# Were the Dixie Chicks wrong? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 18, 2003, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157 "2003-03-18T00:40:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![kniz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@kniz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kniz)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2003, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/81 "2003-03-18T22:36:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*As a matter of fact, I actually find it possible to enjoy the music of musicians who disagree with me politically. Ted Nugent, for instance, says stupid, insulting things about liberals all the time, but I can still rock out to “Stranglehold,” or “Cat Scratch Fever.” One of my favorite bands ever is Metallica and their frontman, James Hetfield has made conservative statements both in his songs and in interviews. Conversely, I can totalllly agree with a liberal artist politically, but think that their music sucks ass. (Madonna comes to mind) > > I could say the same about actors. Mel Gibson is about as right-wing as it gets, but I still dig the _Mad Max_ movies, and i’m really looking forward to seeing _Passion_, a film he’s directing about Jesus. There are also liberal actors who make crappy movies (Madonna, once again, springs to mind)\*\* So what is your point? You don’t mind, but other people do and they have as much right to their opinions as you do to yours. Nobody says you shouldn’t listen to “Cat Scratch Fever”, but nobody says you should either. > [@](#): > > **I judge artists by their art. Their art is either good or it sucks. Their politics have nothing to do with it.** Is that supposed to show your superiority? > [@](#): > > \*\*One thing’s for sure, no matter how much I disliked a musician, artistically or politically, I would never do anything so white trash as to run over CD’s with a tractor. \*\* Would you run over them with a BMW? More to the point, do you think it is cool to burn the flag? If so what is the difference? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2003, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/82 "2003-03-18T22:59:30Z")
“Book burning” implies that a group is gathering books, often from unwilling sources like libraries, and then staging a public bonfire. If someone wants to destroy their own property, whether by burning it or running over it with a tractor, I really don’t see a problem. That includes flags, copies of the Constitution, and nude pictures of the SCOTUS. I have thrown books away, before. Not often, but a few times. I don’t see that as different from publicly destroying the books. Julie ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2003, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/83 "2003-03-18T23:35:53Z")
> [@](#): > > **kniz** said: > So what is your point? You don’t mind, but other people do and they have as much right to their opinions as you do to yours. Nobody says you shouldn’t listen to “Cat Scratch Fever”, but nobody says you should either. I was responding to this statement by **Sam Stone** > [@](#): > > you liberals sneering at her fans would probably do the same thing if a musical artist you listened to came out and said, “Liberals are all stupid, bigoted jerks.” And I wouldn’t blame you. Why should you pay money to listen to someone who sneers at your values? He mad an accusation which I refuted. What’s the problem? > [@](#): > > Is that supposed to show your superiority? Yes. > [@](#): > > Would you run over them with a BMW? More to the point, do you think it is cool to burn the flag? If so what is the difference? I wouldn’t run over them with anything. I don’t give a rat’s ass about flag burning one way or the other (beyond the belief that it should be legal). The difference is that flag burning is an _exercise_ of free speech. CD or book burning is a _suppression_ of free speech. ---
**Author:** ![Texican](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ebca7d/32.png) [@Texican](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Texican)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2003, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/84 "2003-03-18T23:49:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*Thanks, **beagledave** and **twit**. > > Well, if that’s all she said then I think she was wrong to apologize. What the hell is wrong with people? It’s not like she criticized “America” or “the troops” or anything, she took a little shot at GWB. So effin’ what? Did any of these sister raping hillbillies ever protest anyone who criticized Clinton. There was a story on Drudge a couple of days ago about a guy who got assaulted at a rodeo because he didn’t stand up for that stupid Leo Greenwood song. The jingoism hasn’t really gotten way out of hand. \*\* Sister raping hillbillies? Diogenes, I never really liked you because you are a foolish socialist. But now I truly hate you. You are a bigoted idiot, and if I had time I’d start a pit thread for you. On the other hand, I’m glad for your type because you are a perfect example of what is wrong with those of your political stripe. I honestly believe you do more for those on my side than you do for those on yours. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/85 "2003-03-19T01:06:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\* > > I wouldn’t run over them with anything. I don’t give a rat’s ass about flag burning one way or the other (beyond the belief that it should be legal). The difference is that flag burning is an _exercise_ of free speech. CD or book burning is a _suppression_ of free speech. \*\* Hardly. Those folks were burning their own property to make a point. If they’d looted a record store and burned CD’s by artists whose political views they hated, yes, \* then \* they’d be guilty of suppressing free speech. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/86 "2003-03-19T01:22:06Z")
Well if they were burning their own property then they really are morons. The DC’s already have their money. What do they care what these idiots do with the CD’s after they buy them? ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/87 "2003-03-19T01:39:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\* > I suppose it could be argued that “white trash” has a classist connotation since it originally was applied to people who were poor, unsophisticated and uneducated. The way it’s used now, though, (in my own experience of the deep south) is that it refers to a kind of backwards, bigoted and willfully ignorant mentality. It doesn’t have to mean poor and uneducated. Jesse Helms, for instance, is inveterate white trash. \*\* Well, your “experience” of the deep south must have been very different from mine, and I’ve lived in that region all my life. The term “white trash” as well as the closely related term “trailer trash” are commonly used as demeaning epithets for low income whites. They are often applied with little discretion and definitely not are limited to people of a certain “mentality” without regard to economic or social class. Nor are those terms limited to the deep south. At college I heard Northerners refer to someone as “white trash” simply because she spoke with a southern accent. Behind my back, I’ve been called “white trash” by classmates at college simply for listening to hillbilly music and “trailer trash” by a co-worker after mentioning that I had looked into the possibility of buying a used mobile home. The second time I sat the jerk down with our supervisor and informed him I would file a formal complaint against him if it ever happened again. Despite what you’ve said here, the term “white trash” has strong connotations of class and ethnic bigotry, and you should not throw that term around as lightly as you’ve been doing. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/88 "2003-03-19T01:44:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*Well if they were burning their own property then they really are morons. The DC’s already have their money. What do they care what these idiots do with the CD’s after they buy them? \*\* Excuse me, but you acused them of \* suppressing free speech, \* not simply of being morons. I believe I have demonstrated that you were wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/89 "2003-03-19T01:47:55Z")
I think it shows a childish intlorance of speech they don’t agree with. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/90 "2003-03-19T02:09:12Z")
“Childish intolerance” or not, \* it was not suppression of free speech. \* That was a wild accusation utterly unsupported by the facts. Burning a CD by the Dixie Chicks to express your displeasure is no different than burning a flag to protest a war. It may or may not be a foolish thing to do, but it is \* not \* suppression of free speech. I will pursue this conversation with you no further. ---
**Author:** ![t-keela](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a3d4f5/32.png) [@t-keela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/t-keela)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/91 "2003-03-19T02:41:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Texican \* > \*\*Sister raping hillbillies? Diogenes, I never really liked you because you are a foolish socialist. But now I truly hate you. You are a bigoted idiot, and if I had time I’d start a pit thread for you. On the other hand, I’m glad for your type because you are a perfect example of what is wrong with those of your political stripe. I honestly believe you do more for those on my side than you do for those on yours. \*\* What do you expect from a half-breed coonass, wanna be Texan? 😉 who admits he was raised with a bunch of bigots and halfwits. He can’t grasp the difference between knowledge and fucking “Wango Tango”…get over it, he’s just fishin’ for a fight. Back to the OP I don’t like GW myself, besides he’s about as much of a Texan as his dad for Christ’s sake. The problem as I see it is that the D/C (not you Diogenes) got caught up in the moment and in an attempt to win over the crowd said something without thinking of the consequences of her actions. Many of their fans in Texas and abroad, put GW in office and being passionate people themselves aren’t going to support someone who speaks out against their guy. Worse still, is the recanting of the slur, makes her look like either a liar or a coward or stupid, possibly all three. I’ll never buy another CD by them…wait, hmm, I never have, so I guess it doesn’t matter. I think if everyone went out and bought the Dixie Chicks music and destroyed every CD they can get their hands on. It would just make the D/C even more wealthy. Damn, I wish I had a book or CD out so I could do that. Get everyone pissed at me so they would run out and buy ALL the copies out there. People can be ignorant. BTW that’s not a crime either. Right Diogenes? and chill out okay, I’d rather listen to Nugent too.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BoBettie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4af34b/32.png) [@BoBettie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BoBettie)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/92 "2003-03-19T03:19:55Z")
Can I jump in here and say that I think there is a big difference between book burning and destroying your own CDs. Isn’t book burning traditionally an activity designed to stop a book from being read by other people? In other words, the books are pulled from a library or school and burned in order to deprive anyone from reading them? How is burning a copy of your own CD the same? It’s meant as a message to the artist: You are now worth so little to me that I will never listen to you again, as is proved by my public destruction of a CD of your creation. It’s meant to send a powerful message to them. Apparently they got that message and the lead singer recanted (which is such a shame, IMHO). Much ado about nothing, IMHO. Were they wrong? Only in taking back what was said. If she meant it, she should have just said so. Otherwise kept her mouth shut. This reminds me of when Sinead O’Connor ripped up the Pope’s picture on SNL. Talk about an uproar over nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/93 "2003-03-19T03:25:40Z")
> [@](#): > > **t-keela** said: > What do you expect from a half-breed coonass, wanna be Texan? who admits he was raised with a bunch of bigots and halfwits. He can’t grasp the difference between knowledge and fucking “Wango Tango”…get over it, he’s just fishin’ for a fight. Hey, I ain’t no Texan wanna be. Texas Aggie jokes were a part of my childhood. I probably mde my family sound worse than they were. They have their good points too. My late grandfather was an excellent cajun chef. My racist grandmother got me interested in music and helped me learn to play piano and guitar. I have some cousins here and there who are pretty normal. It makes me cringe, though, when I’m having a nice conversation with Aunt Zephla Mae or Uncle Emmit and they ask me don’t I think it’s disgusting for a white girl to be kissing a ni\*\*er. I didn’t really grow up with them after I was about seven or eight, btw. My dad was in the Air Force and we moved around a lot. So mostly what I saw of my mom’s side of the family was holidays, summer gatherings etc. I went back there after high school, lived there for a year going to college and then joined the Navy to get away from it. > [@](#): > > People can be ignorant. BTW that’s not a crime either. Right Diogenes? and chill out okay, I’d rather listen to Nugent too. I know, you’re right. I never said it was a crime…it’s just…I _know_ those people. Bossier City is practically part of Shreveport. I know the kind of idiots who would go to rally like that. I 'm not saying they don’t have the right to do it, but I have th right to mock them for it. As much of an ass as Nugent can be politically, I do agree that his music is much better than the DC’s 😉 ---
**Author:** ![t-keela](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a3d4f5/32.png) [@t-keela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/t-keela)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/94 "2003-03-19T04:11:00Z")
Y’all joke about Aggies too? No shit…sounds like Texas to me. Damn man, Aggies joke about themselves, [http://halife.com/files/aggie.html](http://halife.com/files/aggie.html) As far as the racist remarks go. You are making yourself look really bad. Bossier City isn’t two hours from me. I know the Bubba’s you’re talking about. But not all fans of truck and tractor pulls and 4wd’ers are like that. So, I’d get off of that. The OP was whether the Chicks are wrong in their comment on GWB. No, not wrong just ignorant for not thinking about the consequences of their words. Just like their fans are not wrong, just ignorant because their actions make them look as bad as the chicks. Almost like some Dopers one might say… Peace ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/95 "2003-03-19T04:43:03Z")
> [@](#): > > **t-keela** said: > As far as the racist remarks go. You are making yourself look really bad. Bossier City isn’t two hours from me. I know the Bubba’s you’re talking about. But not all fans of truck and tractor pulls and 4wd’ers are like that. So, I’d get off of that. > > The OP was whether the Chicks are wrong in their comment on GWB. No, not wrong just ignorant for not thinking about the consequences of their words. Just like their fans are not wrong, just ignorant because their actions make them look as bad as the chicks. Almost like some Dopers one might say… Point’s well taken, **t**. I didn’t mean to imply that _all_ the Bubbas are like that. I only meant to insult the ones who made a big deal out of nothing. I think I have some subconscious embarrassment about my own background in there somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/96 "2003-03-19T14:26:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > They are _not_ both based on race. The "n’ word is based on race. “White trash” was originally based on economic status, and is now used to describe a certain attitude. This is obviously bullshit. The term “white trash” is based on race. This is obvious to any reasonable person. > [@](#): > > Cite? Also, black people didn’t _invent_ the term, and I would WAG that most black people don’t use it. Listen to rap music much? > [@](#): > > You don’t like the word “invent?” How about originate? The term _originated_ in the ante-bellum south. Is this another WAG? Or are you gonna respond to my request for a cite? Even if it is true, so what? If the term “nigger” or “spic” had origins with black or hispanic people would they be less offensive? > [@](#): > > I disagree. “nigger” is derogatory and racist while “white trash” is merely derogatory. This is just silly. If you were calling someone simply “trash” this might make sense. But that first word “white”, I think may have a little something to do with race! :smack: * * * BTW, lets take a moment to re-visit some of my points here which you have just completely ignored: You said “I would never destroy CD’s or burn books under any circumstances.” To which I responded by asking what you would do with a “Screwdriver” CD if I gave you one, or a book filled with child porn. If you wouldn’t keep them or give them to a friend to enjoy, then you are admitting that there are circumstances in which you would destroy CD’s or books. You have said that the fans of the dixie chicks are: sister raping hillbilliies cowardly stupid hypocritical childish I will ask again, what makes them so? The fact that they are simply “white trash” from the south? I fail to see how this is different than saying that Snoop Dogg’s fans are: violent criminal thugs Because they are all “niggers”. If saying this about Snoop’s fans would be abhorrant to you then why isn’t saying the same things about the Dixie Chicks bothersome? Your repeated assertion that book burning is the same thing as fans destroying Dixie Chicks CD’s is stupid. Everyone seems to see that except for you. In an attempt to deflect, **you** have brought up the notion of “those who are against the war are accused of being against the troops.” No on in this thread has said this except for you. You said “I want the troops to come home before they get gassed.” I still want to know if this is an admission from you that Saddam has weapons of mass destruction. Are you conceding that such weapons do exist, and that he has been hiding them from the inspectors all along? If not, what did you mean by that? And, I still love that gem about accusing the POTUS of “wanting to kill our troops”. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/97 "2003-03-19T15:11:31Z")
I would never accept your Skrewdriver CD or your kiddie porn in the first place, but there’s a difference between tossing one book or CD in the trash and having a big public, grandstanding rally with a bunch of other ignorant yahoos to destroy them en masse. I have tried to clarify that not _all_ fans of the Dixie Chicks are cowardly, childish, stupid, hypocritical, sister-raping hillbillies, only the ones that felt the need to go to CD burnin’ party. What makes them so is that they are so close-minded and intolerant that they can’t abide a country singer who doesn’t love their dumb-ass president. > [@](#): > > I fail to see how this is different than saying that Snoop Dogg’s fans are: > violent > criminal > thugs If any of Snoop Dogg’s fans behave like violent, criminal thugs then that’s what they are, not all of them, just the ones who are violent, or criminals or thugs. The same true of the dipshits at the rally. They are _behaving_ like trash. > [@](#): > > In an attempt to deflect, you have brought up the notion of “those who are against the war are accused of being against the troops.” No on in this thread has said this except for you. I was disparaging the motives of the asswipes in the OP who equated any criticism of their fucktard, unelected president as criticism of “the troops.” > [@](#): > > You said “I want the troops to come home before they get gassed.” > > I still want to know if this is an admission from you that Saddam has weapons of mass destruction. Are you conceding that such weapons do exist, and that he has been hiding them from the inspectors all along? If not, what did you mean by that? > > And, I still love that gem about accusing the POTUS of "wanting to kill our troops I don’t know if Saddam has anything at all, but if he does, then Bush has just guaranteed that they will be used on Americans. Governor Bush has wrecklessly and needlessly put troops in harm’s way for his own selfish political gain. That makes him responsible for any harm that comes to them. He is abusing and misusing his powers as CiC. It is an act of pure corruption. It is an amoral act by a man who has no respect for the lives of either Americans or Iraqis. And let’s not forget that this is a guy who _deserted_ his country when it was time for _him_ to serve. ---
**Author:** ![DaddyMack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dc4da7/32.png) [@DaddyMack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaddyMack)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/98 "2003-03-19T15:24:34Z")
if you mean wrong in that she was not ashamed then who are we to say she was, she said she was. If you mean wrong as in she should not have said it then yes she was wrong to speak agains her country in such a manner. Just like the people in Iraq would be wrong for speaking against Sadaam and would suffer the concequences. If you mean wrong as in was it illegal, then no she has every right to say what she wants. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/99 "2003-03-19T15:30:50Z")
> [@](#): > > If you mean wrong as in she should not have said it then yes she was wrong to speak agains her country in such a manner. Just like the people in Iraq would be wrong for speaking against Sadaam and would suffer the concequences. Speaking against the president is not the same as speaking against the country. Was Rush Limbaugh speaking against his country for eight years? ---
**Author:** ![Fluffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Fluffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fluffy)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2003, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157/100 "2003-03-19T15:38:15Z")
I always thought that Natalie Maines was a stupid twat…I obviously don’t agree with her assinine comments about our commander in chief. And yes, what the Dixie Chicks did to “Landslide” is criminal!! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-the-dixie-chicks-wrong/162157.md?page=6)