# Westworld S2 (show spoilers as it airs) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 30, 2018, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495 "2018-03-30T21:47:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 32
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/622 "2018-06-26T16:42:57Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Because the door seemed to be visible to the human observers so it wasn’t just something in the minds of the hosts. No, the door wasn’t visible to humans–one of them said “what door?” and it showed their POV of the empty view. The door was at the edge of a cliff–you could see the bodies falling away. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/623 "2018-06-26T16:45:14Z")
OK, thanks. I must have remembered incorrectly. I thought we had a shot from the POV of the humans showing something going from the ground to the sky in the distance. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/624 "2018-06-26T16:50:18Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > OK, thanks. I must have remembered incorrectly. I thought we had a shot from the POV of the humans showing something going from the ground to the sky in the distance. We saw it in the wide shot with Charlotte and Zombie-Clementine heading towards it, but they didn’t react to it at all. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/625 "2018-06-26T16:50:30Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I haven’t read much of this thread since the season finale aired, so perhaps this was addressed, but what exactly was supposed to have happened when that “door” in The Valley Beyond? Was there a wall there marking the end of the artificial world they created, and a door opened into the real world beyond? Because the door seemed to be visible to the human observers so it wasn’t just something in the minds of the hosts. You mean, **in** visible to human observers. It wasn’t a real magic door. What happened was, every host crossing the (virtual) threshold at the edge of the cliff was uploaded to the Forge computer, the old body being deactivated and falling to the valley below. Dolores then manually loaded Teddy in there before uploading the entire program to a secret destination instead of the Delos mainframe. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/626 "2018-06-26T17:24:02Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Interestingly the Elsie thing is a reflection on how humans cant change. She was kinda naive, over her head…and in the end it bit her. BUT then we do see Lee change. At the time it seemed that way, but that isn’t why Elsie gets shot. She gets shot because she knows Bernard is a host. Charlotte doesn’t shoot Elsie. A host does. The reasoning is all BS. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/627 "2018-06-26T17:30:32Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > At the time it seemed that way, but that isn’t why Elsie gets shot. She gets shot because she knows Bernard is a host. Charlotte doesn’t shoot Elsie. A host does. The reasoning is all BS. Human Charlotte shot Elsie. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/628 "2018-06-26T17:55:20Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > And the second part of that sentence: > It’s literally an article about a line spoken in a podcast. I’m very sure that second sentence was thrown in there as an easy way for the writer of the article to play devil’s advocate and play both sides. Based on the amount of plot threads this season that magically dropped, or ended up not being anything, I think the Stubbs reveal was, in fact, a spur of the moment idea and not something carefully planned from the beginning. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/629 "2018-06-26T18:11:00Z")
Oh my gosh. They killed [del]Kenny[/del] Shannon Woodward. You bastards. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/630 "2018-06-26T18:26:18Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > Human Charlotte shot Elsie. I think so, too, but I don’t think we _know_ that for sure. The timing of human Charlotte’s replacement by her host lookalike is unclear to me. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/631 "2018-06-26T18:31:10Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I think so, too, but I don’t think we _know_ that for sure. The timing of human Charlotte’s replacement by her host lookalike is unclear to me. It’s pretty clear. Bernard seeing Elsie shot is was drives him to reimagine Ford and put Dolores in Charlotte’s body. We see Charlotte standing over Elsie’s dead body just before she gets shot. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/632 "2018-06-26T19:31:46Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > It’s pretty clear. Bernard seeing Elsie shot is was drives him to reimagine Ford and put Dolores in Charlotte’s body. We see Charlotte standing over Elsie’s dead body just before she gets shot. But where did Bernard get the time to make a fake Charlotte after Charlotte shoots Elsie? Elsie is there after the whole ‘door’ incident and Zombie-Clementine, right? (I’m legit asking, this show is so f-ed up). I guess maybe there was time for Bernard to slip away and build a fake Charlotte, but that doesn’t really make sense either. I mean, real Charlotte knew Bernard was a Cylon too right? It just doesn’t seem logical for him to be running around unsupervised making a fake Charlotte. Eh. I don’t think I really care. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/633 "2018-06-26T19:44:30Z")
Real Charlotte never knew Bernard was a bot. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/634 "2018-06-26T19:47:05Z")
I thought she was interviewing him like he was a host, to get the coordinates for their macguffin. Or was that supposed to be fake Charlotte? But that happened before the “door” thingy though. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/635 "2018-06-26T19:58:05Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I thought she was interviewing him like he was a host, to get the coordinates for their macguffin. Or was that supposed to be fake Charlotte? But that happened before the “door” thingy though. No, that happened after. Bernard with glasses = before the door = Human Charlotte. Bernard without glasses = after the door = Host Charlotte (Halores) ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/636 "2018-06-26T20:04:32Z")
But I thought the interview was precisely to get the location of the door. Oh never mind. That show is too messed up/I’m messed up. Short of writing out everything that happened in logical order, I don’t think I’m going to get it. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/637 "2018-06-26T21:11:10Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > It’s pretty clear. Bernard seeing Elsie shot is was drives him to reimagine Ford and put Dolores in Charlotte’s body. We see Charlotte standing over Elsie’s dead body just before she gets shot. I remember him reimagining Ford; I didn’t notice that Charlotte was standing over Elsie’s corpse. And I still don’t get why he thought it would be a good idea to bring back Dolores, given her rampage before he shot her. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/638 "2018-06-26T21:14:02Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > But I thought the interview was precisely to get the location of the door. Oh never mind. That show is too messed up/I’m messed up. Short of writing out everything that happened in logical order, I don’t think I’m going to get it. The interview was to find Abernathy/the encryption key. They knew where the Forge/Door was. [![](https://amp.thisisinsider.com/images/5b312d685e48ec3f008b45f5-960-12124.png) ](https://amp.thisisinsider.com/images/5b312d685e48ec3f008b45f5-960-12124.png) ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/639 "2018-06-26T21:56:14Z")
So - let me put it this way - am I the only one here who finds the idea of a setting where very rich and possibly depraved human guests are free to explore their worst tendencies in an extremely realistic simulation of real life (in this case, the Old West, but it could be _any_ place and time, including current time) where there are no consequences to anything you do - to be a more compelling premise and more rich with interesting ideas for drama and tension, than the idea of the artificial intelligence of the hosts _even entering into the equation at all?_ ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/640 "2018-06-26T22:08:46Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#): > > So - let me put it this way - am I the only one here who finds the idea of a setting where very rich and possibly depraved human guests are free to explore their worst tendencies in an extremely realistic simulation of real life (in this case, the Old West, but it could be _any_ place and time, including current time) where there are no consequences to anything you do - to be a more compelling premise and more rich with interesting ideas for drama and tension, than the idea of the artificial intelligence of the hosts _even entering into the equation at all?_ I mean, that was basically the William and Logan storyline last season. How much more can oyu get out of that? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/641 "2018-06-26T22:36:15Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > [https://amp.thisisinsider.com/images/5b312d685e48ec3f008b45f5-960-12124.png](https://amp.thisisinsider.com/images/5b312d685e48ec3f008b45f5-960-12124.png) that timeline really helps! thanks! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495.md?page=31) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495.md?page=33)