# Weird two-airplane formation. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 29, 2004, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680 "2004-04-29T15:07:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Oregon\_sunshine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/50afbb/32.png) [@Oregon\_sunshine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oregon_sunshine)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/1 "2004-04-29T15:07:54Z")
In the last three years or so, I have seen this strange two-airplane formation go over about ten times or so. I was in the northwest Ohio area each time I’ve seen this. I’m into spotting solar halos and other atmospheric phenomena, so I look up probably more than most people. I think that’s why no one else I know has ever seen this particular airplane behavior. I’m writing fast because I _just saw_ this “phenomenon” and I thought I’d post about it and see if anybody knows what’s up. The two airplanes are always extremely close to one another, way closer than you’d expect for such large aircraft. I can’t stress too much how close together they are - nose to tail - I would think that flying this close in larger-sized airplanes would be extremely reckless and hazardous. (Of course, perhaps the apparent space between them looks small because of how far up in the air they are, but is actually fairly large. I don’t know. It just looks like they are flying dangerously close to each other.) They are flying relatively low, enough that I can see the specific shape of each aircraft, but not low enough to see details on the surface of the aircraft. They appear to be jets, the front airplane smaller with apparently four engines (two on each wing), and the one behind a bit larger with one engine on each wing. They travel together as if tethered, but I can’t imagine roping two airplanes that close together. Also, I can’t see anything between the two airplanes but space - no apparent tow line, and the planes are not connected in any way, they are definitely two discrete aircraft. FYI, the Wright-Patterson AFB (and the Dayton airport) is about 90 miles due south and the Toledo and Detroit airports are due north. The last two times I’ve seen this formation, they were traveling northward, I assumed to one of the airports. However, I was just wondering what this mysterious airborne activity might be. Any pilots/aeronautics people in the house that can explain? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/2 "2004-04-29T15:14:40Z")
The first thing that comes to mind is mid-air refueling. At least one of the tanker planes is a 4 engine jet. ---
**Author:** ![Lyllyan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b2d939/32.png) [@Lyllyan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lyllyan)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/3 "2004-04-29T15:15:00Z")
IANA(Pilot) or AP ( aeronautics person), but I would guess that one is a fuel plane. Since there is a military base near by - perhaps they are practicing fuel deliveries. (I know there has to be a better name for the technique, but I can’t recall it at the moment.) ---
**Author:** ![vibrotronica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@vibrotronica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vibrotronica)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/4 "2004-04-29T15:17:35Z")
Sounds like you’re seeing [mid-air refueling practice](http://www.ibjonline.com/index112002.html). ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/5 "2004-04-29T15:41:31Z")
The Ohio Air National Guard does specialize in refueling operations, with four-engine KC-135 tankers, and I agree that’s your best bet. It’s also possible that you’re seeing a research program in ice formation, with the “tanker” spraying water on the trailing aircraft. NASA Glenn in Cleveland does a lot of anti-icing research. ---
**Author:** ![pilot141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pilot141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pilot141)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/6 "2004-04-29T18:45:56Z")
The two most likely candidates have been covered: air refueling and icing tests. Does the second aircraft have an engine in the tail? If so, it is most likely a [KC-10 Extender](http://www.kc-10.net/kc10/photos/page01/kc10ar02.jpg), which can act as both tanker and receiver. The icing tests look similar, but the aircraft are never connected: water sprays from the boom so it can form on a specific area of the trailing aircraft. Most air refueling is done in the mid-20,000 foot altitude range, but sometimes lower if the recevier aircraft needs it (ie a C-130). IIRC the icing tests are done a bit lower, usually in the mid-teens, to get “better” ice formation. It really depends on the test, though. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/7 "2004-04-29T18:47:39Z")
The refueling formation seems the most likely, but you could also be seeing a glider and its tow plane. ---
**Author:** ![pilot141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pilot141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pilot141)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/8 "2004-04-29T18:53:04Z")
Sorry for the double post, but I found a better picture. [This one](http://www.kc-10.net/kc10/photos/page01/kc10ar14.jpg) shows a KC-10 behind a KC-135. ---
**Author:** ![bughunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@bughunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bughunter)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/9 "2004-04-29T21:09:09Z")
Well, there are some who want you to believe that you witnessed a refueling or de-icing in progress, but in reality, you were audience to _a mating ritual_. And that was no tether. Where do you think little ultralights and Vari-Eze’s come from, anyhow? Mail order kits? Pshaw! ---
**Author:** ![Trigonal\_Planar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/0ea827/32.png) [@Trigonal\_Planar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trigonal_Planar)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/10 "2004-04-29T22:08:31Z")
Indeed. Where did you think baby planes came from? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![caligynephobia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7feea3/32.png) [@caligynephobia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/caligynephobia)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2004, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/11 "2004-05-01T04:37:29Z")
Ooh, ooh, [here’s](http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/military/kc135-strat/images/597-61.html) a KC-135 refueling another KC-135 – actually a KC-135RT. I imagine **pilot141** ’s done quite a bit of A/R in his Air Force days. This is one of the few times when big planes are routinely “hand-flown” with the autopilot off (that is, when you’re piloting the rear airplane and onloading gas). Sometimes pretty tough to do with a large plane that’s much less responsive than those little fighters. For some trippy footage of this union in the days before good yaw dampers, check out the opening credits for Dr. Strangelove. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2004, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/12 "2004-05-01T04:49:56Z")
There is another possibility, perhaps it is some kind of glider plane in tow? But you say they appear to be jets, so not likely. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2004, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weird-two-airplane-formation/242680/13 "2004-05-01T04:57:48Z")
Snip [Edit]! discard above. Possibility already broached.