# Well, look who just got elected to the European Parliament! (BNP members) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 8, 2009, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061 "2009-06-08T02:26:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Marienee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@Marienee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marienee)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/21 "2009-06-08T11:23:02Z")
> [@G. Odoreida](#): > > With respect, I think it’s much, much more complicated than that. For one thing, the BNP are today talking about African immigrants who are just as likely to be Christian. Racism in Europe is just as likely be directed against black people whose grandparents moved from the Caribbean in the 1950s, or Hindus or Sikhs. Muslims have been living in Britain for many decades (so they’re not all ‘immigrants’.) I am not aware of evidence that there are ‘tensions with Muslim immigrants’; there might be some but it is in the interest of the BNP for people to get an exaggerated idea of such tensions. In Holland this bothers me, too. There is a fair bit of ire here in the south directed at “immigrants” and problems associated with them. A fair number of these immigrants appear to me to have been born here as were their parents. Last month in a magazine I read there was an article in which a fellow of Moroccan origin said something to the effect that “We don’t have to act like the Dutch, we should come forward with our culture and be proud of it,”. In the letter column the following month were some fairly sharply worded responses about people who come here and then don’t want to integrate and how they should just go home. But the original interviewee was born in Holland, he is as Dutch as the guy saying he should go home. Only darker. He is home. And the PVV wants to ban polish workers from coming to Holland, which really surprised me. So anybody who thinks it’s really about islam/muslim immigrants had better look again. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/22 "2009-06-08T13:01:02Z")
Yes, the whole argument about “integration” is pretty bogus, given there will never, ever be meaningful consensus on what it is we actually have to integrate to. Finding examples of white people refusing to integrate into whatever other whites regard as the norm is so easy that it renders the whole discussion pointless. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/23 "2009-06-08T15:03:19Z")
This is what happens with proportional representation. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/24 "2009-06-08T15:17:49Z")
So it’s John Cleese’s fault? ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/25 "2009-06-08T15:18:37Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > This is what happens with proportional representation. No, this is what happens when people don’t vote. If a couple of thousand people had have come out and thrown a vote to the greens the cunt would not have been elected. The first past the post system you lot use for general elections is a system that is very unfair. The Lib Dems for example get a much higher %age of the vote than they have in actual MP’s. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/26 "2009-06-08T15:41:00Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > No one in his right mind is concerned that “they’ll take over and bring Sharia law !” (nor have I heard it expressed by our very own National Front, to tell you the truth, but then I don’t exactly go out and seek their opinion). I’ve heard that claim from American right wingers however, including some on this board. That the Muslims will take over and impose Islamic law over the whole world unless we take a hard line blah blah blah. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/27 "2009-06-08T15:41:33Z")
Earlier this morning I added “(BNP members)” to the thread title at the OP’s request. Then I went to a meeting and forgot to mention it here. Now you know. **Gfactor** Pit Moderator ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/28 "2009-06-08T15:42:27Z")
This is what happens when you have a media that routinely demonises immigrants and asylum seekers and those that take issue with this are dismissed as the “loony left”. ---
**Author:** ![Nanoda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Nanoda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanoda)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/29 "2009-06-08T18:07:53Z")
> [@scifisam2009](#): > > I’ve realised that my thread title wasn’t specific enough. Would it be possible for a mod to add ‘(BNP members)’ or somesuch to the thread title? Of course, this board is mostly Americans, and I don’t know if most of you would have heard of the BNP or the British National Party, so that might not be terribly informative either. I can say that I have, but only through the [podcast](http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/audio_video/podcasts/the_bugle/) of Jon Oliver and Andy Zaltzman’s [The Bugle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bugle). The comedic drubbing they attract aside, the BNP don’t sound like particularly nice people. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/30 "2009-06-08T18:29:12Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > So it’s John Cleese’s fault? The Straight Dope has taken Umbrage (no surprise there.) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/31 "2009-06-08T18:35:55Z")
[QUOTE=Nanoda] I can say that I have, but only through the podcast of Jon Oliver and Andy Zaltzman’s The Bugle. The comedic drubbing they attract aside, the BNP don’t sound like particularly nice people. [/QUOTE] Well, here are the juicy bits of their [constitution](http://bnp.org.uk/Constitution%209th%20Ed%20Sep%202005.pdf): > [@](#): > > (b) The British National Party stands for the preservation of the national and ethnic > character of the British people and is wholly opposed to any form of racial > integration between British and non-European peoples. It is therefore committed > to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration and to restoring, by > legal changes, negotiation and consent, the overwhelmingly white makeup of the > British population that existed in Britain prior to 1948. > [@](#): > > 1. The British National Party represents the collective National, Environmental, Political, Racial, Folkish, Social, Cultural, Religious and Economic interests of the indigenous > Anglo-Saxon, Celtic and Norse folk communities of Britain and those we regard as > closely related and ethnically assimilated or assimilable aboriginal members of the > European race also resident in Britain. Membership of the BNP is strictly defined > within the terms of, and our members also self define themselves within, the legal > ambit of a defined ‘racial group’ this being ‘Indigenous Caucasian’ and defined ‘ethnic > groups’ emanating from that Race as specified in law in the House of Lords case of > Mandla V Dowell Lee (1983) 1 ALL ER 1062, HL. > 2. The indigenous British ethnic groups deriving from the class of ‘Indigenous > Caucasian’ consist of members of: i) The Anglo-Saxon Folk Community; ii) The Celtic > Scottish Folk Community; iii) The Scots-Northern Irish Folk Community; iv) The > Celtic Welsh Folk Community; v) The Celtic Irish Folk Community; vi) The Celtic > Cornish Folk Community; vii) The Anglo-Saxon-Celtic Folk Community; viii) The > Celtic-Norse Folk Community; ix) The Anglo-Saxon-Norse Folk Community; x) The > Anglo-Saxon-Indigenous European Folk Community; xi) Members of these ethnic > groups who reside either within or outside Europe but ethnically derive from them. Ironically enough, that House of Lords court case they cite was something of a landmark in British race relations (and did not exactly go the BNP’s way). ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/32 "2009-06-08T18:43:40Z")
England has REALLY gone downhill in the past few years. I mean, they don’t even have knights anymore, for Christ’s sake. No jousts and tournaments, no lavish banquets filled with roasted meats and succulent desserts. No more doublets and robes of the most sumptuous velvet and silk; [fashion](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1e/Richard_Sackville_Earl_of_Dorset.jpg) has completely gone out the window. And the codpieces! For God’s sake, where are the codpieces! FUCK ENGLAND. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/33 "2009-06-08T19:38:16Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > England has REALLY gone downhill in the past few years. … But you can get a really nice curry in England now, and the jerk chicken is really good, too. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/34 "2009-06-08T20:00:53Z")
> [@lavenderviolet](#): > > \This makes me appreciate the two party system we have in America. For all its faults, it works against granting a soapbox to the crazy extremists.\ Of course! Only mainstream, accepted ways of thinking should have a voice in our country. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/35 "2009-06-08T21:13:13Z")
Two seats, out of how many? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/36 "2009-06-08T21:16:30Z")
626 MEPs in total. 87 from the UK. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/37 "2009-06-08T22:10:12Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > Two seats, out of how many? In addition to the above: 943,000 votes in England/Scotland/Wales, with a turnout of 15 million. (And an electorate of 44 million, to really put the idiots in perspective - I have far more sympathy with non-voters than in any other election I’ve voted in.) If you really want an idiotically small-minded and ignorant view of the world, then go and look at the BNP’s solution for the Northern Ireland problem. It’s as if somebody had said “Go and design a policy which _nobody_ in the island of Ireland actually wants”. (Edit: I left ‘problem’ unquoted because, for the simplistic BNP definition of Britishness, Ulster is a bit awkward. I mean it very much as a problem from the BNP perspective.) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061/38 "2009-06-08T22:24:55Z")
They’ve got a big tent approach- they allow Anglo-Saxon, Norse AND Celtic peoples to join. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-look-who-just-got-elected-to-the-european-parliament-bnp-members/499061.md?page=1)