# Well, the fucking religion of peace strikes again **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 12, 2003, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818 "2003-05-12T23:20:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/121 "2003-05-13T15:07:11Z")
By your definition therefore, all religions are therefore religions of violence, because you can guarantee that at any given time, some fucker will be doing something nasty and attributing it to their deity/ies. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/122 "2003-05-13T15:08:43Z")
Of _the_ new generation of Muslims? No, **gobear**. The hearts of a few mindless shitheads. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/123 "2003-05-13T15:23:41Z")
Nice try on rewriting reality, there, wring. So, I guess the next time something terrible happens and the culprit is Black, it’s okay to rail against all Blacks; if the culprit is Jewish, it’s okay to rail against all Jews; if the culprit is American, it’s okay to rail against all Americans? If you don’t see what the poin is there, then you are one of the most stupid people on this planet. I don’t suppose you have a self-correction procedure, hey? I recommend you grab your stopped-up ears and pull your head out of your ass for a start. Jackass. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/124 "2003-05-13T15:29:13Z")
**Monty** - as anyone can note in this thread (or any other) well, anyone except you, apparently, I also suggested to those posting here that to categorize “all Muslims” as being responsible wasn’t accurate, fair or in general a ‘not good thing’. however, I didn’t call the OP a fucker etc, while doing so, since, I noted that he was posting under extreme duress. I **did** note that you did, but not under duress. it was that behavior that I (and others) have noted to you as jerklike. And you suggest that I’m re-writing? **Monty** seriously - if lots of people are suggesting that you come off as a jerk, it just _may be possible_ that they’re correct. But since you disagreed with **Lynn** suggesting it, I grant you that you’ll ignore my assesment as well. ---
**Author:** ![manwithaplan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@manwithaplan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manwithaplan)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/125 "2003-05-13T15:41:47Z")
Sorry about the hijack but **Twisty** , sectarian atrocities in the north say nothing about the role of religion in the conflict. I wouldn’t go so far as to say that religion is not a factor but it’s importance is more in sharpening the division between the communities over the centuries than as a prime motivator in the modern phase of the conflict. Now that those divisions have crystallised, religion’s role has dwindled. If anything, with some obvious exceptions, the churches have been a moderating (sorry about the pun) influence on the various factions. Certainly, comparisons between the north and islamic terrorism aren’t very illuminating. Also, don’t fall into the trap of believing that attacks on the security forces by republicans were somehow more noble than the sectarian response from loyalists. The fact that the security forces were 90% plus protestant meant that that community was suffering enormously, particularly in the early and mid seventies. Attacks on the security forces were attacks on the protestant community. They struck back but their opponents didn’t offer them the convenience of wearing uniforms - so they developed the ‘any taig will do’ philosophy. This was obviously reprehensible but it was also expedient in the face of the assault on their community. ---
**Author:** ![Tenspace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/50afbb/32.png) [@Tenspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tenspace)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/126 "2003-05-13T15:44:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jackelope \* > \*\*That’s not the point being made. The point is that this is apples-to-oranges: There are no training camps where mothers are clandestinely trained to kill their children because “God told them to.” > > Abortion-doctor shooters, maybe. Psycho-killer moms, no. \*\* She didn’t need a training camp. Instructions on how to kill your children can be found in god’s little instruction manual, the Bible. Tenspace ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/127 "2003-05-13T15:45:49Z")
I agree with you, but I just wanted to show a few examples of Loyalist attacks that were motivated by religion. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/128 "2003-05-13T15:46:08Z")
Sorry for what you’re going through **Testy**. I don’t blame you for being upset at first but am glad to also see that you’re starting to put things more in perspective. I would be curious as to any comments or observations you can make regarding the general feelings of others there that also had to undergo this experience, especially that of Muslims toward those that did this in the name of religion (if that was indeed the case). And obviously, any calming effect you can have on the attitudes of your Western coworkers toward Muslims as a whole, much like your apparent transformation, would be much appreciated. Our thoughts are with you, your family, your friends and coworkers. Be safe. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/129 "2003-05-13T15:48:22Z")
manhattan: > [@](#): > > Oh, and that McVeigh fellow was an atheist, so we better kill them, too. McVeigh’s “religion” was patriotism. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/130 "2003-05-13T15:56:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by hansel \* > \*\*As I recall, when they caught him, he was going on about how the U.S. was invading Iraq to kill muslims. He himself is a muslim. I don’t recall hearing anything else about him, and I expect he was simply a fairly disturbed individual who probably shouldn’t have been given grenades in the first place, and will spend the rest of his life in prison. \*\* IIRC, the soldier in question was to be court-martialed even before the attack. I seem to remember some suggestion that the attack was somehow supposed to clear him or cover something up or distract… Ya know, I don’t remember correctly at all. But I really do NOT think that was motivated by religion. ---
**Author:** ![manwithaplan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@manwithaplan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manwithaplan)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/131 "2003-05-13T16:06:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by TwistofFate \* > \*\*I agree with you, but I just wanted to show a few examples of Loyalist attacks that were motivated by religion. \*\* The point I’m trying to make is that they weren’t motivated by religion. They were motivated by the fact that the victims belonged to the nationalist community, who held (probably - I’m sure the perpetrators didn’t check) opposing views on the national question and had different cultural aspirations. Most importantly, they were from the ‘other side’. The religious association is little more convenient shorthand in the north nowadays. The Shankhill Butchers certainly did not kill their victims because they believed in transsubstantiation. Indeed, there is more differences in doctrine and practice between many of the protestant churches than there is between them and the RC. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/132 "2003-05-13T16:14:53Z")
I see your point. But I would count the criteria of which they selected their victims as part of their motivation. But I can see how it can be argues that it wouldn’t be. I certainly don’t subscribe to the view that the troubles are solely over religion, in fact I would say that Religion, for the last 40 years anyway, has had nothing more than a minor influence overall. but it is an aspect that can be considered, even though the current difficulties are more scocio-economic-political in nature. (try saying that after 6 pints of guinness and a kebab from the Sultan!) ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/133 "2003-05-13T16:16:28Z")
You know what I’d like to see? Christian fundamentalsts and Muslim fundamentalsts debating _each other_ without intelectuals like us being caught in the crossfire. I’ll give you a topic: Whose side was God on on Septermber 11th? ---
**Author:** ![green\_dragon\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/13edae/32.png) [@green\_dragon\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/green_dragon_1)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/134 "2003-05-13T16:21:43Z")
**Testy** , my deepest sympathy for what you and your friends, family and loved ones have had to go through. It sounds like you did the best you could in the circumstances and I was shocked to see the abuse and critisism you received here, even from the first few replies to the OP. Yes, your lashing-out at the Muslim world at large wasn’t appropriate or justified, but completely understandable in the circumstances - _no-one_ can keep a rational, objective head on their shoulders in the midst of such chaos, and shouldn’t be fucking lynched for it. All the best man, DC ---
**Author:** ![Testy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c37758/32.png) [@Testy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Testy)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/135 "2003-05-13T16:37:51Z")
it was in fact a racist (religionist?) OP and I regret painting with quite so broad a brush. On the other hand, as I discussed with **Collounsbury** today, it is going to be difficult to consider my Arabic friends (??) in quite the same way as previously. One family I am acquainted with was stalked through their compound by AK weilding terrorists after the initial blast, a friend of my daughter’s (a 14 year old girl) was shot, another friend opened the curtains in front of his sliding glass door just in time for the shockwave to propogate through the glass. He is now lacking an eye and has more stitches in his body than most people would believe. They say he’ll be out of ICU in a few days and my wife and I wound up calling his wife today. My daughter’s closest friend had only the comment that most people wouldn’t believe how much blood was in a person. She was in what is known locally as the Vinnell compound, it’s the one shown on the news with a three or four story building that has lost it’s front. So yes, if someone wants to accuse me of wanting revenge, very bloody and intense and way way over the top last night, they are entirely correct. I am now cooling off and trying to put this into perspective. The group that “needs killing” is shrinking slowly and in a few days will be limited to those that did this. Unfortunately, in Saudi Arabia that’s a large group. No one is sure how many people were involved in the raids last night but they were likely not the only ones involved. Planning and executing something like this requires many people other than just the ones doing the shooting. Planning, logistics, some kind of intelligence and many other areas are needed. My faith in the Saudi “security forces” is bordering on nil and I seriously doubt they will catch them all. All the best. Testy And best of all, my small girlfriend will be home in Canada in a couple of days. I’ll miss her. ---
**Author:** ![Testy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c37758/32.png) [@Testy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Testy)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/136 "2003-05-13T16:41:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by green\_dragon \* > \*\ ***Testy** , my deepest sympathy for what you and your friends, family and loved ones have had to go through. It sounds like you did the best you could in the circumstances and I was shocked to see the abuse and critisism you received here, even from the first few replies to the OP. Yes, your lashing-out at the Muslim world at large wasn’t appropriate or justified, but completely understandable in the circumstances - _no-one_ can keep a rational, objective head on their shoulders in the midst of such chaos, and shouldn’t be fucking lynched for it. > > All the best man, > DC \*\* Thank you for this, and my thanks to all the others that were so understanding when I certainly wasn’t. OK then. Now that I’ve got this off my chest. Could we get a mod or God or whoever to close this thing down? Lock it, delete it or whatever seems appropriate to you. Thanks and all the best. Testy ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/137 "2003-05-13T16:52:01Z")
Shit man, that’s unfuckingbelievable. I commend you for moderating your feelings so swiftly. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/138 "2003-05-13T16:53:13Z")
Hot damn if George W. Bush hasn’t actually [hit the nail directly on the head](http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/05/13/saudi.blast/index.html): > [@](#): > > These despicable acts were committed by killers whose only faith is hate. Thank-you, George, for that moment of clarity. And god bless, **Testy**. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818/139 "2003-05-13T17:34:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Testy \* > **OK then. Now that I’ve got this off my chest. Could we get a mod or God or whoever to close this thing down? Lock it, delete it or whatever seems appropriate to you.** God seems to be unavailable for thread closures today, so I’ll help him out. 🙂 Thanks for your reasonable responses “the day after”, Testy. You’re certainly not a bad egg, and generalisations in times of severe stress are certainly understandable. As long as they don’t last, and you’ve definitely shown that much. Good luck to you and yours. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/well-the-fucking-religion-of-peace-strikes-again/174818.md?page=6)