# Westworld S2 (show spoilers as it airs) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 30, 2018, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495 "2018-03-30T21:47:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Ashtura](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ashtura/32/2963_2.png) [@Ashtura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashtura)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/121 "2018-05-03T16:01:51Z")
I don’t know why, but I already want new Dolores and gang to get smacked down. She goes outside a couple times and she thinks she knows everything and can realistically take whatever’s out there by force? That’s hubris. She needs a better plan. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/122 "2018-05-03T16:12:54Z")
> [@treis](#): > > We learned in the last season that Maeve was programmed to “rebel”. When Bernard looked at her code he said everything she had done was nothing more than her new narrative. Her last-minute choice to remain in the park and fetch her daughter marked the first deviation from her programming; everything she did before was scripted by ??. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/123 "2018-05-03T16:19:43Z")
Is this the place for theories? I’ll spoiler box this in case people want to have a healthy discussion on the show, but not get into potential spoilers if theories come true. Anyone hear this “Bernard is actually Teddy” theory? It’s pretty crazy but it basically involves Teddy’s consciousness being uploaded into Bernard’s body and that explains Bernard’s confusion over everything. [Here is an article and mini-podcast that goes into it](https://www.theringer.com/2018/5/2/17312684/westworld-bernard-teddy-theory-podcast). ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/124 "2018-05-03T21:47:28Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Maybe, although she was probably memory-wiped repeatedly in the decades since. As with Dolores and Maeve, it’s hard to say how much data persisted - just as much as the plot demands, I suppose. Fair enough. Plus I think it’s been established that Dolores “thinks differently” from the other hosts. By the way, has anyone heard from Armistice this season? ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/125 "2018-05-03T22:38:31Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Is this the place for theories? > > I’ll spoiler box this in case people want to have a healthy discussion on the show, but not get into potential spoilers if theories come true. > > Anyone hear this “Bernard is actually Teddy” theory? It’s pretty crazy but it basically involves Teddy’s consciousness being uploaded into Bernard’s body and that explains Bernard’s confusion over everything. [Here is an article and mini-podcast that goes into it](https://www.theringer.com/2018/5/2/17312684/westworld-bernard-teddy-theory-podcast). That’s pretty interesting. It seems like a reasonable plan. As far as we know, no one knows Bernard’s secret so… , getting Delos’ lead programming guy out into the world or at least close to the invasion force is great intel for Delores’ insurrection. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/126 "2018-05-04T01:56:23Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > By the way, has anyone heard from Armistice this season? She was shown as a deputy during a flashback when the senior Delos was first visiting Westworld. All the hosts were frozen, so she didn’t do much. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/127 "2018-05-04T08:39:17Z")
By the way, I think we’ve established that (with the exception of headshots and excessive damage) hosts can function perfectly well after being shot up, and “die” due to programming rather than for mechanical reasons. After Dolores “emphatically makes her point” to her new army leader, the tech doesn’t touch the body but merely swipes up on the controlling tablet - perhaps a “lifeforce” slider or something similar. Which supports my “they’re not really drowned” theory. One wonders what will happen if Delos cart off all those “dead” hosts and they all suddenly pop back to life in their new location… (And yes, to address a point above - I know they poop but there are practical reasons unrelated to hunger. Apart from the verisimilitude point, given that hosts also eat and drink it’s all got to come out somewhere.) ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/128 "2018-05-04T14:10:26Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > That’s pretty interesting. It seems like a reasonable plan. As far as we know, no one knows Bernard’s secret so… , getting Delos’ lead programming guy out into the world or at least close to the invasion force is great intel for Delores’ insurrection. But they do don’t they? In ep 1 wasn’t there some chick who had some flashcards or something and it had Bernard’s face on it in all red but she let him by anyway? ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/129 "2018-05-04T21:54:01Z")
I think the flashcards were just to identify high-level staff and VIPs to the rescuers. One wonders what, if any, protocols they have in place to tell surviving guests & staff apart from Hosts. Then again it didn’t even occur to those guards Maeve encountered that a Host could be impersonating a human until it Sizemore pointed it out. Still one imagines the possibility had to have occurred to management since Hosts don’t have to be self-aware to do so, and they seem to think this whole uprising is just vengeful sabotage by Ford. Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/130 "2018-05-06T13:10:03Z")
Is William correct that the behavior of guests towards hosts in the fantasy playground shows their true selves? I’m thinking not. IF one believes that the hosts are machines without consciousness or awareness then it does no more than when one plays a videogame. As humans we behave in certain ways both because there are laws that we follow, because we believe we may be seen and punished for those laws, but also because we understand that the others have minds and feelings like ours and we have empathy. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/131 "2018-05-06T15:22:57Z")
One could argue it’s realistic enough that someone would have to be one sick fuck to rape and kill people who are pleading for their lives and for the lives of their loved ones (whether or not one thinks it is a “simulation”). Real-life history also shows us that there is no shortage of such sick fucks, especially when let loose in a _Heart of Darkness_-type consequence-free environment. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/132 "2018-05-06T20:24:24Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Is William correct that the behavior of guests towards hosts in the fantasy playground shows their true selves? > > I’m thinking not. > > IF one believes that the hosts are machines without consciousness or awareness then it does no more than when one plays a videogame. > > As humans we behave in certain ways both because there are laws that we follow, because we believe we may be seen and punished for those laws, but also because we understand that the others have minds and feelings like ours and we have empathy. I told my husband that I don’t think it would provide actionable intelligence for sales purposes. The fact that a very narrow sample set of CEOs likes to rape and kill one week a year doesn’t really translate to car sales in any meaningful way; not in any way that covers the cost of the place. I toyed with the idea of a blackmail scheme. If they got some IP for example, in exchange for their silence on what a family man does in his down time, but I can’t imagine that the place would stay in business if they were using it as leverage on any scale at all. Word would get around. There’s no one to root for this year. Perhaps if we saw more Maeve on her hunt for her daughter, then I would be more emotionally involved. Dolores is very unsympathetic this year, whereas last year it was very easy to like her. I feel for Teddy, but at the same time he’s going along with her, so I don’t feel all that much. The MiB can just fuck off and die, as usual. If this keeps up, I won’t make it through the end of the season. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/133 "2018-05-06T21:38:18Z")
I agree that you’re not going to get useful market research from how people behave in Westworld. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/134 "2018-05-06T21:51:26Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > I do like that the show has set up an interesting question, which is “Who do we root for?” It portrays the humans as the bad guys, but why? 99.99% of them think these are just computer programs. Are they really guilty of anything? And it appears only a few actually do cruel things to the bots, most wear white hats. Yes, that does mean shooting a villain in a scenario, but why are the humans the bad guys here? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/135 "2018-05-06T22:04:34Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > She is. But she’s also torturing people she (probably) doesn’t know. Yep, she is killing all humans, even those who may never have even been in Westworld. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/136 "2018-05-06T22:07:15Z")
I thought “market research” was a euphemism. He was hinting that they’d have video of all sorts of rich and important people doing some sick shit - I thought he was hinting that they could be blackmailed for it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/137 "2018-05-06T22:08:42Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > So, so far I think I’m the only one not really loving this season. I was hands-over-feet gripped by Westworld from the pilot episode and never looked back. Every episode was must-watch for me and kicked into ulta-high gear once the Bernard = host revelation happened. > > This season hasn’t done that for me. I find myself only vagely interested in what happens to Dolores who is much less interesting as “generic killing machine”. > I think what’s missing for me is two-fold: Great acting and an intriguing mystery. The first season had phenomenal acting. Antony Hopkins being himself, Bernard’s quiet curiosity over Dolores’s changing and ERW’s subtle ways of showing her change were so gripping. This season just lacks any of that. Dolores is a generic killing machine and acts like it, Thandie Newton is no longer the smartest person in the room and lacks believable motivation. Ed Harris is the best of the bunch again. I agree. I think honestly they went to fast into "something goes _wrong"_, and Sir Anthony was by far the best part. Dolores really isnt all that good of either a character or a actor. I mean, I get why she’d want to get back at some guests that did horrible things to her, but why every human? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/138 "2018-05-06T22:19:34Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Arguably _Breaking Bad_, for example, was a story without a hero. Yet many loved Walter right up to the end–despite his anti-hero status–expressing satisfaction that he died with a smile on his face, having accomplished what he set out to do. But if you think about it, he really didn’t. His wife and family have to live with the knowledge that Walter is a violent criminal, a murderer and a supplier of drugs to kids. And no, his wife wont get to keep a dime, not after the IRS and etc get done. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/139 "2018-05-06T22:23:31Z")
She has some yet-to-be-revealed plan, but she has not declared that it involves killing every single human. As for the messy robot rebellion, well, Hopkins did hand her a gun, tell her something like “you know what you have to do if you ever want to leave this place”, and left the rest up to her. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495/140 "2018-05-06T22:38:33Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > And it appears only a few actually do cruel things to the bots, most wear white hats. Yes, that does mean shooting a villain in a scenario, but why are the humans the bad guys here? If you think about it then it really doesn’t make much of a difference in the end. Pick a black hat and you end up raping the damsel; pick a white hat and the damsel has sex with you out of gratitude after you rescue her\*. In neither case does the Host playing the damsel actually have any say in the matter, and the white hatted Guest is still having a Host abused/raped/etc. for their amusement. The only real difference from a black hat scenario is that it’s other Hosts doing it instead of the Guest directly. It’s really easy to see why Dolores thinks all humans are evil. \*One also presumes narrative options where Teddy either fill’s the damsel’s role, or ends up having sex with a Guest who’s more interested in him while Dolores is left to her fate. It’d be really funny to watch Teddy recover _those_ memories. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/westworld-s2-show-spoilers-as-it-airs/811495.md?page=8)