# Well, did he ever return? \[Charlie from the song "M.T.A."\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 11, 2013, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070 "2013-05-11T12:17:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/1 "2013-05-11T12:17:52Z")
Some of you folks might remember this refrain from a Kingston Trio song about a man named Charlie who couldn’t come up with another nickle that would allow him to get off of Boston’s MTA subway system: "…Well, did he ever return? No he never returned and his fate is still unlearned He may ride forever 'neath the streets of Boston And he’s the man who never returned." I’m just trying to look on the bright side of life. Is it possible that Charlie excaped the subway system during the recent terror and confusion in Boston? I’ve been worried for years. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/2 "2013-05-11T12:24:13Z")
Did you read your own OP? No, he never returned. ---
**Author:** ![Lsura](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Lsura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lsura)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/3 "2013-05-11T12:38:05Z")
I hear his wife takes him a sandwich every day at a quarter past two. (why couldn’t she put extra nickel in the bag one day? ) ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/4 "2013-05-11T12:39:07Z")
I always wondered why his wife didn’t throw him the nickle he needed rather than the sandwich. Maybe she didn’t want him back. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/5 "2013-05-11T13:00:50Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > Some of you folks might remember this refrain from a Kingston Trio song… Heh. That was the first thing that came to mind when I read the thread title. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/6 "2013-05-11T13:16:14Z")
Well, did you vote for George O’Brien? _Now you citizens of Boston, Don’t you think it’s a scandal that the people have to pay and pay? Fight the fare increase, vote for George O’Brien! Get poor Charlie off the MTA._ ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/7 "2013-05-11T14:32:56Z")
I found a web page about the song, once; don’t know if it’s still up. If I remember correctly, the author concluded that Charlie would have been able to leave once he qualified for the senior citizen fare, which did not require an extra five cents for the trip he took. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/8 "2013-05-11T14:42:21Z")
But by that time, the fares would probably have increased. ---
**Author:** ![TheChileanBlob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thechileanblob/32/435_2.png) [@TheChileanBlob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheChileanBlob)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/9 "2013-05-11T14:43:05Z")
> [@Lsura](#): > > I hear his wife takes him a sandwich every day at a quarter past two. > > (why couldn’t she put extra nickel in the bag one day? ) > [@runner pat](#): > > I always wondered why his wife didn’t throw him the nickle he needed rather than the sandwich. > > Maybe she didn’t want him back. 😃 I always assumed that he was racking up fares owed every day, and he couldn’t get out from under. And speaking of under, that song always makes me think of [this man](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0PTa7lnOWs). ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/10 "2013-05-11T15:17:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > But by that time, the fares would probably have increased. Sort of. Found the [site](http://www.mit.edu/~jdreed/t/charlie.html) I was thinking of: > [@](#): > > Charlie might just have been able to get off the train at some point the '70s. From 1968 to 1980, the subway fare was 25 cents. In the mid 1970s, a senior citizen discount was introduced for “half fare”. Rather than charge 12.5 cents, half-fare was defined as “10 cents”. If Charlie was well into his 30s when he got on the train, he might just have been over 65 before 1980, and could have gotten off the train in Jamaica Plain. Getting back might be a problem… ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/11 "2013-05-11T16:17:55Z")
Moving to Cafe Society, from MPSIMS. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/12 "2013-05-11T16:53:28Z")
> [@Lsura](#): > > I hear his wife takes him a sandwich every day at a quarter past two. > > (why couldn’t she put extra nickel in the bag one day? ) Yeah, that’s what I always wondered. Clearly, his wife didn’t want him off the subway. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/13 "2013-05-11T17:11:57Z")
I gave my husband an MTA token for his birthday back in 1996 😛 ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/14 "2013-05-11T18:28:30Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > I gave my husband an MTA token for his birthday back in 1996 😛 Now, if only his name was Charles… As a Kingston Trio fan\*, I would’ve laughed like a hyena. \*What? It was the only one of my parents’ LPs I liked as a kid. It was a live album, high energy, with lots of patter and “drunk audience ambience”. And now I’ve got a dozen or so of their (hipster vinyl) albums. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/15 "2013-05-11T18:50:10Z")
I figure somebody’s going to mention this story: > **[SubwayNamedMobius.pdf](https://westongeometry.pbworks.com/w/file/fetch/61244911/SubwayNamedMobius.pdf)** ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/16 "2013-05-11T19:31:42Z")
Poor Charlie. Anybody ever think to look for him in the Everglades? Maybe he somehow found his way there. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/17 "2013-05-11T19:45:17Z")
According to Wiki, \* The Front Porch Country Band recorded a song called “The Man Who Finally Returned” about Charlie getting off the MTA. Bob Haworth, a member of The Kingston Trio, wrote and recorded a song called “MTA Revisited” in 2004.\* I heard one of these on the radio a long time ago, but I don’t remember which. [MTA - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M.T.A). ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/18 "2013-05-12T06:21:32Z")
The question is unanswerable, since the song clearly says “his fate is still unlearned.” ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/19 "2013-05-12T07:16:23Z")
My word. I heard this some time before 1970, I don’t think I ever heard it since…! ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 10:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070/20 "2013-05-12T10:45:09Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > I heard this some time before 1970, I don’t think I ever heard it since…! Me too! But the really weird thing is that…we both recognized the song and remembered it well enough to click on this thread. … Why does a totally vacuous song like this stay in your mind for 4 decades? It’s a little creepy, actually. (-chappachula, who has never even been to Boston. But still wants to vote for George O’Brien.) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-did-he-ever-return-charlie-from-the-song-m-t-a/658070.md?page=2)