# Welcome to the Canadoper Café, 2025! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 31, 2024, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410 "2024-12-31T21:26:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 23
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/441 "2025-03-15T15:54:12Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > I honestly don’t think they will come up with anything. > > Anyone with eyes to see has seen this coming for months now. If the CPC were capable of significant change, they’d have given _someone_ the job of finding new messaging at least as long ago as Trudeau’s announcement that he was stepping down. At that point, anyone with half a brain would have known the whole “Fuck Trudeau” plan was done for. I agree. The CPC is just amazingly tone deaf right now and they seem unable to deviate from their plans. I will personally be very, very surprised if they can change their messaging. I don’t think a Liberal victory is by any means assured. There remains a substantial degree of fatigue towards the Liberals, which is normal after nine years in power. The CPC could not only still win but could still win a majority. Even a solid debate performance could bring it home for them. ---
**Author:** ![MacDoc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/macdoc/32/18696_2.png) [@MacDoc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacDoc)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/442 "2025-03-15T15:56:26Z")
It is a majority that concerns me. A minority Con gov would be “entertaining” 🍿 ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/443 "2025-03-15T15:57:49Z")
> [@Kropotkin](#): > > Anyone here remember Reach for the Top? When you only have 3 TV channels as a bored kid (2 English, 1 French), you’ll remember any TV show. (Not to mention _Genies en herbe_.) I think Reach for the Top was on the decline when I was in high school. The University of Waterloo math contests (Pascal, Cayley, Fermat) were more my speed. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/444 "2025-03-15T15:58:47Z")
> [@MacDoc](#): > > Yes, France has nuclear missile submarines, specifically the Le Triomphant-class ballistic missile submarines (SSBNs), which are part of the French Navy’s strategic oceanic force, and are equipped with M51 missiles. Like the UK, this is now in effect the entire French nuclear deterrent. The French sub that docked in Halifax - which I wrongly thought was a misreport because it was only a social media thing for a day or two - is not a ballistic missile submarine and likely doesn’t carry any nuclear weapons. And despite that headline upthread there is nothing mysterious about this. It’s well known France is willing to build some of these for the Royal Canadian Navy and would love to make the sale. The Suffren class of attack submarines is very new - France has only built three of the six they have planned - and would be an excellent choice for Canada, at least for future, more predictable defense needs. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/445 "2025-03-15T17:05:02Z")
Pollievre’s current attempt at “policy” is a goofy whine that Carney - who helped steer the UK throught Brexit - should’ve been fired when he was head of the Bank of England. 🙄 Try again, Sparky. Ah, yes - Reach For the Top - I remember well. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/MIVBgOhD-fs/hqdefault.jpg "SCTV ~ HIGH Q , 1977") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIVBgOhD-fs) ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/446 "2025-03-15T17:53:49Z")
PP seems to be talking about long mandatory sentences for fentanyl. This is not a great main topic in the setting of a trade war. It would almost certainly be found unconstitutional. It sounds unkind and regressive. Mandatory psychiatric and addiction treatment is still controversial but would sell better. PP needs to address Trump and the US much more directly. He does not want to, but that portion of his base won’t vote LNDP anyway. PP should be focusing on corruption. Parliament shutting down and why. Scandals involving huge spending, but not costumes or visits. These belong to the Liberal Party and not Trudeau. They could focus on immigration as it relates to housing and medical care, but would have to be cautious not to take it further. They could focus on moneys given to First Nations, but many Canadians support this after residential school issues and again, the CPC is not known for treading lightly. They should mention Carney gave advice directly to the Liberal Party, but mentioning Trudeau more than once makes them look out of date. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/447 "2025-03-15T20:24:34Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > They could focus on immigration as it relates to housing and medical care, but would have to be cautious not to take it further. But again, they’d have to come up with actual policies to push that. Everyone knows our housing is a problem, and PP himself has complained about it many times in the past. But what actual policies has he put forward to fix this problem? None, so far as I recall. Just a lot of “I can fix it! Two weeks!” kind of Trumpsense\*. \*That’s a new word for nonsense I just came up with. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/448 "2025-03-15T20:41:10Z")
Elbows up, Canada! [https://youtu.be/ND2E24ZO-8U?si=Y5nMkKJ6px6DE4Rz](https://youtu.be/ND2E24ZO-8U?si=Y5nMkKJ6px6DE4Rz) Canadian hand to hand combat instructor versus American in The Devil’s Brigade, 1968 ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/449 "2025-03-15T20:41:12Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > PP seems to be talking about long mandatory sentences for fentanyl. This is not a great main topic in the setting of a trade war. Who gives two shits about that right now? How many people do you know who’ve been calling for more fentanyl sentencing? Jesus Christ. > [@Horatius](#): > > But what actual policies has he put forward to fix this problem? None, so far as I recall. Just a lot of “I can fix it! Two weeks!” kind of Trumpsense\*. Back in the day, they WERE proposing things. And they stopped doing that at least a year ago. The party does have a policy document on its website but it’s dozens of pages long and includes blurbs on basically every topic under the sun. The blurbs are largely devoid of specifics. What their priorities are is not explained. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2025, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/450 "2025-03-15T22:02:59Z")
You can avoid coming up with policies when you are twenty points ahead because whatever voters think, you want them to feel it is possibility. You should not do that in an even race against a leader considered intellectual. You should attack the PARTY on its biggest weakness - corruption and spending. Don’t mention Trudeau, except to say Carney gave the Liberal Party President advice. Poilievre certainly should not bring up health issues. Meeting the truckers during Covid may or may not have been a big deal. But it rubbed most Canadians the wrong way. Poilievre, one supposes, thinks he can win without alienating the radicals. Maybe he is correct, dunno. But I think he would reassure people by intentionally going much more moderate. He likely disagrees, but most folks are appalled by what is happening in the country south of sanity. Of course no one cares about harsh punishments for fentanyl, yet the Libs are talking about this too for some reason, maybe to take more wind out of his sails. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/451 "2025-03-16T00:37:57Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > But what actual policies has he put forward to fix this problem? None, so far as I recall. Just a lot of “I can fix it! Two weeks!” kind of Trumpsense\*. Right on their website. He’s said this in parliament as well. Took 2 seconds to find. Policy: First listed is to withhold funds to municipalities who don’t meet their homebuilding targets. There are others. > **[Building Homes, Not Bureaucracy - Conservative Party of Canada](https://www.conservative.ca/building-homes-not-bureaucracy/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR2KwsvOLr8-ORklY57X4SXyhhQFa-tzfDwZXP3t57AudD_YBSZM1RQbX3A_aem_yGlPdgWgnxv8iTKt7Iz0qA)** > > Poilievre announces his bold plan to bring homes you can afford by removing gatekeepers and red tape, fining big city governments that block new homes, giving bonuses to cities that free up land, and making transit funding dependent on getting... Echo, echo, echo… ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/452 "2025-03-16T01:22:18Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > Echo, echo, echo… He can stop with stupid, populist names: “ **The** _ **Building Homes Not Bureaucracy Act** _”. This isn’t the US, just in case you haven’t noticed. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/453 "2025-03-16T02:05:40Z")
So this ha! ‘groundbreaking’ Building Homes, Not bureaucracy crap from 18 months ago is going high on the hog for new housing while screwing infrastructure, which new housing kinda relies on, to begin with. And _of course_ real estate and construction entities will chime in for it. ETA: not to mention screwing infrastructure for current, required, ongoing, maintenance. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/454 "2025-03-16T02:34:24Z")
Missed edit window. Despite the urgency of new housing, to completely eschew infracsturcture (and even _penalizing_ those who go ahead) for it strikes me as utterly counter-productive. Existing facilities need to be maintained. “Cut the bonuses and salaries, and if needed, fire the gatekeepers at CMHC if they are unable to speed up approval of applications for housing programs to an average of 60 days.” That sounds a bit draconian to me. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/455 "2025-03-16T07:33:36Z")
> [@Guest-starring\_Id](#): > > So this ha! ‘groundbreaking’ Building Homes, Not bureaucracy crap from 18 months ago is going high on the hog for new housing while screwing infrastructure, which new housing kinda relies on, to begin with. And _of course_ real estate and construction entities will chime in for it. > > ETA: not to mention screwing infrastructure for current, required, ongoing, maintenance. The claim was he didn’t have a policy, NOT that they disagreed with his policy. ‘Screwing infrastructure’? What did I miss on that page that you are spouting about? ‘Of course’ real estate and construction entities will chime in for it, they are the ones doing the building and selling. Who else do you envision doing this? > [@](#): > > Cut the bonuses and salaries, and if needed, fire the gatekeepers at CMHC if they are unable to speed up approval of applications for housing programs to an average of 60 days. > That sounds a bit draconian to me. I guess you could give them a $27M bonus like Trudeau did. Better make sure to fire those who do things quickly as they make everyone else uncomfortable. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/456 "2025-03-16T15:40:28Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > ‘Of course’ real estate and construction entities will chime in for it, they are the ones doing the building and selling. Who else do you envision doing this? What they are unlikely to do is build and sell good, low-priced housing because they seek profits. The Canadian government used to build housing precisely so it was affordable; it encouraged co-ops and other forms of housing that are not as profitable for developers and builders. This was slashed in the 1980s and the end of social housing programs helped fuel rising housing costs and homelessness. So I envision government programs that provide good wages and training for the trades, use Canadian lumber that would otherwise be sold to the US, and create a very large supply of affordable housing. This is utopian, but it is less utopian than thinking developers and builders will fix the problem they profit from. See also “Red Vienna,” where a very large percentage of the city’s housing is social: > **[The social housing secret: how Vienna became the world’s most livable city](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2024/jan/10/the-social-housing-secret-how-vienna-became-the-worlds-most-livable-city)** > > In the Austrian capital, renters pay a third of what their counterparts do in London, Paris or Dublin. How is it possible? We have had large social housing efforts in Canada, including the wartime housing effort, so not only can it be done, it has been done. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/457 "2025-03-16T16:06:36Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > The claim was he didn’t have a policy, NOT that they disagreed with his policy. Right - this _one_ policy from 18 months ago. Not really all that substantial, but hey YMMV. > [@](#): > > ‘Screwing infrastructure’? What did I miss on that page that you are spouting about? - “…a percentage of their federal funding will be withheld…” in regards to housing construction targets not being met. Hm, I wonder what will be affected by those funding cuts. - “ **Withhold transit and infrastructure funding** from cities until sufficient high-density housing around transit stations is built and occupied. Cities will not receive money for transit until there are keys-in-doors” - “When [NIMBY] complaints are legitimate, **we will withhold infrastructure and transit dollars** until cities allow homes to be built.” Yeah, let’s wait and see about the legitimacy of whatever NIMBY complaints there are, then. > [@Uzi](#): > > Better make sure to fire those who do things quickly as they make everyone else uncomfortable. Can you cite that that was an issue for anyone? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/458 "2025-03-16T17:25:38Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > Right on their website. He’s said this in parliament as well. Took 2 seconds to find. > Policy: First listed is to withhold funds to municipalities who don’t meet their homebuilding targets. There are others. And they don’t say anything about it in their ads, and he never talks about it. As I said upthread, they USED to announce stuff like this. In fact, they are now finally running an ad about homes… that doesn’t match up with this stated platform. It’s a brutal campaign, absolutely amateurish. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/459 "2025-03-16T19:57:51Z")
Thanks for that Vienna link. Very interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2025, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410/460 "2025-03-16T23:23:55Z")
Fascinating thread. This American is very glad to see that the Libs just _might_ remain in power and continue to defy Trump. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410.md?page=22) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/welcome-to-the-canadoper-cafe-2025/1012410.md?page=24)