# Were Adam and Eve Jewish? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 8, 2009, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303 "2009-07-08T04:55:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bad\_Astronaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Bad\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bad_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2009, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/41 "2009-07-08T19:41:21Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > I was amused that the scholarly question was dismissed by a few people because the biblical stories were not true. And yet many people have no trouble discussing in depth the implications of other not-true stories such as the worlds of Star Trek etc.. I’m pretty sure those things are not discussed in GQ. Also, the phrasing of the original question leads me to believe that the OP sees the question as being about historical events moreso than an academic discussion of religious texts. Specifically: -no particular texts are specified -use of the phrase ‘historical Adam and Eve’ -the suggestion that A&E were African (obviously this would not have been considered at the time that Genesis, etc. were written, so it suggests applying modern discoveries to arrive at some kind of ‘true’ answer) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2009, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/42 "2009-07-08T20:28:07Z")
If we’re talking about the “historical” figures, then it’s possible that the OP is thinking of “Y chromosome Adam”, the most recent male-line ancestor of all humans, and “Mitochondrial Eve”, the most recent female-line ancestor of all humans. That is to say, everyone’s father’s father’s father’s … father’s father is Y-guy, and everyone’s mother’s mother’s mother’s … mother’s mother is Ms. Mitochondria. But the two of them lived at vastly different times and places, and are only remarkable at all because of the restriction to single-sex lineage: You can find a common ancestor of all humans much more recently, if you’re willing to include mothers and fathers in the same line. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/43 "2009-07-09T02:16:15Z")
If Adam was a Jew, who performed the Briss? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/44 "2009-07-09T02:17:12Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Well, it wouldn’t seem so incongruous if a half of humanity weren’t basing their God on some African/Middle Eastern God’s tribe and synthesizing it for illogical function. From this comment it would seem you are not seeking a simple GQ answer, but are more interested in some kind of debate. Off to GD. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/45 "2009-07-09T02:31:34Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > In the newer Christian sense, are they Jewish? You might as well ask if Mickey and Minnie Mouse are Jewish. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/46 "2009-07-09T04:36:25Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > My take (obviously not authoritative) is that Jews are the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (largely via Jacob’s son Judah, after whom Judaism was named). > > Hence, Adam and Eve don’t qualify. The Jews are descendants of Judah. The Israelites are the descendants of Israel, AKA Jacob (Abraham is also the ancestor of the Ismaelites, while Isaac is also the ancestor of the Edomites). Adam and Eve are neither. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/47 "2009-07-09T04:48:02Z")
> [@Duckster](#): > > If Adam was a Jew, who performed the Briss? Pre covanant that established circumcision (Noahs flood), I believe… ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/48 "2009-07-09T13:53:03Z")
I have no idea what the debate is here, but there is no question that, although the mythology of Adam & Eve is part of the Jewish lore, the mythological personages of Adam & Eve within that Myth were not “Jewish”. Within the context of Jewish mythology, Adam & Eve predate Judaism. Indeed, their descendant Noah was also not “Jewish” (although a prophet of God). That is why the “rules” laid down by God within the story of Noah are binding on all of humanity, whereas the rules particular to Jews are binding only on Jews (within Jewish mythology). It is for this reason that Judaism accepts that non-Jews who follow these “noahide” rules (or “righteous gentiles”) are fully equal in righteousness to the most observant Jew - they are following the rules as established by God, just as the righteous Jew is. A good _person_, though not Jewish, behaves as God expected Noah to behave. a good _Jew_ has extra duties, but fulfiling them does not earn him or her “extra points” with God. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/49 "2009-07-09T15:40:52Z")
Alessan: > [@](#): > > The Jews are descendants of Judah. The Israelites are the descendants of Israel, AKA Jacob I disagree that there is a difference between the modern term “Jew” and “Israelite.” Descendants from any of the tribes of Israel are properly referred to as Jews in the modern sense, because the name was applied based on the Roman-era name of Judea for the land where this people (primarily) lived, and for the practices they customarily engaged in as Judaism. Naturally, that itself comes from the ancient kingdom of Judah, which was politically distinct from the kingdom of Israel, that encompassed the ten “lost” tribes. But even that kingdom - and no doubt the tribes who mainly populated it were the majority, though not entirety, of returnees from the Babylonian exile - included more than only descendants of Judah. It included the tribe of Benjamin, and significant numbers of Levites. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/50 "2009-07-09T16:49:06Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > It included the tribe of Benjamin, and significant numbers of Levites. As well as the tribe of Simeon, which was in the Kingdom of Judah. ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2009, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/51 "2009-07-09T17:52:30Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > You might as well ask if Mickey and Minnie Mouse are Jewish. Even if you believe the Bible to be fiction, it’s still a valid question. Is Krusty the Clown Jewish? 🙂 Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/52 "2009-07-10T05:11:13Z")
> [@akennett](#): > > The difference between the two sets, though, is that outside a very extremely small number of completely crazy individuals, no one takes Star Trek, Star Wars, LotR, etc as seriously as quite a few otherwise rational people do with these religions. And even among those few, there aren’t people killing each other over slight differences in their views of these fictions – again, unlike religion. > > When we can marginalize the religious crazies like we can the sci-fi crazies, then you’ll have a much more valid point. Yes, but here’s what’s going to blow your mind! Star Trek, Star Wars, and LotR are all descendant of an obviated and pregnant Judeo-Christian Mother Tale. They are all influenced by “One God” rationale. Which author weren’t a Christian or a Jew? ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/53 "2009-07-10T05:24:40Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Yes, but here’s what’s going to blow your mind! > > Star Trek, Star Wars, and LotR are all descendant of an obviated and pregnant Judeo-Christian Mother Tale. They are all influenced by “One God” rationale. Which author weren’t a Christian or a Jew? Why would that be mind-blowing? It’s trite. ---
**Author:** ![akennett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee59a6/32.png) [@akennett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akennett)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/54 "2009-07-10T05:25:30Z")
So, they’re like religion, but without all the bullshit? Whoa… ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/55 "2009-07-10T05:25:32Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Yes, but here’s what’s going to blow your mind! > > Star Trek, Star Wars, and LotR are all descendant of an obviated and pregnant Judeo-Christian Mother Tale. They are all influenced by “One God” rationale. Which author weren’t a Christian or a Jew? I hear that Gene Roddenberry was a devotee of Huitzilopochtli, who sacrificed 100 NBC interns to keep DC Fontana from writing an episode where the Enterprise destroys the sun. But, no, my mind isn’t really blown. Most of the population of the US and Britain are Christian, with a lot of those who aren’t being Jewish, so you’d expect to see American and Britsh culture influenced by Christianity and Judaism. Besides, pretty much every religion has an origin story and “first parents”. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/56 "2009-07-10T05:56:05Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > Besides, pretty much every religion has an origin story and “first parents”. Yes, but those are specific to culture and “race” (speciation) just as the Adam and Eve story are specific to the Semitic Culture. Much has been obfuscated by the Christians. Why would we discount our own creation myths for another cultural idiom? ---
**Author:** ![Aelita\_Daystar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@Aelita\_Daystar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aelita_Daystar)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/57 "2009-07-10T11:42:41Z")
Now, I don’t believe the stories about Adam and Eve are necessarily true, particularly not literally, but going by what Genesis seems to say, you can’t say for certain that Adam and Eve were the first people. After all, where did the Cain’s wife come from? So, I don’t think it’s reasonable in this context to say that everyone who ever lived is descended from them. Instead it seems they were a special creation of Yahweh’s and due to certain events, they get kicked out of his garden. As to where Eden is supposed to be? It’s not clear, it seems to be in some undefined place where the Tigris, Euphrates, the Nile, and another river of indeterminate identity. As described it sounds like a fictional location. If you don’t want to be literal about it, you can go by where it’s based on, but that’s not quite certain either. As to the nationality of Adam and Eve? I don’t think you can assign one. The next best thing would be to see who their children become. If you go with the tradition that Noah’s sons went out and established the worlds races, then you’re kinda stuck. If you don’t accept that tradition, then they seem to end up becoming Chaldean. Abraham gets his call and leaves Chaldea and goes to Canaan. ---
**Author:** ![Sablicious](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@Sablicious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sablicious)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/58 "2009-07-10T11:51:25Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Were Adam and Eve Jewish? Were diplodocus and/or stegosaurus fossils ever found on Mount Sinai 😕 :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2009, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/59 "2009-07-11T04:22:42Z")
> [@Aelita\_Daystar](#): > > As to where Eden is supposed to be? It’s not clear, it seems to be in some undefined place where the Tigris, Euphrates, the Nile, and another river of indeterminate identity. As described it sounds like a fictional location. If you don’t want to be literal about it, you can go by where it’s based on, but that’s not quite certain either. Not the Nile. The Tigris, Euphrates, Gihon, and Pishon, but nobody’s been able to positively identify the Gihon or Pishon. ---
**Author:** ![Aelita\_Daystar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@Aelita\_Daystar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aelita_Daystar)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2009, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303/60 "2009-07-11T05:26:59Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > Not the Nile. The Tigris, Euphrates, Gihon, and Pishon, but nobody’s been able to positively identify the Gihon or Pishon. Oh, sorry, it seems you’re right. It hasn’t been positively identified. It does mention that the river encircling Kush or some such though. Hard to say what it could be, since there isn’t any rivers that “encircle Kush”. I suppose the Nile explanation is given since it’s so large and does pass through Kush. I wonder what the authors were referring to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-adam-and-eve-jewish/502303.md?page=4)