# Westworld - premieres Sunday (show spoilers as airs) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 1, 2016, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413 "2016-10-01T21:12:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/342 "2016-10-26T17:02:44Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Ford (Hopkins) mentioned that the park is much older than 30 years, it’s only that the “incident” happened 30 years ago. The creaky-cranky robot from Ford’s office was an original model, but it could have been from 40 or 50 years ago (he never says). > > It’s entirely possible that the robots are as uber realistic “then” as they are “now” 50 years only if Ford, himself, benefits from some sort of retarded aging, because the relationship between the ages of younger Ford, who we’ve seen with the crappier non-3d-printed early robots and[looks about 40](https://assets3.thrillist.com/v1/image/1811356/size/tmg-article_default_mobile.jpg), and current Ford, matches a 30 year difference, or a 40 year one (Hopkins is quite a young-looking 78) but not, IMO, a 50 year one. And even if you say 40 years, you’d have to explain why there was a sudden jump in quality from the robots younger Ford is working on, to the sophisticated hosts, all in 10 years, and then nothing substantial changes for the 30 years up to now. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/343 "2016-10-26T17:31:12Z")
I’m wondering where Westworld is located. In the real world, it looks like a big part of the desert southwest. But I heard the suggestion that it’s not even on Earth. Again, we’ve seen nothing outside of the park. But the website to book your trip there mentions this about travel, “Upon booking your dates, our consultants will work with your local port authority to chart your course to the park.” Why would they phrase things that way as opposed to, “Fly to Los Angeles and we’ll meet you at the airport.” Why refer to “local port authorities”? ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/344 "2016-10-26T17:35:14Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I’m wondering where Westworld is located. In the real world, it looks like a big part of the desert southwest. But I heard the suggestion that it’s not even on Earth. Again, we’ve seen nothing outside of the park. But the website to book your trip there mentions this about travel, “Upon booking your dates, our consultants will work with your local port authority to chart your course to the park.” > > Why would they phrase things that way as opposed to, “Fly to Los Angeles and we’ll meet you at the airport.” Why refer to “local port authorities”? Might not be in the US? That would explain that clear lack of OSHA oversight. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/345 "2016-10-26T17:43:34Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Well, if one is married and hiring a human prostitute is considered cheating and using a robot prostitute is not, I can see the appeal, assuming humans of the future still have many of the same hang-ups and moral relativism of humans today. Plus, and let’s be honest here, if a person really, really wants to rape someone, then they could pay the money to rape something that’s not real as opposed to the crime that is real-world rape. I read a lot of Westworld stuff, so I apologize if what I’m saying I actually read here, but someone talked to the showrunners or something like that and asked “what if the guest wanted to rape a kid, then what?” and the answer was a shrug and a “whatever the guest wants…” So even extrapolating that to just wanting to pork a 12 year old. If it has to happen I bet the world would rather they do it to a robot than an actual human… > [@MrDibble](#): > > 50 years only if Ford, himself, benefits from some sort of retarded aging, because the relationship between the ages of younger Ford, who we’ve seen with the crappier non-3d-printed early robots and[looks about 40](https://assets3.thrillist.com/v1/image/1811356/size/tmg-article_default_mobile.jpg), and current Ford, matches a 30 year difference, or a 40 year one (Hopkins is quite a young-looking 78) but not, IMO, a 50 year one. And even if you say 40 years, you’d have to explain why there was a sudden jump in quality from the robots younger Ford is working on, to the sophisticated hosts, all in 10 years, and then nothing substantial changes for the 30 years up to now. Wow, that is paying a lot more attention to details than I did! Good for you, and that’s a good point. However, it’s not that uncommon for a jump in technology to be that substantial. Think of how cell phones have changed in 10 years, it’s a pretty stark difference between my LG G4 I have now and the Chocolate I got my sophomore year in college (which was 10 years ago) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/346 "2016-10-26T17:48:14Z")
> [@JSexton](#): > > > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > > > I’m wondering where Westworld is located. In the real world, it looks like a big part of the desert southwest. But I heard the suggestion that it’s not even on Earth. Again, we’ve seen nothing outside of the park. But the website to book your trip there mentions this about travel, “Upon booking your dates, our consultants will work with your local port authority to chart your course to the park.” > > > > Why would they phrase things that way as opposed to, “Fly to Los Angeles and we’ll meet you at the airport.” Why refer to “local port authorities”? > > Might not be in the US? That would explain that clear lack of OSHA oversight. Perhaps. The other odd thing is the underground operations. There was one scene with a shot of Bernard, I think, going someplace and an overhead shot of the escalator suggested many, many underground levels. To a certain extent, the underground operations remind me of Disneyworld, which has stuff below ground. But that’s because the park is built above ground. ---
**Author:** ![Dogzilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@Dogzilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogzilla)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/347 "2016-10-26T20:32:30Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Plus, and let’s be honest here, if a person really, really wants to rape someone, then they could pay the money to rape something that’s not real as opposed to the crime that is real-world rape. > > I read a lot of Westworld stuff, so I apologize if what I’m saying I actually read here, but someone talked to the showrunners or something like that and asked “what if the guest wanted to rape a kid, then what?” and the answer was a shrug and a “whatever the guest wants…” > > So even extrapolating that to just wanting to pork a 12 year old. If it has to happen I bet the world would rather they do it to a robot than an actual human… > > Wow, that is paying a lot more attention to details than I did! Good for you, and that’s a good point. However, it’s not that uncommon for a jump in technology to be that substantial. Think of how cell phones have changed in 10 years, it’s a pretty stark difference between my LG G4 I have now and the Chocolate I got my sophomore year in college (which was 10 years ago) That was me. I went on the page to “book my trip” and “live-chatted” with a “host.” I asked that question about raping a kid and that was exactly the answer, “Westworld is here for your pleasure.” Here, [go chat with Aeden.](https://www.discoverwestworld.com/#) Ask her! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2016, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/348 "2016-10-26T22:11:17Z")
I just asked Aeden if I can kill another guest. It answered “you can do whatever you like…”. Not the most super robust ELIZA I’ve seen. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2016, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/349 "2016-10-27T07:28:36Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Wow, that is paying a lot more attention to details than I did! Good for you, and that’s a good point. However, it’s not that uncommon for a jump in technology to be that substantial. Think of how cell phones have changed in 10 years, it’s a pretty stark difference between my LG G4 I have now and the Chocolate I got my sophomore year in college (which was 10 years ago) The issue isn’t that 10-year difference, the issue is the difference between that LG and whatever we’ll have \*in 2046 \*(if it even is a cellphone). ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2016, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/350 "2016-10-27T09:32:06Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > No. You are inventing a story that isn’t there. …of course I’m inventing a story. That is why I said "So **if** we are watching two split timelines: \*\*then \*\*White Hat’s story is working towards the “critical failure” while Black Hat is working towards \*\*maybe \*\*“recreating the critical failure.” Inventing stories is how speculation works. I also said: “Or maybe you are right and I am completely and utterly wrong. That has happened before.” So thanks for pointing out “I’ve invented a story that wasn’t there” but I knew that when I posted thanks, and I made it clear that it was just a guess, and I am prepared to be wrong. > [@](#): > > There is no reason to believe that there are split timelines. Well there are, and I’ve posted those reasons and linked to images and evidence in previous posts. > [@](#): > > And the fact that MiB found Teddy tied to a tree after his encounter with Wyatt proves it as the Wyatt story line is new. But that also fits into the split timeline theory. In that theory Wyatt, Teddy and MiB are all occurring in the present, Williams story occurs 30 years in the past. It doesn’t “prove I’m wrong.” Its just further evidence that I’m possibly right. 🙂 > [@](#): > > From a storytelling perspective, it doesn’t make sense to have MiB working on something 30 years before the other storylines as a setup for some big secret reveal. How can you know this without knowing the full story? If you do know how the story finishes, can you send me the details? And also how does Game of Thrones end? **If** the theory is correct, then the “major incident” that happened in the park happened 30 years ago, which would correspond with William’s story if William’s story was happening in the past. What would have a bigger story telling impact: a flashback to 30 years ago where they show the major incident in a 15 minute segment, or if they show what led to the major incident shown over the course of the season? If you don’t want to hear this speculation I’m happy to go back to spoilering it so you don’t have to see it. But someone complained that the speculation was being spoiled, so I stopped spoilering it. I’m happy to do whatever you want. Just let me know. > [@JSexton](#): > > The new introduction of Wyatt is surely happening in the now, as we see Bernard and Ford talking about adding him in the context of the current timeline. William is learning about Wyatt in the park. Strong evidence that is it happening in the now as well. Well you made me go back and re-watch Episode 4. 🙂 William isn’t learning about Wyatt. The original bounty hunt was for Slim. They captured Slim: who told them about his boss (the easter egg) “Elarzo (spelling?)”, and that is who they are going after now. So the theory still lives. 😃 > [@](#): > > (And I too am greatly enjoying this!) Indeed. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Algernon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a183cd/32.png) [@Algernon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algernon)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2016, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/351 "2016-10-27T13:37:23Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > So the theory still lives. 😃 Heh, heh. I am still not convinced, but this is a lot like Lost where one could postulate almost anything and have it seem plausible. There simply isn’t enough concrete evidence one way or another to confirm one theory or the other. As an aside, I am glad HBO doesn’t release a full season of episodes all at once like Netflix does. I like the post-episode discussion almost as much as the show itself. That discussion just isn’t possible when the viewers have watched anything from 1 episode to all 10 of them. It takes all the suspense out of the equation. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2016, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/352 "2016-10-27T15:22:03Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > Well you made me go back and re-watch Episode 4. 🙂 William isn’t learning about Wyatt. The original bounty hunt was for Slim. They captured Slim: who told them about his boss (the easter egg) “Elarzo (spelling?)”, and that is who they are going after now. So the theory still lives. 😃 Oh, huh. I guess I mixed up some scenes. Still: [ul] [li]Dolores meets up with William while fleeing from her farmhouse after shooting her attacker[/li][li]William visits the village that MIB massacred, and it appears to be post-massacre.[/li][li]Dolores is still having memory breakthroughs with William[/li][/ul] Now, it’s possible that 1 and 2 are not actually true, and were intentionally filmed to be misleading. 3, though, is harder to reconcile. It would require that Dolores has been having memory breakthroughs for decades. Which…ok, I guess that could be the case. But it undermines the urgency of the crisis in the show. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2016, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/353 "2016-10-27T16:07:25Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > …You can be good or bad; either way, the game won’t stop you, although it may cut off possible quests due to your actions… Or due to the unexpectedly-early return of some G-rated families to Sweetwater. > [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > …I think the shot of Maeve pulling up the floor and finding all these other pictures she already drew was my favorite scene so far. It’s basically like if everyone else in Groundhog Day started remembering things. Yes! A good scene, and I like the analogy. > [@Simplicio](#): > > …Black hat brings his future bro-in-law to play a game, presumably to have some fun… The reference to Black Hat’s family being “all business” made me wonder if it’s a future-Mafia clan. > [@Simplicio](#): > > Also, I’m pretty sure the MiB can’t be in the future (or White Hat in the past). They spent a lot of the first episode talking up about how they change the game up over the years, moving Hosts to different roles, adding story lines, making them more realistic, etc. But White Hat and MiB are pretty clearly in the same game, with the same characters in the same loops wearing the same clothes. They could be there at different times, but not different decades. That’s my thinking, too, at least for now. Clever editing might be misleading us, however. And it’s interesting to see, in the preview for next week, Ford and TMIB sitting at the same saloon table with a cleaned-up, non-crucified Teddy. I am definitely digging this show, and have been recommending it to others. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/354 "2016-10-31T09:57:07Z")
…and the theory is still live. 😃 What a great ending. Five episodes in: human death count still zero. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/355 "2016-10-31T15:34:33Z")
I’m really enjoying this show, there’s so much atmosphere, such good acting, so many thought-provoking things happening. I do however agree with the AV Club reviewer that it could do with a bit less vagueness and a few more actual concrete answers. What actually motivates Anthony Hopkins’ character? Who knows! As for what (if anything) we actually learned this episode: (1) The conversation between Ed Harris and Anthony Hopkins strongly suggested to me that Ed Harris invested a lot of money in the park 35 years ago, which would explain why he has carte blanche to wander around and do whatever he wants (2) The conversation between the two lab techs, on with a bird, contained a weird reference to something like “you were meant for this, from the embryo”. Any chance that all of those lab techs are also robots? (3) Laurence was killed and had his blood drained and then, moments later from our perspective, was busy with betrayal and nitroglycerin in the other storyline. Support for multiple timelines? Support for there being multiple copies of some hosts? (4) Hosts apparently can hurt guests a fair bit when it comes to fisticuffs, even if the guns won’t kill them. (I think that there was _some_ evidence against the theory that different plot lines are 30 years apart, however. Didn’t the rich asshole brother-in-law refer to his family investigating the park and finding that someone (Arnold) died around 30 years ago? If so, then they can’t be decades off from the timeline that Anthony Hopkins is currently in.) ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/356 "2016-10-31T16:11:41Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > (2) The conversation between the two lab techs, on with a bird, contained a weird reference to something like “you were meant for this, from the embryo”. Any chance that all of those lab techs are also robots? I had the same thought/speculation. But on the other hand, the behaviorist was able to blackmail that third tech with video of him having sex with a ‘dead’ host. Strange if arobot would have been programmed with that kind of behavior. > [@](#): > > (3) Laurence was killed and had his blood drained and then, moments later from our perspective, was busy with betrayal and nitroglycerin in the other storyline. Support for multiple timelines? Support for there being multiple copies of some hosts? It was the next day - the scene of Dolores ‘dreaming’ and her meeting up with William in the morning (telling him she had had unsettling dreams) occurred in between, I think. > [@](#): > > (4) Hosts apparently can hurt guests a fair bit when it comes to fisticuffs, even if the guns won’t kill them. Yes, I wonder what would have happened to William’s BIL if William hadn’t shot the host who was strangling him? Maybe Dolores would have intervened, due to the “Good Samaritan” reflex. > [@](#): > > (I think that there was _some_ evidence against the theory that different plot lines are 30 years apart, however. Didn’t the rich asshole brother-in-law refer to his family investigating the park and finding that someone (Arnold) died around 30 years ago? If so, then they can’t be decades off from the timeline that Anthony Hopkins is currently in.) I think that’s a good catch. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/357 "2016-10-31T16:38:16Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > (1) The conversation between Ed Harris and Anthony Hopkins strongly suggested to me that Ed Harris invested a lot of money in the park 35 years ago, which would explain why he has carte blanche to wander around and do whatever he wants It could be that the Man in Black is actually the “Board Member” that was referenced in the episode beforehand. I’d imagine that sort of monetary support would be worth a board seat. As for the forward motion of the show. I think it’s slightly too early to be asking for answers to questions. It’s episode 5 and they are still building a world a bit. For comparison, Game of Thrones was mostly just foreshadowing and exposition in Season 1 until the middle-end of Episode 6. Then all the pieces fell into place. (I think people tend to forget that about S1 of GoT). ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/358 "2016-10-31T18:02:44Z")
I’ll make a prediction: the first casualty is going to be Logan at the hands of Dolores. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/359 "2016-10-31T18:18:39Z")
I don’t think we have multiple timelines here. The character I find the most puzzling is the young boy. He’s clearly of great importance to the plot but in what way I just can’t fathom at present. Very significant that when Dolores asked Hopkins’ character, “Are we old friends?” he replied, “I wouldn’t say that. No, I wouldn’t say that at all.” He obviously realizes that Dolores is communicating with Arnold, despite her denial. This has to be the most gripping show I’ve watched in ages. I absolutely love it! ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/360 "2016-10-31T19:58:26Z")
If the robot hosts are able to lie to the park staff when they are in “analyze” mode like Dolores did, and/or wake themselves up from “sleep” mode like Maive did, then I predict… trouble. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2016, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413/361 "2016-10-31T20:14:40Z")
Yes. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-premieres-sunday-show-spoilers-as-airs/767413.md?page=19)