# Were Jesus disciples Roman ? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 16, 2005, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396 "2005-02-16T19:16:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Gymnopithys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@Gymnopithys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gymnopithys)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/1 "2005-02-16T19:16:25Z")
Most names of Jesus disciples are Indo-European, not Aramaic (the language of Jesus) or Semitic. Were they Roman ? ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/2 "2005-02-16T19:33:50Z")
What makes you think their names weren’t Semitic? Some of the names we use for them are Greek, but their names were certainly Hebrew. “James” is what we call the apostles named Jacob, Peter’s real name was Shimon (as was Simon’s), John is a common Hebrew name (Jonah), Bartholomew is bar-Tolomai, Matthew was named Levi, two apostles were named Judas, and Thomas is Aramaic. Philip and Andrew are Greek names, but there’s no reason to believe that they were the apostles’ real names, nor to believe that any of the apostles weren’t Jewish. ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/3 "2005-02-16T19:38:44Z")
No, they were Jewish. The names by which we know them are almost certainly not the names they used for themselves. The books of the New Testament were originally written in either Greek or Aramaic, and then translated into English centuries later. When writing in Greek, the Greek form of the name would be used (e.g. Petros), and then later given an English equivalent during translation. ---
**Author:** ![Gymnopithys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@Gymnopithys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gymnopithys)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/4 "2005-02-16T20:19:45Z")
> [@Fat Bald Guy](#): > > No, they were Jewish. The names by which we know them are almost certainly not the names they used for themselves. The books of the New Testament were originally written in either Greek or Aramaic, and then translated into English centuries later. When writing in Greek, the Greek form of the name would be used (e.g. Petros), and then later given an English equivalent during translation. Jesus said in his language(something like this) : You are Peter and on this stone (rock) I will build my church (Greek petros = stone, rock). It seems therefore that Jesus knew the meaning of petros ? **Nametag** : Why did they change their names, or who changed them ? ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/5 "2005-02-16T20:24:39Z")
Well, no, he didn’t. What he called Peter was _Cephas_, which is “Rock” in Aramaic. The Gospels were written in Greek because (a) Greek was the international language of the day and (b) most of the early church was in Greece, and _Cephas_ was translated to _Petros_. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/6 "2005-02-16T20:46:06Z")
> [@Gymnopithys](#): > > **Nametag** : Why did they change their names, or who changed them ? As was mentioned, the New Testiment was written originally in Greek, so Hebrew or Aramaic names would be given their Greek versions. So, Yeshuoa becomes Jesus, Judah becomes Judas, bar-Tolomai becomes Bartholomew, etc. In addition, some of the disciples, like Phillip, just had Greek names. That whole area had been taken over by Alexander the Great and had become Hellenized (That’s what the big Maccabee revolt was about…some Jews felt that the society had become too Hellenized). So, it wouldn’t be unusual for people to give their kids Greek names. It doesn’t neccesarily say anything about their background. ---
**Author:** ![spingears](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@spingears](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spingears)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/7 "2005-02-16T21:42:05Z")
> [@Gymnopithys](#): > > Most names of Jesus disciples are Indo-European, not Aramaic (the language of Jesus) or Semitic. Were they Roman ? The apostle Saul of Tarsus, later renamed Paul by the Lord was a bona fide Roman citizen. The twelve were all presumably Jews and were subjecta of Rome but not Roman citizens. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2005, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/8 "2005-02-16T22:04:51Z")
> [@spingears](#): > > The apostle Saul of Tarsus, later renamed Paul by the Lord… Wasn’t he named Paul by himself, rather than by God? It wasn’t unknown for Roman citizens who had non-Latin names to give themselves or be given Latin names, as well. ---
**Author:** ![Gymnopithys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@Gymnopithys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gymnopithys)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/9 "2005-02-17T08:19:01Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > What makes you think their names weren’t Semitic? Some of the names we use for them are Greek, but their names were certainly Hebrew. “James” is what we call the apostles named Jacob, Peter’s real name was Shimon (as was Simon’s), John is a common Hebrew name (Jonah), Bartholomew is bar-Tolomai, Matthew was named Levi, two apostles were named Judas, and Thomas is Aramaic. . _Are theologians certain that disciples names have been translated from Semitic to Latin and not vice-versa ? Do they have evidence for this ? Seems strange to me that some have Hebrew names, some Aramaic and some Greek._ _Was Peter’s name Shimon or Kephas ?_ . [/QUOTE] Philip and Andrew are Greek names, but there’s no reason to believe that they were the apostles’ real names, nor to believe that any of the apostles weren’t Jewish. [/QUOTE] _That’s hypothetical._ _What then was the first pope’s language ?_ ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/10 "2005-02-17T08:31:13Z")
[Here’s a list.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_popes#until_249) According to tradition, the Biblical Peter was the first Pope. ---
**Author:** ![Blake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@Blake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blake)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/11 "2005-02-17T13:29:12Z")
> [@spingears](#): > > The apostle Saul of Tarsus… Paul/Saul was _not_ an apostle. He never even met Jesus in the flesh nor did he ever claim to have. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/12 "2005-02-17T13:42:11Z")
Considering the fact that Jesus never left Judea in his entire life, where would he _meet_ non-Jewish Apostles? ---
**Author:** ![Genghis\_Bob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/45deac/32.png) [@Genghis\_Bob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Genghis_Bob)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/13 "2005-02-17T14:02:42Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > Paul/Saul was _not_ an apostle. He never even met Jesus in the flesh nor did he ever claim to have. But he considered himself one. He introduces himself as "Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus called to be an apostle. . . " (Romans). I think, but don’t have the time to look it up right now, that he believed he had met the risen Jesus on the road to Damascus, and so was personally called by Jesus; thus making him an apostle. Or am I just reading in? ---
**Author:** ![Askia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Askia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askia)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/14 "2005-02-17T14:09:34Z")
Of course the apostles were Roman. How else would they get from place to place? : : ducks : : ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/15 "2005-02-17T15:01:26Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > Paul/Saul was _not_ an apostle. He never even met Jesus in the flesh nor did he ever claim to have. After Jesus’ death the eleven apostles met together and chose Matthias as a replacement for Judas Iscariot (Acts 1: 15-26). Others referred to in the New Testament as apostles who were not in the original 12 are Paul, Barnabus and James. ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/16 "2005-02-17T15:03:33Z")
> [@Fat Bald Guy](#): > > After Jesus’ death the eleven apostles met together and chose Matthias as a replacement for Judas Iscariot (Acts 1: 15-26). Others referred to in the New Testament as apostles who were not in the original 12 are Paul, Barnabus and James. That’s not referring to James, the brother of John (who was one of the original 12), but James the brother of Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/17 "2005-02-17T15:14:06Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Considering the fact that Jesus never left Judea in his entire life, where would he _meet_ non-Jewish Apostles? Bunch of Greek cities in the Gallillee and Samaria at the time. Sepphoris, the cities of the Decapolis, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/18 "2005-02-17T18:08:45Z")
> [@Captain Amazing](#): > > Bunch of Greek cities in the Gallillee and Samaria at the time. Sepphoris, the cities of the Decapolis, etc. Plus the trip to Egypt as a child. Although He wouldn’t have met any apostles there. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/19 "2005-02-17T18:26:41Z")
> [@Captain Amazing](#): > > Bunch of Greek cities in the Gallillee and Samaria at the time. Sepphoris, the cities of the Decapolis, etc. Granted. But why would a Jew, preaching to Jews, hang out with a bunch of Goyim? Wouldn’t that damage his credibility? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2005, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396/20 "2005-02-17T19:40:57Z")
> [@](#): > > But why would a Jew, preaching to Jews, hang out with a bunch of Goyim? Wouldn’t that damage his credibility? Perhaps, but then, so would hanging out with tax collectors, lepers, and prostitutes (Matthew was a tax collector; I don’t know of any specifics of prostitutes among the close associates of Jesus). Jesus was apparently unconcerned with loss of credibility from associating with undesirables. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-jesus-disciples-roman/290396.md?page=2)