the president can send troops into kerplachistan either. This hasn’t been true in practice since Truman. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2021, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weigh-the-importance-of-control-of-the-three-elected-branches/954070/19 "2021-11-12T12:51:40Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > On the other hand without a declaration of war or the congressional authority to spend money In not sure that the president can send troops into kerplachistan either. Absolutely the President can order troops into a foreign theater without a declaration of war or specific Congressional authorization. Theoretically, under the War Powers Resolution, troops must be withdrawn if Congress does not pass a war declaration or other authorization within 60 days. But Presidents since it was passed have treated it as non-binding, and there are deep Constitutional issues regarding the act.