# West Lothian Question: Conservative-dominated England? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 3, 2010, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159 "2010-05-03T15:53:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/1 "2010-05-03T15:53:57Z")
Ever since the creation of the Scottish Parliament, there apparently has been an ongoing debate regarding the role of Scottish members of the U.K. Parliament. In other words, if Scots look to their own legislature, whose members are all elected from Scotland, for internal legislative questions, then why should Scottish members of the U.K. Parliament have a say in questions that do not affect Scotland, for examples, issues that might be considered England-only questions. I recently learned that this controversy is known as the “West Lothian Question.” Pretend that the solution to this question is one of these: 1. The creation of and English Parliament as a counterpart to the Scottish Parliament to handle issues internal to England, or 2. Scottish members of the U.K. Parliament would be barred from voting on issues that do not affect Scotland. My question is this: Would this basically give overwhelming control of English politics to the Conservative party? Does the Labor party depend on Scottish M.P.s to stay competitive? If so, how long would such Conservative dominance be likely to last? And a side question: How are seats in the U.K. Parliament allocated to England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland? Is it by population? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/2 "2010-05-03T18:23:30Z")
Maybe this is in the wrong forum. Is it more of a GQ? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/3 "2010-05-03T18:46:27Z")
Don’t MP’s from Scotland normally voluntarily desist from voting on internal English matters, anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/4 "2010-05-03T20:28:33Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Don’t MP’s from Scotland normally voluntarily desist from voting on internal English matters, anyway? So far as I can tell, only members of the Scottish National Party do this and they are considering changing their policy. ---
**Author:** ![RadicalPi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/radicalpi/32/9806_2.png) [@RadicalPi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RadicalPi)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/5 "2010-05-04T01:34:38Z")
Here is the breakdown of constituencies of the UK with the results from the election of 2005. As you can see, the bulk of the UK is in England. These results are all at the BBC web page: [BBC NEWS | UK | UK Politics | Results](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/vote_2005/constituencies/default.stm) As you can see, in this election, the Conservatives did not have a majority of the English “delegation” to Parliament. 650 100% Constituencies 529 81% England 59 9% Scotland 40 6% Wales 18 3% Northern Ireland England 286 54% Labour 193 36% Conservative 47 9% Liberal Democrat 1 0% IKHH 1 0% Respect Scotland 41 69% Labour 11 19% Liberal Democrat 6 10% Scottish National 1 2% Conservative Wales 29 73% Labour 4 10% Liberal Democrat 3 8% Conservative 3 8% Plaid Cymru 1 3% Independent Northern Ireland 9 50% DUP 5 28% Sinn Fein 3 17% SDLP 1 6% UUP ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/6 "2010-05-04T15:29:00Z")
That’s interesting. I gathered (perhaps incorrectly) that the Labor party was resisting the creation of an English parliament because it perceived that it would not be competitive politically. So why did Labor go for the regional parliament route (now stalled, I understand) instead? ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/7 "2010-05-04T15:54:15Z")
It certainly wouldn’t help Labour. If you look at the share of the vote in the last election, it was 35.4% Labour, Conservative 35.7% (yep, higher than Labour despite the seat count), LD 22.9% . A Conservative government might well tinker with constituency boundaries to make those results a bit more proportional, and then it would be even harder for Labour to control an England-only parliament. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/8 "2010-05-04T16:36:41Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Don’t MP’s from Scotland normally voluntarily desist from voting on internal English matters, anyway? No, they don’t. I can’t spot it in their manifesto, but if the Tories get in, I believe they’ll be enforcing it at Westminster. ---
**Author:** ![edinbourgeoise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@edinbourgeoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edinbourgeoise)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/9 "2010-05-07T15:02:26Z")
Actually, I believe SNP MPs have voluntarily abstained from votes on English/Welsh questions. However, in a coalition government that they supported, they would be unlikely to continue abstaining. It’s worth bearing in mind that the Con. party is not the monolithic behemoth it might wish to be. There are your anti-Europeans who would like to pull the UK out of the EU, there are extreme free-market enthusiasts, and there are modernisers like Cameron who want to appeal to a centre-right audience in order to get elected. Not all of these people are on the same page all the time, but they were seemingly willing to keep disagreements mostly under wraps provided Dave walked the election. He didn’t. As for an English parliament, the outcome rather depends on whether elections utilised the first-past-the-post system or some type of proportional representation. Support for PR seems quite strong in England although the Tories are historically opposed to it, mainly because it is highly likely to deprive them of absolute power. With a PR system the Tories might find borderline Conservatives defecting to the LibDems, since such a vote would be likely to contribute to the election of a representative rather than simply thrown away. Of course, other disaffected Conservatives could also vote UKIP. The English would have to make like Germans (and Scots and everybody else) and become adept at stable minority/coalition governments. Oh, the horror. With an FPTP system Conservatives might well dominate an English parliament. How long would this last? a) until internal disagreements caused the party to implode. This would be exceedingly cool but unlikely to happen with a leadership that actually delivered majorities. b) until middle-class English people see the Tories taking the hatchet to social programmes dear to their hearts, such as the NHS and child tax credits. An English parliament would be quite a spectacle. With PR I could see it breaking into a spectrum of right-wing parties including BNP, UKIP, and English Democrats. It would also provide an excellent forum for the airing of regional grievances, because it would take no time at all for the rest of England to tire of hearing from Southerners about how they pay for the whole country. I will be watching through binoculars safely across the border.😛 ---
**Author:** ![Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/10 "2010-05-07T15:14:49Z")
[QUOTE=edinbourgeoise] It would also provide an excellent forum for the airing of regional grievances, because it would take no time at all for the rest of England to tire of hearing from Southerners about how they pay for the whole country. [/quote] I think the rest of the country is already tired of hearing from southerners full stop. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/west-lothian-question-conservative-dominated-england/538159/11 "2010-05-07T15:26:04Z")
> [@edinbourgeoise](#): > > It’s worth bearing in mind that the Con. party is not the monolithic behemoth it might wish to be. There are your anti-Europeans who would like to pull the UK out of the EU, there are extreme free-market enthusiasts, and there are modernisers like Cameron who want to appeal to a centre-right audience in order to get elected. Not all of these people are on the same page all the time, but they were seemingly willing to keep disagreements mostly under wraps provided Dave walked the election. He didn’t. Much the same can be said of any large party in our system. Labour, Conservative, even Lib Dems, they’re all coalitions of various factions. FPTP leads itself to “big tent” parties, where the coalitions are within the parties rather than between them.