# Weirddave **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 9, 2003, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221 "2003-05-09T23:03:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Trucido](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@Trucido](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trucido)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/21 "2003-05-10T00:31:37Z")
It’s an integral part of my worldview that bad things should happen to bad people. Any higher justice or personal rancor aside, for someone who wallows in misery and hatred as much as Fred Phelps does, a slow death from cancer is probably a sunny vacation. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/22 "2003-05-10T01:13:39Z")
What I **wish** is that Phred would repent and try to heal some of the wounds in society that he has exacerbated. However, I haven’t gotten any notes from Beelzebub on the thickness of the ice there yet, so I’m not holding my breath. What would truly be poetic justice is if he needed a transplant as a result of the cancer – and the only donor match were a gay man. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/23 "2003-05-10T01:52:22Z")
I don’t wish cancer on Fred Phelps. However, I DO wish that a piano will fall out of the sky and land on him. Admit it, that would be funny. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/24 "2003-05-10T02:06:10Z")
Only if Matthew Shepard and Oscar Wilde conspired to push Liberace’s piano out of heaven and onto Fred’s noggin. ---
**Author:** ![Alma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@Alma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alma)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/25 "2003-05-10T02:11:35Z")
My mother had a two-year struggle with cancer, and she lived with my sister and I for the last few months of her life. I saw her go from 250 pounds to…well, about 50 pounds. She kept wishing she would die and forcing us to do superstitious things so we could speed it along (I had to go buy what I would wear to her funeral and show it to her, she thought it would help). About two weeks from the end she became completely incoherent, a short time after that totally unresponsive. Her mouth couldn’t even close. My family and I spent a lot of time around her bed, verbally encouraging her to die. So yeah, I too know what witnessing a slow, painful death from cancer is like. I also understand the desire to have bad people pay for their missdeeds, and how frustrating it is when there seems to be no justice in the world. One’s sense of justice may be somewhat satisfied that Phelps, a bad man, will die in an unpleasant way, especially since we all know plenty of good people who didn’t deserve to die that way. I am personally unsure if I should feel glad at that. On the one hand, many types of cancer are a kind of punishment, from smoking or sun exposure, while others seem to just happen or are unavoidable from the environment in which we live. Is cancer so bad that nobody should get it, no matter how evil they are? Or are we as human beings ultimately responsible for so many illnesses like cancer with our so-called civilized living that we might as well hope the bad people get it and not the good? Sorry to get off track. My point was just that I take no offense at **Weirddave** ’s comments even though I witnessed this kind of thing first hand. He didn’t wish cancer on my mother, and he didn’t suggest that my mother deserved what she got. ---
**Author:** ![Gr8Kat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gr8kat/32/18668_2.png) [@Gr8Kat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gr8Kat)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/26 "2003-05-10T02:18:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by alice\_in\_wonderland \* > \*\*OK - I just saw the other thread. Right. Hates gays. Got it. > > Well, the man is clearly an ignorant shithead whose political views make me want to puke up my Cherios. > > That being said, I still think wishing a slow and painful death on anyone is over the top. > > YMMV. \*\* If this biography is accurate - [Addicted to Hate](http://www.godhatesfundies.com/misc/ath/) - Fred Phelps is a reprehensible human being. He hurt and terrorized his own family into submission, and he preaches hatred from a poisoned pulpit. Has anyone else noticed his new website? [http://www.godhatesamerica.com/](http://www.godhatesamerica.com/) I just saw it today myself. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/27 "2003-05-10T02:44:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gr8Kat \* > \*\* Fred Phelps is a reprehensible human being. \*\* And hoping that he dies a slow painful death makes you (the collective you) a _BETTER_ person? No. I don’t think so. Clifford Olson tortured, raped and murdered 11 little children and I still don’t hope he dies a slow painful death from cancer - I don’t hope that anybody does for that matter. In my perfect world, everyone would die peacefully in their sleep. Even really horrible people. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/28 "2003-05-10T02:51:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by alice\_in\_wonderland \* > \*\*And hoping that he dies a slow painful death makes you (the collective you) a _BETTER_ person? > \*\* Who made that claim? We (collective we) are just sharing our feelings. Haj ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/29 "2003-05-10T02:52:18Z")
Ugh. ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/30 "2003-05-10T04:37:39Z")
[hijack] There is a moral difference, IMHO, between hating gays and hating gay-haters. Gay people are not hurting anyone. Phelps and his ilk are. [/hijack] That being said, I don’t want him to suffer. Suffering implies a drawn-out process, and I want him out of my sphere of existence A-fucking-SAP. ---
**Author:** ![Moe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moe/32/2972_2.png) [@Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moe)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/31 "2003-05-10T04:50:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*I don’t wish cancer on Fred Phelps. However, I DO wish that a piano will fall out of the sky and land on him. > > Admit it, that would be funny. \*\* ROTF! I admit it. How about sea sick and lockjaw at the same time? ---
**Author:** ![djf750](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ea666f/32.png) [@djf750](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/djf750)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/32 "2003-05-10T05:02:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by alice\_in\_wonderland \* > \*\* > > Clifford Olson tortured, raped and murdered 11 little children and I still don’t hope he dies a slow painful death from cancer - > \*\* You don’t? I do. And as he lays there suffering I hope the pain causes him to become human and he realizes what he he did so he suffers psychologically too. ---
**Author:** ![Gr8Kat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gr8kat/32/18668_2.png) [@Gr8Kat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gr8Kat)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/33 "2003-05-10T06:47:22Z")
I won’t say I’m _glad_ Phelps might have cancer, nor do I _hope_ he suffers. Let’s just say that, when he is gone, I won’t be shedding any tears. I also won’t be celebrating and picketing his funeral, so I _do_ think that makes me the better person. From “Addicted to Hate”: > [@](#): > > Phelps has found the national spotlight by disrupting the mourners’ grieving at the funerals of AIDS victims. His followers carry picket signs outside the services with such stone-hearted messages as GOD HATES FAGS… > > * * * > > When not doing TV talk shows, radio interviews, or appearing on the cover of the national gay magazine, The Advocate, Phelps lays siege to his hometown, nearby Kansas City, and local universities. > > * * * > > The Westboro congregation pickets public officials, private businesses, and other churches, many of whom have had only tenuous connection to some form of anti-Phelps criticism… Fred Phelps has been able to intimidate most of the residents of Topeka into a fearful silence, though he himself is a shrill and vigorous defender of his own First Amendment rights. … One prominent restaurant in Topeka is now failing after being picketed daily for almost a year. “Patrons just got tired of the harassment,” sighs the owner. The cause of the pickets? One of the restaurant’s employees is a lesbian. > > * * * > > Mark Phelps feels nauseated whenever he remembers that night. He was hit over 60 times and his brother, Nate, over 200 with a mattock handle. Nate went into shock. Mark didn’t. A boy who became a compulsive counter to handle the stress, Mark counted every stroke. His and Nate’s. While their father screamed obscenities and his brother screamed in pain. Every 20 strokes, their mother wiped their faces off in the tub. Nate passed out anyway. That was Christmas Day. > > * * * > > A mattock is a pick-hoe using a wooden handle heavier than a bat. Fred swung it with both hands like a ballplayer and with all his might. “The first blow stunned your whole body,” says Mark. "By the third blow, your backside was so tender, even the lightest strike was agonizing, but he’d still hit you like he wanted to put it over the fence. By 20, though, you’d have grown numb with pain. That was when my father would quit and start on my brother. Later, when the feeling had returned and it hurt worse than before, he’d do it again.” > > * * * > > Mark believes that Fred Phelps, no longer able to hate and abuse his adult children if he hopes to keep them near, by necessity now must turn all his protean anger outward against his community. The community of Topeka, Kansas, and the human community as a whole, will be better off when this vile man is no longer a member. ---
**Author:** ![donkeyoatey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@donkeyoatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/donkeyoatey)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/34 "2003-05-10T07:14:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gr8Kat \* > \*\* > The community of Topeka, Kansas, and the human community as a whole, will be better off when this vile man is no longer a member. \*\* Agreed. And I completely agree with **Weirddave** ’s statement above, he didn’t wish cancer on Phelps, he hoped the death he’s (presumed to be) facing to be “slow and extremely painful”. But, **Weirddave** , this : > [@](#): > > I would feel the same about Stalin, Hitler, Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein. is way over the top. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/35 "2003-05-10T07:25:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by alice\_in\_wonderland \* > \*\*And hoping that he dies a slow painful death makes you (the collective you) a _BETTER_ person? > > No. I don’t think so. > > \*\* Better? No, I don’t think I’m better, in fact, I’m probobly worse, or at least more honest. I fully accept that I can be a vindictive son of a bitch, and accept that as a part of my character. Fred Phelps revels in the pain he causes others. Matthew Shephard was a gay young man. Because he was gay, a couple of homophobes tied him to a fence and tortured him until he died. When Mathew’s greiving family was burrying him, Phelps organized a protest outside the funeral, people carrying signs reading “Matthew Shephard is burning in hell”. He sent letters with the same message to Matthew’s parents. His website, for years, and I’m not sure if it still does, I’m not going to go there to find out, had an animation of Matt’s head in flames with the caption “Matthew Shephard has been burning in hell for XXX days, he has an eternity left”. This is far beyond simple " I don’t want them in my neighborhood" homophobia. It is active, despicable, hate speach, no, hate action. The fact that I want such an inhuman creature to suffer is to my detriment. I realize this, but do not apologise for it. If it was up to me, I would personally torture this “man” for eternity. Even then, it wouldn’t be enough. So. Hate me, insult me, cross me off your guest list over this, I don’t care. Some things are beyond my capacity as a caring human being to forgive. Fred better hope God is more forgiving, I am not. I can live with it. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/36 "2003-05-10T07:29:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by donkeyoatey \* > \*\*Agreed. > And I completely agree with **Weirddave** ’s statement above, he didn’t wish cancer on Phelps, he hoped the death he’s (presumed to be) facing to be “slow and extremely painful”. > But, **Weirddave** , this : > > > [@](#): > > > > I would feel the same about Stalin, Hitler, Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein. > > is way over the top. \*\* Why? Has Phelps not demonstrated evil in the same class as those listed above? I’m curious, why is it “over the top”. ---
**Author:** ![donkeyoatey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@donkeyoatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/donkeyoatey)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/37 "2003-05-10T07:59:00Z")
**Weirddave** , I respect you immensely, you have made me laugh and provided information. But to put someone like Fred Phelps on the level of Stalin, Hitler, Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein is absurd. These four have been directly responsible for many millions of deaths. And to break that down, Stalin and Hitler have been responsible for many millions of deaths, Saddam Hussein has been responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths and Osama bin Laden has been responsible for many thousands of deaths. I just can’t put Phelps anywhere near this. Even saying Phelps disseminates hatred on a level with fucks is abhorrent to me, but I hope closer to what you meant. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/38 "2003-05-10T08:29:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by donkeyoatey \* > \*\ ***Weirddave** , I respect you immensely, you have made me laugh and provided information. But to put someone like Fred Phelps on the level of Stalin, Hitler, Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein is absurd. These four have been directly responsible for many millions of deaths. And to break that down, Stalin and Hitler have been responsible for many millions of deaths, Saddam Hussein has been responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths and Osama bin Laden has been responsible for many thousands of deaths. I just can’t put Phelps anywhere near this. > Even saying Phelps disseminates hatred on a level with fucks is abhorrent to me, but I hope closer to what you meant. \*\* As a single man, he has mobilized his entire family to go around the country with him to disseminate hate. Without actually physically harming those he condemns and defames, like in the Matthew Shepherd case, he puts ground glass and salt in an open wound and grins like Angus Scrimm from Phantasm having a joygasm. To compare him to Hitler, Osama, and Stalin is a bit off. Phelps is worse. Many died under the three dictators. Yet… in all I have read about Stalin and Hitler, never saw film or anything written about them having a sadistic giggle at the expense of their victims to increase the suffering of the individual families. Fred’s sick obsession leads him on a self-funded tour of America where he spews hate, always has that evil(and I rarely use the term evil) grin, and he seems to live off of his media coverage. At least Hitler put some beauty in the world through his paintings. Fred has put forth nothing more than hate and sadistic glee. Again, I am wishing for a barfing smiley. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/39 "2003-05-10T11:02:32Z")
Give 'em hell, 'Dave. I, as a hell-bound individual, will freely say that I sure hope Fred Phelps receives a tenth as much pain as he inflicted on anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221/40 "2003-05-10T11:44:07Z")
Comparing Phelps to monsters like Stalin etc is simply like comparing differant shades of shite. Given the opportunity I doubt that Phelps would be any differant to the Hitlers of history, and I doubt that he could possibly be any worse. Hitler etc are those who made it to the top and hence had the power to carry out their crimes, Phelps is struggling to get up there. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/weirddave/174221.md?page=3)