# weird planes **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 16, 2001, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831 "2001-10-16T22:15:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/1 "2001-10-16T22:15:06Z")
hello. last night i saw a very freaky looking plane in the sky. about 2 am, here local philly time. all i could make out was lights. i’m going to try to describe it, but i don’t know if i can do it justice. it was in the shape of a v. just the way you would write a capital V, angle-wise. certainly not as obtuse as a stealth. about as thin as the average christmas tree. there were maybe seven lights, tracing the v shape. one on the nose, then symmetrical going back towards the tail of the plane. a few days ago, i was outside smoking a cigarette, and i saw what can only be described as odd. there was a light in the sky, moving at the same speed a plane would move. but much dimmer than a plane. planes, even those high up enough to be seen as only one light, tend to be as bright as a planet. this light was very dim, a mid-brightness star. as it traveled in a straight line, the light suddenly started to dim, and was gone in about two seconds after dimming. there did not appear to be any cloud cover. i have never seen either of these before traveling my airspace. has the government announced the deployment of any odd looking planes over the east coast? could the second one have been a satellite? I’ve heard of seeing satellites, but haven’t seen one myself. any ideas? thanks, jb ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/2 "2001-10-16T22:21:23Z")
Geese? ---
**Author:** ![Kamandi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5daacb/32.png) [@Kamandi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamandi)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/3 "2001-10-16T22:31:04Z")
The Visitors have arrived! I for one welcome our new alien overlords. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/4 "2001-10-16T22:34:22Z")
Swamp gas from a weather balloon was trapped in a thermal pocket and refracted the light from Venus. ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/5 "2001-10-16T22:35:53Z")
Well, the first part of your question reminds me of an episode of Unsolved Mysteries I saw not too long ago. It was their conclusion that what was witnessed (Which sounds remarkably like what you describe) was a group of ultra-light aircraft flying in formation. But we all know it’s more than that. I suspect you saw either a stealth aircraft already in service, or you saw something in development. The truth is, I have no clue. I thought it was interesting that you had seen what the others on that show had described… in almost exact detail. Go figure. As to your second question- I think you saw a satellite. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/6 "2001-10-16T22:37:04Z")
but seriously, ducks or geese seems likely, particularly at this time of year. ---
**Author:** ![NotMrKnowItAll](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/6bbea6/32.png) [@NotMrKnowItAll](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotMrKnowItAll)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/7 "2001-10-16T22:39:30Z")
The second one sounds like a satellite. What time and date were you out for a smoke? I may be able to calculate the location of the penumbra and unbra for you. ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/8 "2001-10-16T22:45:05Z")
um, the little disappearing one was seen at anywhere between 1 and three o’clock (could be very wrong). i was facing eastward (towards the deleware river, i think that’s eastward from my house). all i know is that the moon was in my field of vision, but to my left, and midway up the sky. the light was 25 or thirty degrees high in the sky. it was almost directly in fron of me, to the right of the moon, and below. it was moving slow for a plane, but not superslow. it disappeared about forty-five degrees above the horizon, perhaps a bit more. jb ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/9 "2001-10-16T22:47:52Z")
No way of knowing what the first aircraft was, but the lighting configuration may not represent the actual shape of the aircraft. In any event, fixed-wing aircraft that fly out of NAS Willow Grove, the nearest military base, include: P-3C Orion A-10 Thunderbolt II C-130 Hercules C-9 (militarised DC-9) None of these have the lighting configuration mentioned by the OP. The second observation mentioned by the OP was almost certainly an orbiting object. On any given night, 3-5 such objects may be visible in the two hours or so after sunset. Here’s a useful link: [http://www.heavens-above.com/](http://www.heavens-above.com/) After a simple (and free) registration process, one can define one or more observation sites, then obtain the tracks and times of visible satellite passes for the next few days. These are easily seen with the naked eye on clear nights. ‘Flares’ caused by the reflections off the solar panels of Iridium comms satellites are categorized separately; these can be quite specatular. Hope this helps. ---
**Author:** ![NotMrKnowItAll](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/6bbea6/32.png) [@NotMrKnowItAll](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotMrKnowItAll)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/10 "2001-10-16T22:49:32Z")
A few days means under a week ago, right? I’ll work on it tomorrow while at my “job” that’s ending this Christmas (Damn Grinchy Owner). ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/11 "2001-10-16T22:52:03Z")
i suppose the first plane could have been a group of planes flying in formation, but they had to be in super fucking formation. again, i suppose that’s what formation-flying pilots do, but still. the synch was too good. also, i think i would have had to be looking at the formation at exactly the right angle for the shape not to change as the planes traversed the sky, wouldn’t i? G. Odoreida and Mangetout, definitely not geese. the geese around here leave very distinct chem-trails. jb p.s.- mangetout, first time i have typed your name. i always read it as Mangetrout (“mange trout”). is it “man get out”? geez, i had gotten along so well with mangetrout. and i would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn’t for you kids and that mangey trout! ---
**Author:** ![Waneman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/71e660/32.png) [@Waneman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waneman)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/12 "2001-10-17T22:31:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jb\_farley \* > \*\*…and i would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn’t for you kids and that mangey trout! \*\* What a great SIG! -Waneman ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/13 "2001-10-17T23:16:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jb\_farley \* > p.s.- mangetout, first time i have typed your name. i always read it as Mangetrout (“mange trout”). is it “man get out”? geez, i had gotten along so well with mangetrout. and i would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn’t for you kids and that mangey trout! \*\* It’s **Mange Tout** = Eat All (French) after my penchant for food\*. When I chose the name (which I use elsewhere on the net) a couple of years back, I didn’t notice that it could be parsed as **Man Get Out** , and completely misunderstood the efforts of the first chatter who tried to point this out. \*Interestingly (or maybe not), my real-life surname derives from the French word _Gourmand_ (glutton). ---
**Author:** ![Venkman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ec9cab/32.png) [@Venkman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Venkman)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2001, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/14 "2001-10-19T00:44:50Z")
Dunno about the V-shape, but the second thing you describe sure sounds like a satellite. Satellites are very easy to spot if you go out at the right time of night and are a little patient - during the time of year when it works out that I’m walking my dog about an hour or two after sunset I spot one every couple of days without trying too hard. As El\_Kabong noted the lights might not follow the actual shape of the aircraft as well. No idea what it might have been though. ---
**Author:** ![Bandanaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ab097/32.png) [@Bandanaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bandanaman)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2001, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/15 "2001-10-19T01:32:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jb\_farley \* > \*\*hello. > > a few days ago, i was outside smoking a cigarette, > > \*\* More info on the “cigarette” please… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2001, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/16 "2001-10-19T02:28:26Z")
Another possibility for the V: A hoax. A V formation of lights was one of the more common UFO reports a few years back. Possibly a group of bored individuals put something together to resemble the reports, from balsa wood and a weather balloon, or similar materials? It’s not, of course, some sort of top-secret aircraft, because whatever else you might say about our government, they’re not stupid enough to test-fly a secret aircraft over a populated area sporting a distinctive and unusual pattern of lights. I agree, by the way, that the second object described was probably a satellite. It’s hard to see one without knowing where to look for it, but it certainly happens occasionally. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2001, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/17 "2001-10-19T03:06:36Z")
You didn’t really say whether you could see the airplane itself, or just the lights. If you just saw the lights, a standard commercial airliner with a nose wheel light, a landing light in front of each wing, and lights at the trailing edge tip of each wing would probably make a V shape as described. I would have thought the second one was a satellite, but in the middle of the night, satellites aren’t visible. They’re visible later in the evening and earlier in the morning in the summer months, but this time of year, you need to be within about two hours of sunrise/sunset. During the hours when they can be seen, they’re pretty easy to find. Just go out and look up for about a half-hour and you’re bound to see one or two. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2001, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/18 "2001-10-28T03:27:52Z")
Does this description fit what you saw? > [@](#): > > observers reported sighting a triangular aircraft displaying a distinctive diamond-shaped lighting pattern, comprised of a red light near the nose – similar to the F-117 configuration – two ‘whitish’ lights near what would be conventional wingtips and an amber light near the tail. While the wing lights are reportedly much brighter than normal navigation lamps, they do not illuminate the aircraft’s planform. Observers claim the vehicle’s wing lights are approximately twice as far apart as those on the F-117, and nose-to-tail light spacing is about 50 percent longer than that on the stealth fighter. If yes, you may have seen an [Aurora](http://www.fas.org/irp/mystery/aurora.htm) reconniassance plane being deployed (? to Afghanistan ?). ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2001, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/19 "2001-10-28T04:24:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Chronos \* > **It’s not, of course, some sort of top-secret aircraft, because whatever else you might say about our government, they’re not stupid enough to test-fly a secret aircraft over a populated area sporting a distinctive and unusual pattern of lights.** I guess we can all assume that’s sarcasm? Or am I wrong? ---
**Author:** ![grettle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/aeb1de/32.png) [@grettle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grettle)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2001, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831/20 "2001-10-28T12:35:44Z")
there are top-secret aircraft undergoing testing right now that change colours due to the weather and time of day. basically, their bellies somehow sense the colours around them and they camoflouge (spelling very questionable). read more at [http://www.popularscience.com](http://www.popularscience.com). the second one was definitely a satellite, although that has been pretty well established. i used to look for them just after sunset for hours and hours with my friends. definitely a good way to test your patience. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-planes/87831.md?page=2)