# Were You taught the rule to correctly pronounce The (Thee and Thuh)? Do you use it? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 20, 2017, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359 "2017-10-20T11:00:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/21 "2017-10-20T14:54:07Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > There’s a joke here, but it may be too edgy for IMHO. Damn, it was funny, too. _There’s thuh little girl!_ ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/22 "2017-10-20T15:02:34Z")
I was never taught that and would not consider it an error. And I collect pedantic little usage quirks as a hobby. ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/23 "2017-10-20T15:09:45Z")
While the a/an difference appears in written English, the thee/thuh difference doesn’t. I was never taught it, and hearing it now (with a doctorate in linguistics), it makes me uncomfortable. Squashing native dialects is a squicky subject. In my own dialect, you’re as likely to pronounce it t’ as anything. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/24 "2017-10-20T15:14:42Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > This is the first time I’ve heard the rule, but when I tried saying a few words it seems that I do follow it. (I live in the UK for reference.) … > [@MrAtoz](#): > > I was never taught this as a rule (and I take the liberty of doubting that an explicit “rule” as such actually exists). I do tend to pronounce “the” in the ways described. Not because I’m following a rule, but just because those are the pronunciations that seem natural. … > [@TRC4941](#): > > Minnesotan here. I never heard that as being a rule like “a” and “an” which we were taught very early on. After reading the OP I tested myself and found that I follow the rule without even having to try. Must be something that comes naturally when speaking. > [@What\_Exit](#): > > Is this a real rule? … The OP’s link references Merriam Webster as the source of “the rule” but what [they say](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/the) seems more descriptivist than prescriptivist. The BBC one I linked to is also with the intention I think of helping non-native speakers sound more like those who grew up speaking the language by _describing_ how native speakers actually talk, and is not pedantically prescriptivist in its goal. > [@Merriam Webster](#): > > definite article \ before consonants usually t͟hə , before vowels usually t͟hē , sometimes before vowels also t͟hə ; for emphasis before titles and names or to suggest uniqueness often ˈt͟hē \ For whatever reason it seems to be what many of us who grow up speaking English do, not because there is a rule about it but because it just happens to be the way we do it. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/25 "2017-10-20T15:18:26Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > _There’s thuh little girl!_ I will never live that down, will I?😃 ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/26 "2017-10-20T15:23:01Z")
American here and I was never taught the rule. Frankly I use them interchangeably depending on what sounds best in the context., and probably with even less thought than that. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/27 "2017-10-20T15:44:24Z")
Never heard of this, I think it’s becoming clear this “rule” is not universal and certainly doesn’t represent “proper” English. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/28 "2017-10-20T16:18:25Z")
I went to school in upstate New York, eastern Connecticut, Bergen County, New Jersey, and Broward County, Florida and I was never taught that rule, not even in later English classes where writing was stressed. I just figured out which sounded appropriate on my own. **Darren** , do you pronounce the band **The The** ’s name “thee thee”? ---
**Author:** ![araminty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b5e925/32.png) [@araminty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/araminty)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/29 "2017-10-20T16:31:56Z")
I became aware of this dichotomy because of choral singing. A good choral director will take notice of which pronunciation of “the” the text requires and standardise it. Most singers then make a note in their score. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/30 "2017-10-20T16:41:41Z")
Have heard of the rule, don’t use it. I don’t think it was explicitly taught to me in school. I can barely imagine a native Merliner ever pronouncing a hard E sound even if they were attempting to use the rule. I’m pretty sure in New York it’s always pronounce ‘Duh’, never heard anyone ever say “I’m heading out to ‘dee’ Island”. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/31 "2017-10-20T16:43:25Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I’m especially curious if non-native speakers are taught these rules in their English classes? > [@Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](#): > > Yes. I’m pretty sure it was even one of the very first things that I learnt. That’s exactly like I remember it, I learned it very early when I first took English lessons. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/32 "2017-10-20T16:47:29Z")
I was taught it in school early on, like second grade (Ohio, 1966). Part of phonics. Exactly as Grammar Girl explains it. I assumed it was universal and it’s surprising to find that it isn’t. This isn’t grammar and it isn’t really a prescriptivist matter. It’s meant for ease of pronunciation and flow in connected speech. It’s simply to make it easier for you, the speaker. Pretty much all languages make a difference between isolated words and the flow of connected speech. Sound changes caused by contact with an adjacent sound are called sandhi. Sandhi is Sanskrit for ‘putting together’, cognate of “synthesis.” Sanskrit was the first language where scholars described these changes systematically, so they get to name it. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/33 "2017-10-20T17:26:22Z")
Like others, I’ve never heard of this so-called “rule.” ---
**Author:** ![Rhiannon8404](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhiannon8404/32/17929_2.png) [@Rhiannon8404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhiannon8404)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/34 "2017-10-20T17:29:59Z")
I chose other, because I was taught this in school, but I do not do it now. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/35 "2017-10-20T17:35:10Z")
[quote=“araminty, post:29, topic:799359”] I became aware of this dichotomy because of choral singing. A good choral director will take notice of which pronunciation of “the” the text requires and standardise it.QUOTE] ^This. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/36 "2017-10-20T21:24:01Z")
Well, that explains it. In my Catholic school we all had to learn choir singing for Mass during schooldays. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/37 "2017-10-20T21:37:58Z")
Seems like around here, the common pronunciation sounds more like “theh”, which serves all purposes. When the noun begins with a vowel, the “-e” often just gets swallowed up in the vowel. We may have been taught the rule in school, but it has been so long, and I have already forgotten more than I ever knew. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/38 "2017-10-20T21:42:44Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > … I’m pretty sure in New York it’s always pronounce ‘Duh’, never heard anyone ever say “I’m heading out to ‘dee’ Island”. Chicago too . “Dee Bears”? No. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/39 "2017-10-20T21:58:58Z")
I’ve heard of this “rule,” but it’s not any real sort of rule. Yeah, I grew up being taught it. However, when people use “thuh” and “thee” pronunciations is not so much based on pronunciation of the next word in question most of the time in spontaneous speech. “Thee” tends to be used for emphasis and hesitated speech. (Like, “I’m going to theeeeee … theeeeee … uh, … theeeee store.”) I’ll try to find a cite on that. I remember hearing a long interview with a linguist about this on NPR about a decade back. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359/40 "2017-10-20T22:05:03Z")
But, yes, I do tend to pronounce it “thee” before vowel sounds, and “thuh” otherwise, but it’s not at all completely consistent. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/were-you-taught-the-rule-to-correctly-pronounce-the-thee-and-thuh-do-you-use-it/799359.md?page=3)